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TLDR: If you aren't limited by class rules, you NEED these.
We've had SuperMiata Extended Lower Ball Joints on the shelf for a while now, but until this past weekend, we never knew their full potential.
Let's take a trip back in time...
For the eternity of the NA/NB chassis, going back 20 years, if you wanted #allofit handling, you needed to run super low front ride heights to get "enough" front camber. I'm talking ~4" or less to achieve -4* on an NA. We specifically designed Xida's around this parameter. Shock lengths were set based on the required ride height to achieve the needed camber for our racecars. Our "SuperMiata Race Alignment" has been the gold standard in Miata setup for years. It works, well.
Nowadays...
We first added these ELBJs to Maxxis Cup SuperMiata racecars and immediately noticed benefits. We didn't immediately raise ride heights, but once we had the camber, it was no longer a necessity to slam the front ends. On our bumpy local SoCal tracks, the added ride height was a huge benefit.
As part of our prep for Miatas at Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca 2016, we upgraded both Taxi and Deviate to 800/500 Gen2 Xida and ELBJs. Both cars are NAs and are inherently a little more camber-limited than NBs. We knew we'd have passengers in both cars, and we knew the balljoints would give us a ton of extra camber range. So we set the cars up a wee bit higher than normal race-spec; 5" pinch welds. We were still able to hit our camber targets because of the ELBJs, but we gained a bunch of bump travel before we hit the stops because of the small lift in ride height. Sonny, William and Emilio all said the cars handled better than ever, even on a myriad selection of scrub street tires and cycled out junky race tires.
Final straw was Buttercup. We are adding an #allofit collection of SuperMiata parts to Emilio's old daily for the new owner to run it as a dual duty street/STR autocross car.
It got a Big Grip Kit and ELBJs, and we set it up the same way. Being an NB2 street car, its got a full leather interior, stereo, AC, etc... It's a couple hundred pounds heavier than Taxi or Deviate.
Even with 800/500 Gen2 Xida, Emilio called it the best riding car he currently owns, ZO6, ND, whatever, all included.
ELBJs are the "fix" the Miata platform has been waiting for. They're small, they're seemingly simple, they're cheap, but they're super duper effective.
This is not the typical small improvement, "last 10%" stuff that we typically specialize in, these are a gamechanger.
ELBJs are now a standard ingredient in our setups(unless regulated otherwise by rules; like NASA PT)
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SuperMiata Extended Lower Ball Joints (ELBJ) allow you to increase negative camber by -2°. So whatever maximum negative you have now, add 2 more degrees. Most high performance and race tires want between -3 and -4.5° for maximum cornering grip.
I have been annoying Emilio in the ND thread with my brain-dead suspension questions, so I want to see if I am understanding the utility of these ELBJ's correctly.
You used to run 4" pinch weld ride heights to get enough front camber. This 4" is measured at both the front and rear pinch welds? So you have no rake from front to back?
I know the rear suspension has a lot less travel than the front, so lowering it as much as the front probably really restricts bump travel.
So these ELBJ's now come into the picture. You don't have to lower the front as much to get enough camber, so you can now run 5" pinch weld ride heights. Once again, this is on both ends with no rake?
So does this 1" raise in ride height result in 1" more suspension travel in the front and rear or is it less because of whatever the motion ratios are?
I have heard that suspension travel in the rear is most important for ride, both because it is so much shorter in the rear and also the fact that you sit so much closer to the rear wheels while driving the car.
I have been annoying Emilio in the ND thread with my brain-dead suspension questions, so I want to see if I am understanding the utility of these ELBJ's correctly.
You used to run 4" pinch weld ride heights to get enough front camber. This 4" is measured at both the front and rear pinch welds? So you have no rake from front to back?
I know the rear suspension has a lot less travel than the front, so lowering it as much as the front probably really restricts bump travel.
So these ELBJ's now come into the picture. You don't have to lower the front as much to get enough camber, so you can now run 5" pinch weld ride heights. Once again, this is on both ends with no rake?
So does this 1" raise in ride height result in 1" more suspension travel in the front and rear or is it less because of whatever the motion ratios are?
I have heard that suspension travel in the rear is most important for ride, both because it is so much shorter in the rear and also the fact that you sit so much closer to the rear wheels while driving the car.
Rake is usually assumed. 4" would be something like 4.25R/4F. 1" in ride height is 1" at the wheel, motion ratios only come into play if we are talking about shock travel.
Rake is usually assumed. 4" would be something like 4.25R/4F. 1" in ride height is 1" at the wheel, motion ratios only come into play if we are talking about shock travel.
ah, no. Motion ratios vary front and rear through the stroke but average is about 1.5:1.
So 1" shock stroke is roughly 1.5" and the center of the contact patch.
Chilicharger, yes, more or less to your post. 5" for street cars, The race cars still run 4.5 to 4.75" pinch weld and usually no rake with driver and fuel.
ah, no. Motion ratios vary front and rear through the stroke but average is about 1.5:1.
So 1" shock stroke is roughly 1.5" and the center of the contact patch.
Chilicharger, yes, more or less to your post. 5" for street cars, The race cars still run 4.5 to 4.75" pinch weld and usually no rake with driver and fuel.
ah, yes. You misunderstood. I wasnt talking about shock travel, and neither was anyone else. Ride height and travel at the wheel. I was only clarifying that motion ratios only come into the equation if we were talking about travel at the shocks.
ah, yes. You misunderstood. I wasnt talking about shock travel, and neither was anyone else. Ride height and travel at the wheel. I was only clarifying that motion ratios only come into the equation if we were talking about travel at the shocks.
Not sure what you're referring to but his question was specifically ride height vs. Shock travel so yes motion ratios were the point of the discussion.
10-07-2016, 07:56 PM
ELBJ ; Extended Lower Ball Joints
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