Supermiata Twin Disc Clutch
 

http://www.949racing.com/ProductImag...win_clutch.jpg

Just received the pre-production sample to put in the OGK. It's been run in a stock 1.6 and abused for a few hours, now it gets beat up some more. The same cover, discs and pressure plate design have a solid history of reliable use at over 600whp in other applications in drag and oval racing. They're quite over built for your typical 250~300whp Miata but I'm OK with that.

The sample shown is a little over 16 lbs but the production unit with one piece flywheel will be around 15.8 lbs for the entire assembly.

The sample 6.6# flywheel shown has a pressed and welded on ring gear on a machined from forged billet wheel. The production unit is one piece forged steel. Also note the pic shows sintered .250" discs but the standard unit will be organic. The kit will come complete with T/O & pilot bearings, alignment tool and pressure plate travel limiter. No exact price yet but we're trying to the twin organic shipped for under $1000.

Once final testing is complete in a few weeks, we'll start taking orders for all four variants:

* twin organic
* twin metallic
* single organic
* single metallic

Emilio,
Do you have ballpark pricing on replacement friction materials for the clutch discs, flywheel, and pressure plate materials? You know I'm a sad, lonely bastard...and cheap too.

I don't even have the retail price nailed down yet. For now, assume a little less than the equivalent Tilton parts. If you're using organic and only 250whp or so, the steel bits will last just about forever. I'd expect the discs to be in the $85~110 each range. The flywheel is a one piece. Looked at doing an insert but it just weakens the structure and requires redundant mass.

I'll have replacement part pricing when I have the final retail price for the whole assembly.

I'm definitely in! As long as it will hold the power ill take a twin disc Metallic when they are ready!

You know the organic is good for over 450whp right? The metallic should be good for upwards of 600whp. Unless you're drag racing and in that power range, I'd suggest the organic. Lighter and much more pleasant to live with.

murder for hire anyone? i need some quick cash!

Not sure I would be saying that around these parts anymore...

Planning 400 RWHP track only. Metallic is what i'm looking for.

PM me.


I'm interested in the organic shit.

YEAH. Emilio is the king. Next time my shit comes apart, this will go back in. I love sorted.

Taking orders now
 

Taking orders for the 7.25" twin disc race clutch now. ETA around June 21.

Single or twin disc, organic or ceramic friction material.

VISIT THE WEBSITE for more info

ohhhhh this thing is pretty.

Final production version is in.
Single Disc Ceramic version is 12.4 lbs including flywheel.

you have pictures of the twin yet? the ones above and on the site look like singles.

also is there any future spring upgrade option? just asking for posterity.

oh and I saw in the benefits section you are claiming "the twin plate discs will last twice as long as an equivalent single disc assembly."

I dont know if I'd agree. In my experience the longevity is a bit shy of a stock clutch because of the increased number of wear surfaces coupled with a lower tolerance for change in stack (disk-floater-disk) height compared to a single disk setup. You've gotta provide twice the clearance for disengagement and it leaves less room for disk wear.

But hell if yours DOES last longer, that's damn impressive.

The image of the production single now posted replaced the old image of the twin prototype. Exact same configuration so the pics will look the same anyway. The difference is in the cover stanchion height and custom T/O bearing/spacer for the single. The spring geometry of the single is also slightly different to accommodate the shorter throw.

Regarding the wear, that's based on a little bit of personal experience and the more informed opinions of reps/engineers from three different racing clutch manufacturers.

No plans for different springs. I think the disc options will accommodate most user profiles.

you got me beat. my comments were based on a little bit of personal experience and only one multi-plate clutch manufacturer. :p

Single organic version. One of these days, It'll make a really light clutch.

http://949racing.com/server/single_725_949.JPG

Fixed the image link..

That looks great, have you run the single disc assembly yet?

Of course.

Oh, dude. I just got my ceramic twin last week, and am so psyched to run it. I modded the clutch master shaft as per the directions, and put a note on the steering wheel to remember to adjust before playing with the clutch pedal.

The thing looks awesome! Now I just need an engine to bolt it to. Emilio, keep the baller items coming, and I'll keep buying them.

ORDERED: Twin Ceramic!
This shit is so full of win.

http://949racing.com/ProductImages/9...win_clutch.jpg

want

want more

So how do you guys like this clutch setup so far, any feedback?

150ms shifts, revs like a sport bike, discs last approximately forever, and I can still slip it onto a trailer with ease.

Yeah, I'm happy with mine.

+1

In the market for a clutch.

Is the organic version of this thing dead, or just out of stock?

How would the ceramic version cope with sitting in line at autox, climbing on to trailers, etc?

Can anyone give a sense of % increase in pedal effort vs. the stock MSM clutch, which I understand to be heavier than normal miatae. My wife does autox with me.

Thx.

Organic discontinued. Ceramic does everything, just harder to drive than OEM. It is a race clutch and that description is not just for style points. OEM pedal around 18lbs, our twin about 40 lbs.

Kevlar/Carbon discs are here
 

After a lengthy search for a single source vendor that could make the shot peened 4140 hubs, two step bonding and high temp Kevlar/Carbon facings then testing the prototypes (beating the crap out of them), we are ready to release the final product.
In stock and ready to ship. 949 Racing 7.25 Twin Disc Racing Clutch

If you have an older twin and need replacements or want to switch from ceramic to the Kevlar/Carbon, visit our website page for details

Replacement Discs for SuperMiata 7.25" Race Clutch


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...bb9941eda8.jpg

Awwww yissssss.

:party: :party: :party:

Any longevity data yet? Compared to the old organic?

Let me ask you a direct question: Do you really care?

Yes. If they last longer then I would consider switching from the organics that I had resurfaced to these.

Shots fired

No shots. I have a 949 twin disc and am interested in replacement options. Last time around I had organic plates resurfaced, but I know those are not known to last very long. Especially with riveted on plates.

Not something we evaluated. It's a racing clutch. Lasts long enough. More importantly, it works better than the old organic disc and thinner plate system. Even more importantlier, we actually have a bunch.

Good to know. Thanks.

This is awesome, thanks Emilio! I've been stressing how to proceed once I finish off my organic discs but this settles matters. Pretty great pricing too which is even better.

One question, do we need to resurface things going from organic to these or are they a direct-swap?

No resurfacing. Visit the website for more details for those of you that already have our Race Twin.

Do you even torque bro?
 

What is the difference in torque capacity between the sintered ceramic and these new carbon/Kevlar discs? What is the actual thickness of the discs?
Greg

Visit our website for specs

It's time?

New heavier Street flywheel for Supermiata twin clutch
 

We have just added a new 12.8 lb Street flywheel option for our twin disc clutch. We still offer the 5.5 Race flywheel of course.
The intent of the heavier flywheel was to make it more streetable. More torque capacity than any single 9" (OEM 1.8) disc with a lighter pedal. The twin is a much heavier pedal than a stock clutch but still lighter than the high capacity 1.8 clutches on the market.
As a test, we let the clutch out slowly in reverse up a slight incline, no throttle and the car would chug away on idle control without stalling. The 5.5 flywheel is very easy to stall in comparison.
The other bonus is a huge reduction in NVH. The Race flywheel allows every buzz and rattle to enter your back teeth. It's a race clutch, no sugar coating it.
The Street flywheel feels like a normal 1.8 clutch with light flywheel. Quite, not buzzy. The perk is that it will hold 400 lbs/ft and your SO can drive it.

Simple choice between the two. The Street flywheel is still fast revving, holds torque, is quier and very driveable on the street. The Race flywheel sucks everywhere, makes your drivetrain sound broken except exiting pit lane, revs like a superbike and is godlike on track.

https://supermiata.com/miata-twin-disc-clutch.aspx

I am currently running an OS Giken TS twin plate. Any mods required to replace?

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...0af7ba6370.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...c447d2cbea.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...0deb917caf.jpg

This thread is about the Supermiata Race Twin disc clutch, not to the OS Giken. Probably better if you start a new thread with your question. Good luck with it

emillio are you suggesting I shouldn't ask if any mods are needed to fit an SM twin plate based on the above existing install? Did you miss understand the question or are you suggesting that I should stick with the OS Giken setup? No real gains to be had to replace in your mind? Understood if so.

He may have thought you were talking about the diff, not many people run the os giken clutch. What’s the total weight with flywheel? If it’s more than 14.6 lbs with flywheel, yeah there are gains to be had.

I can't seem to find the weight anywhere TBH I would say it is heavier. It might also have a higher torque limit. Any thoughts on mods to the release system (photos above) to swap?

I assumed you were asking about disc replacement for the OSG clutch or something. If your question is "what modifications are needed to swap from the OSG twin to the Supermiata twin", the answer is none.
I'm dumb. Got a question for me, make it unambiguous so it is impossible to misinterpret.

I very much doubt you are dumb emillio, busy maybe. It looks to me that your team have created possibly the best flywheel clutch kit currently available for these cars. Now the English language is the language of business and therefore impossible to make unambiguous! I see the following questions around longevity and support has been touched upon but not clearly answered as yet. I will endeavor to sate at least the questions clearly.

1. How many sessions are you getting out of the two different friction media types you offer currently?
2. When do you anticipate you will run out of stock at the current rate?
3. Have you / when will you place a new order with your suppliers for the frictions discs?
4. Do you expect any issues with resupply?
5. What is the end of support horizon for this product?
6. Are there any off the self friction discs that will work once this product is EOL or will we need to get our own friction media re-bonded?

To be clear the other reasons we need to know this is to help choose between the friction material types and understand how many spares to include in an initial order.

Thanks

The puck lasts forever. If you have to replace yours you will be the first. The hybrid disc where rate is tied to usage. If you are doing autocross starts have a lot of power and grip it could wear within one year. For road racing and more sensible use it will probably last forever.

Everything is in regular stock. If we ever decide to stop making them you could get custom discs made.

Thank you emillio, that spider web of a flywheel you guys have built looks just awesome. My car is way too driveable at the moment with the OGS twin plate...

When you say puck you are referring to the eared center plate not the friction discs, correct?
What has been the feedback on launch control and feel of metal ceramic vs carbon kevlar friction discs?
Can you confirm you have both ceramic and kevlar discs available currently.

Thanks

We were actually involved a little bit in the development of the OS giken twin disc. Sean (at OS Giken) was trying to get down to our weight targets but could not come close. In the end I think it did was 21.5 lb compared to our 12.5 lb.

Call Ed on Monday for more info.

Ed helped clarify the supply and spares availability, par for the course with small companies and specialist products by the sounds. Sean is on vacation at the moment. Looks like the OSG 184mm twin plate is 17lbs all up.

1. What is the reason the site states theses are 14.6lbs all up while they seem to weigh in at 12.5lbs, iis this design evolution?
2. What is the all up weight with the carbon kevlar discs?
3. Is here enough head room to fit sprung discs in the pack?

Call Ed

...Or send me an email.

Would be surprised if the OSG is actually 17lbs all up.

The answer to question #2 is in #1 (14.6 pounds including carbon kevlar discs, as listed on the desktop version of our site). The previous posts citing 12 pounds for the full setup was for the single disc option which is no longer offered.

Not enough space for springs on such tiny discs. Why do you want springs in a race clutch?

For street cred duh?!?!?

Good question, I am working with a ME friend on this installation that consults to OEMs on torsional vibration analysis. Essentially we are looking to mitigate frequencies that gearbox resonances amplify from propagating through the power train.
Stating the obvious I know but reliability and consistency is the motorsport holy grail in that to win you need to finish and the smarter we are on harmonics the more force we can apply to a system within setup constraints while maintaining the same reliability stance. Tuned springs/dampers in clutch plates are a known tool in solution kit for this.

Out of interest, have you guys run a laser tach over the drive side of the Race clutch kit?

My friend, you are way overthinking this.

;) No I don't think so. If one of the setup constraints is the Mazda gearbox then protecting them is a necessary exercise. I have done one my self an know two others that have done 2 boxes in a weekend all with light flywheels and solid clutches. Gains to be had on harmonics for sure.