Adaptronic for me? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-06-2009, 01:21 AM   #1
Slowest Progress Ever
Thread Starter
iTrader: (26)
 
thirdgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The coal ridden hills of Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,812
Total Cats: 185
Default Adaptronic for me?

So as the sig says, I am running MS-1 in parallel on my '99. I have been like the rest of the MS cult, and have had my share of issues with this thing. I have resolved my problems, and then I find more, then fix, and then more...etc. The Cycle goes on. It's like being a member of a party where you feel you are obligated to keep loyalty, but you just know in your heart that what you're doing is BS and you want to leave. Right now I have had this funny little issue where I drive the car and it goes really lean for no reason while driving it, maybe pulling like 10inHg? Somewhere around there, it doesn't matter, all I know is, it never did this before, and I changed NOTHING. It even started idling high (1200-1600RPM) which is usually a vacuum leak, most likely around the injectors. I have heard people say MS correction terms like "reburn your firmware." Does the stock ECU ever need a firmware reburn? NO...I mean WTF. You should be able to burn your **** and leave it go if it runs fine, not drive it a while and then F with it. Today, it idled where it should, and then after about 10 seconds it went back up to like 1300RPM for no reason. I am tired of this ****. Perhaps Adaptronic is the solution for me. A few things though:
1) I could care less about features like boost by gear.
2) I prefer a parallel unit.
3) I just need simple features like EBC, I want to use my RX-7 PNP 460's, I want to use my LC-1.
4) I want it to run ALL my stock sensors including my crank trigger.

What can "the experienced" tell me about Adaptronic. Should I spend some cash and jump the fence?
thirdgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 02:20 AM   #2
Murderator
iTrader: (76)
 
18psi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 36,196
Total Cats: 2,583
Default

I'm nowhere near "the experienced" but I say do it
1) there are way more features than boost by gear which are actually even more useful
2) on a 99+ you can only run a parallel unit so far
3) yes yes and yes
4) it does

I'll let Stein, Zxtex, turboroach, and the others chime in with much more knowledge, or maybe the master himself Travis will grace this thread with his presence
18psi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 08:43 AM   #3
I'm Miserable!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Newcastle Australia
Posts: 38
Total Cats: 0
Default

Thirdgen, I have been using the Adaptronic ecu for near 2 years now, and have had reliable and stable operation (after the teething problems) from the unit. I used the same ecu when the car was NA and now with it SC ( the upgrade was a breeze, only changed the map sensor). They run the later Miatas in parallel to control the alternator with the factory ecu and the e420c to controls the ignition and injectors. I also have a LC-1 and have had no problems interfacing it to the e420c.
Ted.
Tedsmx5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 09:44 AM   #4
Elite Member
iTrader: (46)
 
Stein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 4,812
Total Cats: 138
Default

Yep, it's time that you made the move. It will do what you want it to and you already understand tuning from your MS so it won't be that tough. We (collectively) are starting to get some maps together and it's getting easier. It was a tough go at the beginning but that was just because there wasn't enough collective experience with the units. I haven't hooked up my EBC yet. Waiting to install new, bigger IC first. ZX-Tex has his EBC hooked up and working fine.
Stein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 11:30 AM   #5
Slowest Progress Ever
Thread Starter
iTrader: (26)
 
thirdgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The coal ridden hills of Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,812
Total Cats: 185
Default

I think you guys are absolutely right, it is time. I want to Download the software and check it out first...anyone have a quick link?
thirdgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 11:59 AM   #6
Elite Member
iTrader: (46)
 
Stein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 4,812
Total Cats: 138
Default

Travis has it on Boundary Engineering
Stein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 12:03 PM   #7
y8s
2 Props,3 Dildos,& 1 Cat
iTrader: (8)
 
y8s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Fake Virginia
Posts: 19,038
Total Cats: 407
Default

also check out the adaptronic forums..

Adaptronic - Index
y8s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 12:19 PM   #8
Slowest Progress Ever
Thread Starter
iTrader: (26)
 
thirdgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The coal ridden hills of Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,812
Total Cats: 185
Default

Thanks guys. Hopefully I won't regret this...
thirdgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 01:25 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts: 939
Total Cats: 59
Default

what? It cannot be run in standalone on a 99?
WestfieldMX5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 01:35 PM   #10
Elite Member
iTrader: (5)
 
m2cupcar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 7,244
Total Cats: 291
Default

Starting with a virgin chassis, I too am tempted by this electronic wizardry.
m2cupcar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 02:06 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: somewhere in NoVA
Posts: 550
Total Cats: -1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f_devocht View Post
what? It cannot be run in standalone on a 99?
It can be a standalone but there are modifications to the alternator circuit and I understand that there is also some cruise control / AC functions that are retained by the stock ECU.

FWIW, this is my first ECU install ever on a car. Been around the block with Volvo and we always had headroom in our ECUs to program them to use larger turbos and injectors; but the miata does not allow any futzing around with the code and therefore a standalone / parallel install is the only way to fly. Thus far the Adaptronic has been a great purchase for me. I've installed it according to the instructions and have been getting help from other users on this board. Without their help I would have been lost completely; despite the fact that the manual is well written. There is just something to be said about buying an ECU that is the new cat's meow. More users every day and fresh install data on an almost hourly basis. If I had the chance to do it all over again, the Adaptronic would be without hesitation my choice. It is roboust, the software is stable, and the features are sweet. What's more is that the features you do not think you will want are actually just a new gold nugget waiting to be discovered. I mean really, why would you not want boost by gear, flat shifting, and the like? Traction control and other features will make the car drivable and take some of the worry about daily driving.... IMHO of course.

Cheers,
Prospero
Prospero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-2009, 03:16 PM   #12
Elite Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Saml01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: NYC
Posts: 5,730
Total Cats: 2
Default

Definitely not. If it works dont fix it. Seriously. Its not worth the extra investment if you have a working system in place.






















j/k. You really think im gonna start the same **** again?
Saml01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2009, 09:03 AM   #13
Slowest Progress Ever
Thread Starter
iTrader: (26)
 
thirdgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The coal ridden hills of Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,812
Total Cats: 185
Default

So I am running MS-1 in parallel and when I turn the key on, a lot of times I get the infamous "POP." Does the Adaptronic have this problem too? People also tell me that EBC with MS sucks. I'm not sure why that is, but how is it was Adaptronic? 1 more thing. I looked into the wiring for this thing, so the MAP gets spliced for power, ground, and signal under the hood, and it appears to use the MAF signal to give signal to the Adaptronic. Is this how it does this? This thing looks cool, PNP and wire up a MAP and you're golden, hopefully it is this easy...
thirdgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2009, 09:17 AM   #14
Elite Member
iTrader: (46)
 
Stein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 4,812
Total Cats: 138
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
So I am running MS-1 in parallel and when I turn the key on, a lot of times I get the infamous "POP." Does the Adaptronic have this problem too?
No pop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
People also tell me that EBC with MS sucks. I'm not sure why that is, but how is it was Adaptronic?
ZX-Tex is running EBC. Said it was easy to hook up and set up. He is going to do a writeup soon. I have my EBC ready to install.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
I looked into the wiring for this thing, so the MAP gets spliced for power, ground, and signal under the hood, and it appears to use the MAF signal to give signal to the Adaptronic. Is this how it does this? This thing looks cool, PNP and wire up a MAP and you're golden, hopefully it is this easy...
Wiring is easy - just a couple wires to the TPS and MAF. Check my witeup on installation. https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t32942/ Remember, I had never touched anything electronic under the hood before this so if you have done a MS, it will be a no brainer.
Stein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2009, 09:33 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: somewhere in NoVA
Posts: 550
Total Cats: -1
Default

I have to say that the Adaptronic was painfully easy to install. It was as easy as pie.. just have some good wire handy, take your time and solder + shrink tube your joints and you're golden.

I mounted my MAP sensor under and behind the washer fluid res... it was 5 bolts to take out and then drilled a couple of holes for the MAP bolts and life is good. This moves the MAP completely out of the way and you can route the vacuum lines to look factory and neat.

Also, I tapped into the signal lines coming off my intake that head towards the factory boost sensor. It's clean and works great.

Adaptronic for me?-06292009-miata-turbo-install-038.jpg

Anyhow, my experience is limited with the Adaptronic and I am still making heads of the software and the ******* billion different settings. The car, with the help of many on this board, is running like mad. The first time I installed the map and cranked the car, it was scary. But once I had the car running and around the block a few times... it was just plain cool. Just keep in mind that the instructions are still getting refined each day.

Cheers,
Prospero

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stein View Post
No pop.



ZX-Tex is running EBC. Said it was easy to hook up and set up. He is going to do a writeup soon. I have my EBC ready to install.



Wiring is easy - just a couple wires to the TPS and MAF. Check my witeup on installation. https://www.miataturbo.net/forum/t32942/ Remember, I had never touched anything electronic under the hood before this so if you have done a MS, it will be a no brainer.
Prospero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2009, 08:18 AM   #16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 1,272
Total Cats: 32
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
So I am running MS-1 in parallel and when I turn the key on, a lot of times I get the infamous "POP."
I managed to fix this on my MSPNP equipped supercharged 1600. I was very motivated, as each time it happened it would blow the charge pipe off destroying the radiator fans and/or the radiator itself. The charge pipe was part of the throttled area in my supercharged setup. The fix was to simply set the priming pulse to .1 (basically eliminating it).

Cheers
timk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2009, 10:23 AM   #17
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 4,889
Total Cats: 28
Default

Let me address the EBC discussion...

On the MS, open-loop EBC works fine. I used mine for awhile before I switched over to the Adaptronic. The big issue with open-loop EBC on the MS or on anyo other open-loop system is that it cannot compensate for changes in air density (air temperature) and thus can end up overboosting or underboosting depending on what the air temperature was when it was tuned. In fact a lot of the MS users just use MBC for that reason. This has been discussed a lot on the MS board as you probably know. The MS also has closed-loop control, but those who have tried could not get it to work well and just ended up using open-loop instead.

The Adaptronic has open-loop EBC, and also has closed-loop EBC. But reportedly the closed-loop EBC actually works on the Adaptronic. Right now I only have open-loop working on the Adaptronic but plan on setting up closed-loop next, including target boost by gear. Once set up, the benefit should be stable boost levels despite changes in air temperature.
ZX-Tex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2009, 06:13 PM   #18
Slowest Progress Ever
Thread Starter
iTrader: (26)
 
thirdgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: The coal ridden hills of Pennsylvania
Posts: 5,812
Total Cats: 185
Default

Some questions that need answers:
I have my MS-1 running parallel with a boomslang harness. Let's say I sell my MS, can I use this harness for the Adaptronic?
How does my LC-1 connect to the Adaptronic, do it just use 1 wire like it connects to the MS?
Do I have to use a GM IAT or can I keep the stock '99 Miata one?
If the Adaptronic reads to MAP through the stock MAF signal wire, doesn't this mess with the stock ECU and throw a code?
thirdgen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2009, 09:07 PM   #19
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 4,889
Total Cats: 28
Default

1. Yes, sort of. You can still use the side of the harness that connects to the stock harness and stock ecu. You will have rewire the side that connected to the MS though for the Adaptronic, using the Adaptronic connectors.
2. Yes you can do it that way. The better way though is to connect the LC-1 to the Adaptronic using the LC-1 serial cable. It is easy to do.
3. Not sure about that. Probably, it should just be a matter of recalibrating the sensor table. I would rather just get the GM one and chunk the Miata sensor. The GM sensor is cheap. Plus it is threaded so it can be mounted post-IC (pressure will not pop it out).
4. I do not have a CEL myself though I have yet to check for codes with my ODB-II reader.
ZX-Tex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2009, 09:14 AM   #20
Junior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 104
Total Cats: 0
Default

The loom from adaptronic fakes the maf signal to the stock ecu.
I don't know what kind of components are in the boomslang besides wires? but there is a change that you have to fake several signals to keep the stock ecu from showing fault codes. The loom from adaptronic already has these.

If you have knowledge of electronics (or have good help from a local that has) you can make your own fake signals. Otherwise is is far more easy to use the loom, for NB and NBB cars with BP engine its complete pnp.
martijn is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Adaptronic Install Instructions for an NB Stein Adaptronic 84 12-12-2014 08:02 PM
Adaptronic EBC How-To ZX-Tex Adaptronic 18 05-31-2012 07:06 AM
Adaptronic on stock 2002 NBB before installing turbo Prospero Adaptronic 13 11-15-2009 11:41 AM
ismael_pt Adaptronic installation (DIY harness) ismael_pt Adaptronic 78 05-29-2009 07:45 PM
mounting an adaptronic in an mx-5 1,6L NBFL martijn Adaptronic 18 04-05-2009 05:17 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:40 AM.