Using factory ECU to control idle on NB8B plugin with e420c
#1
Using factory ECU to control idle on NB8B plugin with e420c
Noteworthy thread from Andy on the Adaptronic forum...
http://adaptronic.com.au/forum/index.php?topic=3589.0
Hi all, this request was sent in via email but I thought I should explain it here.
Normally when we (used to) ship the NB8B e420c plugin boards, we connect the 4 jumpers for the Adaptronic e420c to control the idle.
If you instead want the factory ECU to control the idle, it can do this, however it does not have the full temperature input from the coolant temperature sensor, as this is used for the e420c. The aux output 1 from the e420c feeds into the temperature input on the factory ECU and can simulate either a hot or cold condition on the temperature input.
To change over to the factory ECU controlling idle:
1) Move all 4 idle control jumpers to the "Factory ECU" rather than "e420c" (in the picture they are all on "e420c")
2) Change the aux output type for aux output 1 to be "Water Temp", not inverted, not PWM, and set the thresholds to 40 degrees C (lower) and 55 degrees C (higher).
This will basically have two different coolant temperature levels to the factory ECU. It will go into "hot idle" when it gets above 55 degrees C.
Note that this is only required for the e420c plugin units. The Select NB ECUs share the coolant temperature sensors, so all you need to do is move the jumpers across, not change any aux outputs.
http://adaptronic.com.au/forum/index.php?topic=3589.0
Hi all, this request was sent in via email but I thought I should explain it here.
Normally when we (used to) ship the NB8B e420c plugin boards, we connect the 4 jumpers for the Adaptronic e420c to control the idle.
If you instead want the factory ECU to control the idle, it can do this, however it does not have the full temperature input from the coolant temperature sensor, as this is used for the e420c. The aux output 1 from the e420c feeds into the temperature input on the factory ECU and can simulate either a hot or cold condition on the temperature input.
To change over to the factory ECU controlling idle:
1) Move all 4 idle control jumpers to the "Factory ECU" rather than "e420c" (in the picture they are all on "e420c")
2) Change the aux output type for aux output 1 to be "Water Temp", not inverted, not PWM, and set the thresholds to 40 degrees C (lower) and 55 degrees C (higher).
This will basically have two different coolant temperature levels to the factory ECU. It will go into "hot idle" when it gets above 55 degrees C.
Note that this is only required for the e420c plugin units. The Select NB ECUs share the coolant temperature sensors, so all you need to do is move the jumpers across, not change any aux outputs.
#4
I've been using this since I first got my Adaptronic. I was told by Andy and others that it was only implemented for their testing. Wonder why they recommend it now. I never knew about the Aux output change required, I'll give that a try later today.
These are the jumpers on the E420C board for your reference
These are the jumpers on the E420C board for your reference
#6
I'd seen the post on the adap forum, but it seemed hardly anyone had tried it out, but as you've confirmed it works well, I'll try it out. It's easily changed back to the original method if it doesn't work out for me.
#8
I've just installed my adap this weekend and I've set the jumpers on the harness board to allow the factory ecu to control idle.
I went out for the first drive with the adap installed with rapid learn running to start fine tuning the excellent base map supplied by adaptronic. I was frankly amazed at the quality of the map as a whole. I've made a few changes for the map to work with my car (nbb '04, na currently, with no aircon). But the drive was like stock.
Apart from changing the jumpers over you need to change aux 1 to a water temp setting detailed here:-
http://adaptronic.com.au/forum/index.php?topic=3589.0
Idle is spot on so far in all the driving I did (admittedly only 20 miles or so). Idle sits at about 800 rpm, so a tad low, but it copes fine. I may need to adjust the throttle screw to adjust the base idle slightly, but for now I'm more than happy with it.
I've tried loading up the electrical drains that can often affect idle to see if it would make the idle drop or hunt. I had the blower on full, windscreen wipers, heated rear screen, heated seats, headlights on full beam, the lot. Caused it no problems at all. There was a very slight drop in idle, but then it recovers almost immediately.
Frankly I'm amazed. Yes I know the factory ecu is running idle so it should be good, but the fact that the adap is in the mix now made me think there would be some effect. But, no, it's spot on!
If I can just get my cranking settings fine tuned for all temps then I'll just need to let it run in rapid learn for a while to optimize the map.
I went out for the first drive with the adap installed with rapid learn running to start fine tuning the excellent base map supplied by adaptronic. I was frankly amazed at the quality of the map as a whole. I've made a few changes for the map to work with my car (nbb '04, na currently, with no aircon). But the drive was like stock.
Apart from changing the jumpers over you need to change aux 1 to a water temp setting detailed here:-
http://adaptronic.com.au/forum/index.php?topic=3589.0
Idle is spot on so far in all the driving I did (admittedly only 20 miles or so). Idle sits at about 800 rpm, so a tad low, but it copes fine. I may need to adjust the throttle screw to adjust the base idle slightly, but for now I'm more than happy with it.
I've tried loading up the electrical drains that can often affect idle to see if it would make the idle drop or hunt. I had the blower on full, windscreen wipers, heated rear screen, heated seats, headlights on full beam, the lot. Caused it no problems at all. There was a very slight drop in idle, but then it recovers almost immediately.
Frankly I'm amazed. Yes I know the factory ecu is running idle so it should be good, but the fact that the adap is in the mix now made me think there would be some effect. But, no, it's spot on!
If I can just get my cranking settings fine tuned for all temps then I'll just need to let it run in rapid learn for a while to optimize the map.
#15
Well i'm now running on factory idle control....AMAZING!!!
I can lift and lower my windows and rpms dont budge. I havent driven the car to the point where the fans turn on so i cant call it a sure victory just yet but i dont think i'll be disappointed.
sv650 i might just arrange you some sucky sucky from your local pimp!!! Cheers.
I can lift and lower my windows and rpms dont budge. I havent driven the car to the point where the fans turn on so i cant call it a sure victory just yet but i dont think i'll be disappointed.
sv650 i might just arrange you some sucky sucky from your local pimp!!! Cheers.
#16
Well guys got some bad news. The car idles great when cold. I wait a bit for it to warm up. After i get going the rpm does not want to come down lower than 2.1k rpm.
I wonder which of my outputs can cause this or is it something else.
I'll go try setting aux 1 to none. Maybe maybe not...whats "The Select NB ECUs" mean anyways? NBB stock ecu? NBA stock ecu? Something else?
I wonder which of my outputs can cause this or is it something else.
I'll go try setting aux 1 to none. Maybe maybe not...whats "The Select NB ECUs" mean anyways? NBB stock ecu? NBA stock ecu? Something else?
Last edited by triple88a; 07-31-2011 at 08:05 PM.
#17
Something else is definitely fucked up. I just tried running it on inverted water temp, also tried running it on none and inverted none. Rpms drop about 200-300 from none to inverted none or vice versa. The water temp setting doesnt seem to be doing ****. I had the idle valve screw on the throttle body fully closed. Rpms didnt get any lower than 1k however it didnt want to start...made a loud pop out the exhaust. Also when the fans turned on or i lifted the windows..it died.
Currently i left it at inverted 40-55c water temp. We'll see how it will behave from cold tomorrow but i dont have my hopes up.
Currently i left it at inverted 40-55c water temp. We'll see how it will behave from cold tomorrow but i dont have my hopes up.
#19
Posts: 11
Re: Using factory ECU to control idle on NB8B plugin with e420c
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2011, 01:14:10 PM »
Having a new problem with stock idle. when the car is cold it idles at 1000, once it gets warm it starts idling at 2000. no matter how much i close/open the idle screw or add/remove fuel the car makes it's self idle at 2000. guessing it has something to do with the aux 1 water temp 40/82 setting as it starts the go up after 40c and gets to 2000 after 82c
jeff_man Newbie
Posts: 11
Re: Using factory ECU to control idle on NB8B plugin with e420c
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2011, 11:08:38 AM »
inverting aux 1 fixed all. was going to try it before i even saw the reply as it seem logical.
idles better then ever.
#20
Your car won't run closed loop idle settings because the stock ecu is controlling that. The idle tab is pretty much redundant with the idle jumpers set to the stock ecu. RPM's should drop to normal idle of 8-850 when it hits 55c (well mine does). Is aux 1 set to '1 high current 3a pwm capable', type - water temp, pwm and invert set off, low thresh 40 high thresh 55?
Well guys got some bad news. The car idles great when cold. I wait a bit for it to warm up. After i get going the rpm does not want to come down lower than 2.1k rpm.
I wonder which of my outputs can cause this or is it something else.
I'll go try setting aux 1 to none. Maybe maybe not...whats "The Select NB ECUs" mean anyways? NBB stock ecu? NBA stock ecu? Something else?
I wonder which of my outputs can cause this or is it something else.
I'll go try setting aux 1 to none. Maybe maybe not...whats "The Select NB ECUs" mean anyways? NBB stock ecu? NBA stock ecu? Something else?
Might be worth posting your map file for people to look at.