Zoom 3 questions
Stephanie,
Thanks to the responses to my emails. I am excited about a new lower cost fuel/timing option for the NB's. I have some more questions about the Zoom 3but I figured that I would start a thread, as I can imagine others will have the same type of questions I do. I am trying to get everything prepared for my 99 in advance of the release, so that when it is released I can purchase one and get right to the install. That said, here they are in no proper order: Do I have to cut into the harness to install this or will there be an adapter harness so that it is just plug and play? If it does not have a wideband 02 sensor input, how do you adjust AFR values? How does it log true AFR values so that we know how/where to tune for proper AFR's? Does it have the ability to log and view runs for tuning? Any software or PC connect cables that I will need to buy? Are there going to be base maps to start with for a few basic setups? Base map for nonturbo for inital setup? Can we install and get it running on a naturally aspirated car before we turbo to eliminate another troubleshooting variable? Do we need to add a Cam Angle Sensor or does it work with stock timing? How does it pull timing? Is there anything else fuel/electrical/electronics-wise that I will need to purchase to run the Zoom 3? Because 305cc Toyota Supra injectors are readily available for around $40-$50 for the set and 270cc MSM injectors are less available and much more expensive, will you be testing the unit with the 305's? I have been told that the Zoom 3 is rated for 270's max. What actually limits it to the 270's? Is a detailed installation guide done for the first time installer? Thanks, John |
Originally Posted by Stein
(Post 293112)
Thanks to the responses to my emails. I am excited about a new lower cost fuel/timing option for the NB's. I have some more questions about the Zoom 3but I figured that I would start a thread, as I can imagine others will have the same type of questions I do. I am trying to get everything prepared for my 99 in advance of the release, so that when it is released I can purchase one and get right to the install. That said, here they are in no proper order:
Do I have to cut into the harness to install this or will there be an adapter harness so that it is just plug and play? If it does not have a wideband 02 sensor input, how do you adjust AFR values? How does it log true AFR values so that we know how/where to tune for proper AFR's? Fuel is adjusted thru the software, along with the timing, and TPS. Does it have the ability to log and view runs for tuning? Any software or PC connect cables that I will need to buy? Are there going to be base maps to start with for a few basic setups? Base map for nonturbo for initial setup? Can we install and get it running on a naturally aspirated car before we turbo to eliminate another troubleshooting variable? Do we need to add a Cam Angle Sensor or does it work with stock timing? How does it pull timing? Is there anything else fuel/electrical/electronics-wise that I will need to purchase to run the Zoom 3? Because 305cc Toyota Supra injectors are readily available for around $40-$50 for the set and 270cc MSM injectors are less available and much more expensive, will you be testing the unit with the 305's? I have been told that the Zoom 3 is rated for 270's max. What actually limits it to the 270's? The limiting factor is amount of fuel that gets added. So basically with a larger injector, you will be adding less fuel. If you get to the point where you are not adding any fuel and it is too rich, you've just used an injector that is too big. Is a detailed installation guide done for the first time installer? Thanks, John You're Welcome, Stephanie |
It's going to be really fun when this is released and people start exploring the limits. If it lengthens the injector pulsewidth like most other piggybacks in this category, then the limiting factor to injector size will be the ability of the stock ECU to idle them. Then it will be the %age limit of pulse width lengthening... I'm thinking around 100% pulse width increase is the norm here. Even at stock fuel pressure, I think you're gonna have a lot more fuel than you've got timing for.
I've seen several Voodoo users say "FM said they'd never tried larger than stock injectors and don't recommend them". I can't see any reason for that other than they don't want people running larger injectors and turning up the boost without the ability to retard timing... and I don't blame them. That could run into a lot of "Voodoo blew up my motor". On 1.6cars, most people can acceptably idle up to 330's by tweaking slightly the idle-fuel mixture screw and adjusting the spring on the AFM. I'm not sure about the 1.8 MAF's, but they're usually a little better about compensating for things like that in Open Loop. I'm thinking 330's@9-10psi on a GT2560 w/2.5"+ exhaust, and the ability to retard timing... damn if 250whp isn't out of the question. Of course the avearge guy looking at the Zoom3 probably won't have aspirations that lofty... but at least one of them will. I can't WAIT! |
I was kind of thinking the same thing about the idle. I figured the Supra 305's will handle any amount of boost I will want, they are cheap and should idle OK. That said, from emails and on the BEGI site, Stephanie's car is running 8 psi on a GT2860, #3 IC and 3" exhaust for 210whp on stock injectors.
|
This thing sounds like the best low-boost solution for NBs I have heared of yet.
Price is reasonable too. Stein, can't wait for you to get one, I am curious how easy the tuning will be for tech-challanged guys like me...keep us posted. |
Originally Posted by samnavy
(Post 293251)
On 1.6cars, most people can acceptably idle up to 330's by tweaking slightly the idle-fuel mixture screw and adjusting the spring on the AFM. I'm not sure about the 1.8 MAF's, but they're usually a little better about compensating for things like that in Open Loop.
I'm thinking 330's@9-10psi on a GT2560 w/2.5"+ exhaust, and the ability to retard timing... damn if 250whp isn't out of the question. Of course the avearge guy looking at the Zoom3 probably won't have aspirations that lofty... but at least one of them will. I can't WAIT! I have no doubt the Zoom3 could support 220 whp, depending on injectors and hardware. 250 may be stretching it though. Stephanie |
Originally Posted by Zabac
(Post 293391)
Stein, can't wait for you to get one, I am curious how easy the tuning will be for tech-challanged guys like me...keep us posted.
I'm going to stick with the stock injectors. I can't run pig rich and lose gas milage because I highway drive the car about 4K a month. Plus, if Stephanie can boost 8psi on stock injectors, that's good enough for my goals. |
So did anyone ever try running the 305cc injectors to see how the Zoom 3 would handle it.
MSM injectors are 270cc, what size are the 99-00 stock injectors again, was it 240cc? Will the Zoom 3 unit retard timing if it senses knock, and if so by how much. I live in Phoenix and knock control is a BIG issue for me running no IC yet. |
Nobody knows because they still haven't released the Zoom3. I ended up going with an Adaptronic. Installing it now.
|
Originally Posted by Stein
(Post 368032)
Nobody knows because they still haven't released the Zoom3. I ended up going with an Adaptronic. Installing it now.
I myself was looking at the powercard Pro and Timing card but it won't adjust timing if it senses knock and thats a MAJOR drawback for me. Eventually I will go MS when I get the new motor, but for now I'm porting my M45 and throwing a 62.5 pulley on it while being rebuilt and I wanted to tune propelrly for AFR and timing (with a maybe a slightly larger cc injector for safety like MSM units) to maximize my power I currently have, but I haven't put the FMIC in yet and I'm worried about engine knock in Phoenix summer heat and I wanted a setup that would be able to adjust the fuel but also keep a close watchful eye on that timing issue for me, kind of like the J&S but with fuel control as well, and for a reasonable price? Any advice? |
Don't waste your money porting a m45. OMG. Do you have another thread about this? You've got your priorities all backwards. If you want a better setup quit dumping money in your old shit. Seeing how many steps you can take to get where you want to be will maximize the amount of time and money you waste. Nothing more.
Sell SC shit, get a turbo Get a MS Go fast. |
Originally Posted by patsmx5
(Post 368040)
Don't waste your money porting a m45. OMG. Do you have another thread about this? You've got your priorities all backwards. If you want a better setup quit dumping money in your old shit. Seeing how many steps you can take to get where you want to be will maximize the amount of time and money you waste. Nothing more.
Sell SC shit, get a turbo Get a MS Go fast. The miata is my daily driver and when I build a new motor I will go MP62 or Begi stage 5. Till then I will have fun and maximize what I have. And enjoy top down driving in AZ. Since my bearings are shot in the blower it needs to be rebuilt anyway(62k on the blower) so it's being ported for free at the high speed lab as a thank you for me having them rebuild it, I should see about 8 pounds of boost now instead of 4.5, not bad for under 500 bucks. Because of that and the pulley swap I will see more power and the old powercard I have is practically worthless now as it runs SUPER rich and constantly fouls O2 sensors(5 so far) and Cats(on my 3rd one now) because of it so I'm looking for something in the 500-700 dollar range to replace it and adjust for what I have now and maybe rid myself of some of the annoying driving and mechanical side effects from an old, outdated POS fuel control setup. No offense but I'm an ASE certified factory trained BMW tech that has been building cars for over 22 years now(but I broke my back in 3 places 30 months ago so I can't work in the field anymore, but I'm also an engineer so i went back to that now). I'm well aware of what is possible for Miata's and what my final goal is, but thats not what I'm look for info wise right now. I'm simply looking for something a little better than what I have currently that won't cost a lot, add some ponies and solve some quirky driveability issues I'm currently haveing with the old powerCard and it will add to the resale value when I do eventually sell my motor, blower and ECU controls as a whole package when I finally do step up to my complete motor/MS2/Blower or turbo setup when the Vette is done. BTW sorry if I sound defensive, it's a horrible day at work and it's been a bad week pretty much all the way around and I don't mean to take it out on you if thats how it came across. |
Originally Posted by stubbs
(Post 368037)
Wow thats surprising? Most of the posts made it seem like it was coming out 6 months ago?
That's what we thought, too. I couldn't afford to wait any longer. |
Originally Posted by Stein
(Post 368083)
That's what we thought, too. I couldn't afford to wait any longer.
|
Originally Posted by stubbs
(Post 368088)
You couldn't afford to wait any longer? So it's not going to be released then?
|
Originally Posted by stubbs
(Post 368049)
Port blower 450 dollars, do your advice about 7 grand.
DIY Intercooler = ~$200 Parallel MS2 = ~$500 RX7 injectors = ~$125 LC-1 = $199 Sale of MP45 system = ~$1,000 1,799 + 200 + 500 + 125 + 199 = 2,823. 2,823 = 1,000 = 1,823 $1,823 :ne: $7,000 Not sucking = priceless. There are some things in life money can't buy. For everything else, there's boost. |
Originally Posted by Joe Perez
(Post 368148)
Bell S = $1,799
DIY Intercooler = ~$200 Parallel MS2 = ~$500 RX7 injectors = ~$125 LC-1 = $199 Sale of MP45 system = ~$1,000 1,799 + 200 + 500 + 125 + 199 = 2,823. 2,823 = 1,000 = 1,823 $1,823 :ne: $7,000 Not sucking = priceless. There are some things in life money can't buy. For everything else, there's boost. Plus in truth, I'm happy enough with what I have right now that if I have a little more power, maybe another 20-25HP it will be enough to hold me over for me to wait and see what happens in the next 18 months.........see my best friend and I own a house together. Money is tight for him right now but getting better. If money gets good enough he wants me to design a single turbo setup for his 2006 GTO based on an LSX block and forged rotating assembly and a D&D prepped T56.....which means within 18 months I might just have a spare 400HP LS2 motor and a T56 trans both with like 30k on them sitting in my garage.......see where I'm going here? I'd rather spend 500 bucks and be content with my fuel and timing issues for now with what I have before I truly go nuts and spend thousands of dollars that may turn out to be money down the toilet in the not to distant future. |
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:51 PM. |
© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands