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Originally Posted by ridethecliche
(Post 1387961)
If it was the product of work ethic, then most new immigrant families would be loaded.
Speaking from personal experience, my own family was exiled from Cuba during the communist revolution. My father and his three brothers who, had this all taken place in the 21st century US, would have been called domestic terrorists, left the country along with their mother (my grandfather had been executed by the state police), along with basically nothing else. No money, no documentation My father fled to Spain along with a friend of his, while my three uncles came to the US, initially settling in NYC. They were homeless for a short while, took menial jobs, and soon moved the whole family into a little 1 bedroom tenement apartment. My father, meanwhile, had much the same experience in Spain. Within 15 years, the uncles had relocated to Puerto Rico and were the owners of the largest textile importer / distributor on the island, and my father was a physician in the US. |
Originally Posted by Joe Perez
(Post 1387971)
Some of them are.
Speaking from personal experience, my own family was exiled from Cuba during the communist revolution. My father and his three brothers who, had this all taken place in the 21st century US, would have been called domestic terrorists, left the country along with their mother (my grandfather had been executed by the state police), along with basically nothing else. No money, no documentation My father fled to Spain along with a friend of his, while my three uncles came to the US, initially settling in NYC. They were homeless for a short while, took menial jobs, and soon moved the whole family into a little 1 bedroom tenement apartment. My father, meanwhile, had much the same experience in Spain. Within 15 years, the uncles had relocated to Puerto Rico and were the owners of the largest textile importer / distributor on the island, and my father was a physician in the US. Can I ask a serious question? There's a county in Kentucky (Whitley) where 82% of the voters went for Trump. This same county saw one of the largest increases in health care enrollment under the ACA (Obamacare) and in general, the recipients saw it as a good thing. Most of these people had no health care insurance in the past due to costs. Most of them were able to afford coverage because of the subsidies (Medicaid expansion). They had no bitch until the 2nd year when either annual deductions or monthly premiums (or both) rose, then they started bitching. My question isn't so much related to the ACA but more to your story of your family who obviously had the drive and desire for a better life whereby they "decided" they had to do it themselves vs what many on this site would consider "hard working 'mericans" who decided to "Take back America" when the government subsidies didn't cover the costs and they then had to contribute themselves. I have my opinions but will refrain. Link to the Whitley video cause the FB thingy doesn't work: https://www.facebook.com/ezraklein/v...3734606814145/ |
Originally Posted by bahurd
(Post 1387977)
Can I ask a serious question? There's a county in Kentucky (Whitley) where 82% of the voters went for Trump. This same county saw one of the largest increases in health care enrollment under the ACA (Obamacare) and in general, the recipients saw it as a good thing. Most of these people had no health care insurance in the past due to costs. Most of them were able to afford coverage because of the subsidies (Medicaid expansion). They had no bitch until the 2nd year when either annual deductions or monthly premiums (or both) rose, then they started bitching.
My question isn't so much related to the ACA but more to your story of your family who obviously had the drive and desire for a better life whereby they "decided" they had to do it themselves vs what many on this site would consider "hard working 'mericans" who decided to "Take back America" when the government subsidies didn't cover the costs and they then had to contribute themselves. I have my opinions but will refrain. Link to the Whitley video cause the FB thingy doesn't work: https://www.facebook.com/ezraklein/v...3734606814145/ |
Originally Posted by Joe Perez
(Post 1387981)
What's the question?
Why are immigrants prone to help themselves and those people I referred to in Whitley county more prone to look to another savior vs looking in the mirror? Oversimplification I know. Edit: Maybe it's the 'wake-up call' the immigrant faces that forces action. |
They were FORCED, by law, to sign up for obamacare. You can't leave that out of the premise. It was never designed to be cheap affordable coverage, and required subsidization in order to bring down costs. So you "gave" a group of people something they can't afford and youre shocked they voted against it when it was detrimental and not a benefit?
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Originally Posted by bahurd
(Post 1387983)
Sorry, I guess that got lost...
Why are immigrants prone to help themselves and those people I referred to in Whitley county more prone to look to another savior vs looking in the mirror? Oversimplification I know. Edit: Maybe it's the 'wake-up call' the immigrant faces that forces action. |
Originally Posted by bahurd
(Post 1387983)
Why are immigrants prone to help themselves and those people ........
Plenty of Cuban immigrants didn't help themselves and waited for handouts too. I look at their faces every single day. The situation you are in now did not just happen overnight. It's been a long time coming. |
Originally Posted by Ryan_G
(Post 1387987)
Immigrants also tend to have stronger community and help one another a lot which can lead to the group as a whole becoming more successful.
And while I have traveled to a few places in this world and not known the language, I could not imagine having been born here and traveling to South Florida, getting lost in Hialeah, and not finding someone to help me find my way back because no one speaks English. This is a hyperbole of the situation in Hialeah but I kid you not when I say that it is something that could happen. An American an alien in his own country. I work in construction so obviously the majority of the guys are immigrants like myself and I never let them get away without knowing that we are in debt to this country for letting us be here. And they should honor this country by at least adopting some of their customs, especially learning the language. I ask them how disrespected they would feel if some Gringo would go to their country and not bother to learn the language or get used to the food, etc. That question usually goes unanswered and it was asked rhetorically anyhow. |
Originally Posted by Joe Perez
(Post 1387953)
that income-inequality is the product of some institutional pressure, as opposed to merely reflecting a gradual shift in work ethic as a byproduct of social / familial upbringing.
Upon re-reading, the phrase "gradual shift in..." actually conveys the wrong meaning. It implies a change in the distribution of laziness over time, which wasn't my intention at all. There have always been people who are highly motivated and posses a strong work ethic, and there have always been people who are lazy and either possess a sense of entitlement or who are merely satisfied with the state of affairs as they are. In other words: nothing has fundamentally changed. Granted, the level of security, comfort, and material wealth which qualifies as "poverty" has been raised dramatically over the past two centuries (eg: the "poor" today are far richer than the "rich" of the 19th century), but as a matter of averages, there will always be the lazy and shiftless, there will always be the motivated and hard-working, and there will always be the truly entitled who inherited wealth and stature. Like it? Lump it? It's just human nature. |
Regarding Whitley County KY, the largest employers are the coal and timber industry. Obama destroyed coal and the people who depended upon it for their livelihood. The median household income (not individual income) is ~$22,000. I'm going to say that between being forced to either buy obamacare or pay a fine, while not having decent employment that offered better options, what do you expect?
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My favorite news article of the weekend:
VIDEO: Passengers cheer as woman berating Trump supporter is kicked off plane - The American MirrorThe American Mirror Just had the craziest experience ever on an airplane: I’m boarding my flight from Baltimore to Seattle and approach my seat. I had an upgraded seat that I paid a little extra for because of the long 6 hour flight. As I approach my row I smile and motion to the husband and wife sitting in the aisle and middle seat that Imy seat was next to the window. I put my backpack in the overhead and the wife with a very stern voice says to me: “Did you come here to cheer or to protest?” “I came here to celebrate democracy ma’am” … I knew this was going to be a long flight at this point. She then proceeded with: (somewhat paraphrased as my memory allows) Her: “You put a crazed man in charge of the nuclear codes! You should be ashamed!” Me: ‘Well we’re all entitled to our opinions here ma’am.” Her: “And I’m entitled to get drunk and puke in your lap! I’m going to throw up right in your lap! You make me sick! Don’t talk to me! Don’t look at me! Don’t you dare even put your arm on that rest. You disgust me! You should be ashamed of yourself! You put a maniac’s finger on the button” (assuming she’s means nukes). You are a bigot. You should get off this plane!” Me: “ma’am, by definition, bigotry is disparaging someone prior to knowing them simply by their beliefs and opinions. Thank you for being the very thing you preach against.” |
this might be my second favorite:
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and my third:
https://twitter.com/MisterMetokur/st...61320669757440 Shia Labeouf melts down and gets physical with a counter-protester. This is now the second time he's done this. screaming "he will not divide us" as you assault someone that disagrees with you... |
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tolerant left.
https://youtu.be/S1eb9vQ1vAk it's ironic that he hits a girl in the face, at a women's right rally, and the women there defend him. very telling (i.e., the march has nothing to do with women's rights). |
lighting someones hair on fire while screaming "this is what democracy looks like"
https://youtu.be/nnERQIhsCFc |
I love that the anarchists expect police protections
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