Intercooler!
 

Not to beat a dead horse (couldnt find a similar thread) but I am trying to figure out a intercooler setup.

Car will be autox'd, mostly street. Has a gt2554r. I am looking at the Fab9 IC, a Frozenboost liquid to air IC kit, and the CXRacing.

I want good performance, but is spending the extra for the Fab9 worth it on these engines with that small of a turbo?

Ive never done a liquid to air, but Ive been considering it if for nothing else than the cool factor... Are they worth the headache? Ive seen a few L/A setups on here

What level of boost will you be running. That 2554 will be a blow dryer (read lots of hot air) at anything over 12 or so psi.

​​​​​​Mt.net answer, get a precision core IC :)

Trackspeed 350hp Intercooler

I did a lot of IC testing developing this one. The Precision core is a big step above the Vibrant (Fab9) or CXRacing cores.

Air/water setups are done for packaging reasons almost exclusively. We don't have the packaging constraints that would require a W/A setup.

Buy the Trackspeed unit and be done with it.

http://https://www.ebay.com/p/Univer...83410352&rt=nc

You will need to weld mounts. 2”’inlet and outlet is convenient.

Seriously, I have used this IC with great results with very long uphill pulls in the 175 HP range. Less than 20 Degrees F over ambient.

The Precision will be noticeably better? I can pay the $400 if it will be, but $260 with brackets is easier to swallow from Fab9, put a lot of money into my car this month :dunno:

:facepalm:

Anything with a Precision core.

Hey lol, never turbocharged anything before this is a learning experience

Nothing wrong with that. start reading

Just seeing people that swear by the CX, others are saying the Fab9 works great and is a huge upgrade over the CX, and you guys are saying the Precision cored stuff - if it really will be a large difference in IAT that will result in gains on hot summer days, I can spend the extra... But the price difference is enough for the intercooler piping or a nice BOV, so I don't want to go overboard/overkill if I don't really need to, especially considering I still have stock internals and I am debating starting another car project before building this engine

It just needs to be a precision core.

Sav - Whats the weight for this IC?

Having looked at the Vibrant (fab9) cores in person, and tested a better Treadstone core myself, I can confidently say that the Precision core will be far better. You will see consistently lower IATs and less pressure drop across the core. I am obviously biased, but as an enthusiast who's built a few cars for himself and several others for customers, it's always cheaper to buy the right parts the first time.

10.5lbs with our brackets

Meh. I have a Treadstone core on the shelf left over from our testing.

10 seconds on the science of heat exchangers: Turbulent air will transfer heat much better than smooth air (laminar flow). Anything you can do to disrupt the airflow as it passes through the core will increase the amount of heat that you can pull from that air. Google for more info beyond that.

One of the things that good intercooler cores have is louvered internal fins. These louvers disrupt the airflow through the core substantially, which increases heat transfer.

No pic of the Vibrant (Fab9) core from me, but AFAIK it has no fins or louvers inside.

Treadstone core. Very open, no louvers at all. The core is not straight through, it offsets every 10mm or so, but that's a cheap half-measure. It's also how Treadstone (a fairly small company) can build an intercooler that competes on price with Precision (a much bigger company). We actually use a lot of Treadstone stuff in our turbo kits (DP clamps, flex bellows, silicone IC couplers), but their IC cores were a little disappointing. Not awful, just not as good as they could be.

Treadstone 18x12 raw core:
Attachment 228869

Precision core. Tons of louvers here. The inlet is centered on the core so there's also no need for an air divider like Treadstone uses.

Precision 350hp assembled core:
Attachment 228870

Every time I'm at SEMA or PRI I make a point of looking at everyone's intercooler cores. Garrett makes the nicest stuff, but you pay for it. Precision is a close second at less than half the price. Hence our decision to build around their core.

supposedly the newer larger vibrants have proper turbulator placement, but I've yet to see one in person

If you can get the precision cooler do so. I have the CX Racing IC and just looking at the pics the precision has it beat. Looking at the data it's no contest. CX Racing IC is amazing for the price because it is so cheap. It's adequate for a street build or low power build that's all though... adequate.

rocks love them too.

There are ebay cores with the louvers out there. I have one in my car. You have to trawl for one with pictures that show the core, and then hope you don't get sent something different. The build quality is meh though. But I am ok with the trade off for price/performance since I am not building a car that is pushing any limits.

After all this discussion, he still went with Fab9.

Yeah, I just saw the inside of the new Fab9. If I need to get another down the road, I can always buy another one...

:vash:

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...4b9a5e6a97.jpg

that's the fab9?

they definitely improved it if it is

yeah thats the 350hp Fab9

Mine looks like that too and I bought mine used off chilicharger and he bought it from Bryan before Fab9 was a thing.

Edit: I was wrong. Found an old picture I took of my IC. Guess they did up their game!

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...2548c2fbac.jpg

You're implying that they're all like that. They're not
https://www.miataturbo.net/diy-turbo...rcooler-83205/

I've looked into many of them in person. None had staggered fins like above (which is much better). I guess they finally updated them. I also bought many before fab9 was a thing.

Yeah, I updated my post. I found an old picture I took. Good on them for catching up! Pity TSE didn't have one of these suckers when I was looking.

This is the post you're referring to, right Vlad?

https://www.miataturbo.net/diy-turbo...5/#post1210336

by up game, you mean buy a better chinacooler?

It appears so!

I remember the day deezums found that $50 cooler on ebay that somehow magically had proper fin density and placement, I hit "buy it now" so fast I felt like one of the n00bs

:bigtu:

You posted about the stage 2 updates in 2015 over 3 years ago. Glad they finally updated the stage 1 as well and that 503 got one of the newer ones!

https://www.miataturbo.net/diy-turbo...5/#post1210348

Have any of your test cars or users swapped over to the new stage 1 from the old one? Curious what difference it made for IATs!

So, thinking I was satisfied with the better of the 2 CXRay I/Cs, such as what I had, I bought another one after my wreck. P/N IC0049.

Now the conversation about Vibrants and Precisions is making me second guess.

For the track, I only plan to run about 175 WHP, and I will only be seeing about 10* rise over ambient. Not sure how much pressure drop, however. And for street use, I only get about 20* rise, as not enough time to heat soak.

Big question is if I indeed take car to drag strip as planned, that will be a long enough pull at 220WHP, or so, to let MAT go high. I could just throw in a couple of gallons of 110 or 120 Octane race gas, to keep safe, but will still loose some power, I would expect. TBH, I think the pressure drop will be more of an issue than MAT.

I have attached a log that represents the old and new intercooler on a pull.

Do you think I should ditch this thing and go for a Vibrant (Fab9) or Precision?

My set-up will never make more than 250WHP.

Log with 2-3 flat-shift (same as loaded log):

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...66b9c50714.png

Fully heat soaked, I never want to see more than a 30-35*F delta between ambient and IATs post-intercooler.

That’s what I’m gathering. I may be heat soaked, in that if I held the power the MAT might get to that. However, in this log, MAT goes from 79 ambient to 99, or only 20 degrees F. Hence the question.

79 on that log is not going to be ambient. That's referring to the actual air temperature outside of the car not MAT during low load.

I understand. However, I have found them to be equivalent within a very small margin. Have you found it otherwise?

I just got the Vibrant 12800 on Amazon for $163 and it also looks like the picture above. I will provide further pictures when I get a chance to install it.

Installing my intercooler as I'm typing this, actually... Good density and placement and it feels pretty solid

I meant to cover this earlier, I snapped some current inventory photos of what we're working with here.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/950/4...55db8900_z.jpg


NC Intercooler Core
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/973/4...e3a42a28_z.jpg

Stage 1 Core
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/882/4...0f0f36da_z.jpg
Stage 2 Core

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/945/4...d7e18d11_z.jpg

Yea, the vibrant core I bought last year from vibrant had a dense turbulator count just like that. Seems to be a really good option now.