Mouglie's Engine Rebuild
 

I plan on getting my engine rebuilt so I can boost it but i have never done this before so i've had several friends give me advice as to what to expect.

I ordered the turbo pistons that flyin miata offers and it says 2mm overbore. Does this mean the cylinder in the block has to be bored 2mm for the piston to fit?

Right now i'm looking around town for machine shops to get some head work and see about getting my pistons installed.

Attachment 212939

i'd greatly appreciate and ideas or comments about building this engine
the right way to handle some boost...

yeah, they do overbore so that you can clean up the cylinder walls by boring it out 2mm.

Hey Mouglie, are you Russian?

You don't know what an overbore is and you are planning on building the motor yourself?

Good luck.
I'd say go to a engine builder near you with a good reputation, give him all the parts and come back with a motor you can drop in. Unless you are willing to spend countless hours reading up on shit and learning, and very possibly pulling it back out to re-do once you figure out something isn't right or you loose compression after a thousand miles.

hey sam, are you?

no Sam, i'm hispanic.
but i love the girls from TATU, lol...

crashnscar: i know what bore is, that stuff i'll leave to the machine shops to handle. The only thing i'm taking care of is tightning screws and bolts which doesn't take a genious to figure out (sorry not trying to be rude). I have a main idea of how it works and whatever i don't i will look for help or read. Thats how I learn.

The pistons came out the block yesterday and the main bearing showed signs of wear and tear, not to bad but enough that i have to get so work done to the crankshaft, new main bearing and the piston bearings...

Is it better to buy a new crankshaft or just get mine balanced?

:jerkit: You managed to fuck up the easy task of using a headgasket repair solution which is what prompted this rebuild. I have to wonder if you are capable of tightening bolts and measuring clearances.

the rebuild was gonna happen for my turbo, this incident just hurried the process. I know about measuring and clearance, you use plastigage for that, i've never used it but i'll get some help putting it back together. I'm being extremly careful now, lol...

I asked because Mouglie is the name of the main charachter in a very famous Russian children's movie.

Sam: we got the bear necessities the big and bear necessities, all of mother natures recipies... lol...

If you guys have experience building up engines, i wouldn't mind any advice right about now... here is some pics of my engine so far... i can't do more because of memorial day weekend, every shop is closed...

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oil pan ready to get tapped
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pistons are way lighter than i imagined
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there's a guy here in town with a 323 and wants to build up his engine so he is interested in buying my stock pistons... i wouldn't know what to price them.

a new set of mazdaspeed motor mounts in the mail...
Attachment 212921

comin along nicely

i know there's many that just eliminate the ac but i really want to keep it, so i'll have to place the oil pan on the block and the ac bracket so i can figure out what would be the best location for my oil return line tap. I'm thinking about having two fittings, a 1/2 to 10an and then a 10an to 5/8 barb fitting so i can hook up a rubber line for now. if i ever wanna upgrade to a stainless steel line i just eliminate the barb fitting...

another thing is i haven't installed any gauges and i'm not a big fan of the a pillar gauges, nothing wrong with them its just that i wanted to go with a sleeper style... so i plan on having my gauges installed before the turbo goes in... so far here is what i got.

fiberglassed my whole dash and
wrote what i wanted and where... mock up
http://a427.ac-images.myspacecdn.com...3326ae16ea.jpg
this is where my gauges will be, all angled towards me
and a little bit closer to me and lower...
http://a1000.ac-images.myspacecdn.co...8e741c566f.jpg
here its fiberglassed and i'm just waiting for it
to cure so i can proceed...
http://a700.ac-images.myspacecdn.com...2a39b600cb.jpg

they are all digital gauges except for the boost, they will be behind a plexiglass piece tinted 50% so you can only see them when they are on. i need to finish the hood for it and i can start sanding it for paint. I'm thinking about Flat black...

You want your V1 shoved into the dash?...

I'll keep mine up in the windshield where it will, like, work and stuff.

V1
 

the v1 will be mounted behind the rear view mirror, i have a remote view screen that came with my V1 so that one is a radar and the other is a display. so yeah, i want the display lower so ppl behind me don't see it.


they call it the concealed display if you wanna check it out
http://www.valentineone.com/

so youre going to block the windshield with gauges?

lol... it looks higher than what it will be. its still a work in progress. Total will be 4 inches from the normal dash.

it was placed there as a mock up to get an idea of what it'll look like but the gauges will be lower and a bit closer. You won't notice them when i'm finished... (well thats my goal)

+1 on the number of gauges

fuck i'll quit posting, you retards don't understand a work in progress...

Personally I think its great your doing the dash yourself. Least you have the balls to attempt it.
Are you just changing the pistons , even the 323 turbo had thicker connecting rods and that was designed for 8psi.

lol that takes some balls :giggle:

lol ok dude i say that the gauges are going to be lowered and pulled foward and i get the same comment twice. The goal is to hide them so obviously i'm not finished with it yet. :jerkit:

Mouglie, fuck the gauges, that's another thread, I am concerned about your motor build, what exactly do you plan to do with the new motor. What rods are you using?
Please elaborate a little further, you don't sound like you know what you are doing, i'd ahte to see you waste a bunch of money because you were ill informed or simply don't know any better at this point.

Zabac, thanks for slapping some sense into me and i apologize for getting out of hand...
I'm going with:

Wiseco forged Piston 9:1 compression
Carrillo A-beam rods
FM valve spring kit
New lifters
ARP head studs and main caps
+2mm overbore head gasket
SS +1mm oversize intake and exhaust valves
port and polished head to fit new valves
mazdaspeed motor mounts
Balancing the crankshaft without and then with pistons installed...

I should have all this done by 2 weeks if i get the parts in time.

even newbs can rebuild engines, just take your time and double check everything.

make sure you have a really good (aka, calibrated/new) torque wrench, and torque EVERYTHING to specification. a machinist/assembler where I had my machining done suggested having the torque wrench in one hand and a paint pen in the other. as soon as you torque something, mark it. that way you know everything is torqued with just a quick look.

get some plastigauge to check bearing tolerances

you'll need an engine rebuild kit, if you don't already have one.

keep everything ORGAINIZED and CLEAN. can't stress that enough

get a haynes manual or something similar that actually has instructions on how to assemble the miata engine. you don't want to put your oil pan on before your oil pump for example.

sounds like you're doing the smart thing and having a shop do all the machining of course, you should probably have them assemble the head as well (springs and such, you can do the camshafts.

the hardest part for me was getting everything to seal without leaking, especially the oil pan/pump. don't forget the o-ring behind the oil pump, my haynes manual didn't say anything about it, and you'll need to pull the engine out again if you forget it.

listen to EVERYTHING we say, unless it's obviously sarcastic. hopefully more people will chime in with constructive comments if you listen to my above advice, every person who's rebuilt 100's of engines has started somewhere.

Mouglie buy, beg, or borrow a shop manual. I used one the first time I did an engine rebuild and it was invaluable. Find a good machine shop with a good reputation to do your machining work. Find someone who has rebuilt engines to help you out. If not, do your research. Measure everything twice, check it against the shop manual. Get everything thoroughly cleaned before reassembly.

BTW depending on your horsepower goals you really do not need to sink a lot of cash into the motor to boost it. That is pretty evident if you look around here. Honestly I would consider finding a running stock motor; should be cheaper than building one. Either that or build a modest motor. I would spend the money instead on a good turbo kit and a Megasquirt. You could have triple oversize unobtanium valves and a knife-edged crank and your motor will still suck ass without a good turbo setup and fuel management.

Thanks for the good advice, i do own a manual which i studied over and over before even attempting anything. Every screw and bolt that came out of my engine found its way into a labeled zip lock bag to keep myself organized. Taking apart the engine seems fairly easy, its putting it back together that worried me because of the measurings and torque specs so thats why the machine shop will take care of it. I'm picking up an assebled short block from them, then i will add the simple stuff like the alternator, power steering, a/c (undecided still).
Zx-Tex: i do have a megasquirt and a turbo kit that i've been waiting to install but i always wanted to build the engine first. I have no idea what horsepower i'm shooting for but it better be over 250hp.

Do you mean short block or long block? Short block is without the head. That leaves about 1/2 the work still. Head assembly, valve shimming, intake assembly... Even a long block will still require intake manifold assembly. Not too bad, but a bit harder than just bolting on the alternator, PS, a/c...

Plan on upgrading the clutch.

A suggestion, though it is a matter of taste... Instead of that huge rack of dash gauges, why not just get a double-din screen/pc setup and run megatune? You can display whatever you want and it will be a lot cleaner looking.

i like the idea of the double din computer and running megatune, the gauges have a power switch so i can turn the display on and of, i'm only useing for of the fiberglass wholes, the other two gauges will be mounted in separate location.

The engine, i'm about to meet the shop owner so we can go through my list and see how much he will charge me as far as labor and some parts that he can get me cheaper... I said shortblock, i've never built an engine but i've pulled heads of and installed them myself, i'm mechanically inclined. I can do the intake manifold and stuff like that, its just that i don't wanna go through the deal of measuring the clearance, if my clearance is of the machine shop can do something about it rather than me wasting time on it.
I'll post tonight some of his price quotes for comments...

the only quote i got solid from him is porting and polishing the head for $450.

'grats on diving in... not like people, be it hobbyist or pro mechanic, learns to do engine work on a computer simulator. (granted, if we're lucky, we start on a junk block...)

Two tips that will save you some grief... torque wrench is really only "necessary" on heads and caps, but you do need one if you're doing those. Don't waste your money on a beam type; a $50 unit will work just as well as a $300 snap-on, but even brand new, it may not be calibrated. (They can lose calibration just sitting on a shelf; drop it, and there's a good chance you just lost accuracy.) But the most important part, besides not using it to loosen nuts, is make sure you're in the upper 80% of its range. A 100 ft-lb torque wrench is next to useless at 15 ft-lb; the rated accuracy doesn't start to count until you hit 20 ft-lb.

Second? Avoid 12-point like the plague. Only time to ever use a 12-pt socket, wrench, etc., is if the nut/bolt/etc. requires it. Always use 6pt. (12pt will strip on a good day, and cause pain when it flies loose, every other day.)

thanks for the good advice macker,
i finally got all my parts, sweeeeeet!!! freaken wiseco pistons came with a ceramic coating on the sides and the carrillo pistons are so cool, i took everything to the machine shop last night and today i get the bad news...

"Mouglie, your crank was missing its thrust washers, by the damage cause its been bad for a while, this allowed the crankshaft to have alot of play and rubbed on the inner edges of the main caps and engine block... enough to where your whole engine is crap. You need a new block."


There goes my happy moment. Now i'm looking at the Kia 1.6 block to see if its similar... there's no miatas here in the local junk yards... :(

The infamous #4 thrust bearing failure? I thought that was on later models...

kia engines, yummy

http://www.flyinmiata.com/projects/O...OTC_engine.jpg

I think its only the 1.8 that works with our cars. could be wrong

For the amount you spent on the head studs you should be able to find a decent block. Do you have any spec miata racers or shops nearby? They usually have a shit ton. I've probably got a spare block laying around but it wouldn't be worth it to ship.

PM sent BenR.
The kia 1.8 is swappable but i read online that the Kia Sephia has a 1.6 DOHC 95-97models that have the same size pistons, timing belt, and several parts like this. Only difference is the head, but i don't know if this block has the same motor mount holes or places for brackets etc...

dude....CRAIGSLIST, and classifieds....Blocks are fairly easy to come by..its the shiping that kills you..

Also, dunno how crazy you wanna go, and maybe I shouldnt even suggest it, BUT perhaps a 1.8 swap is in order??

Lastly, might not hurt to get a 2nd person to look at it?

GL man...

Ouch man. Thats rough. Those thrust washers are a pretty shitty design. :(

I did have the option of going with the 1.8L but it was a Kia engine for $300... but i can't do that since i already have all the parts for a 1.6, turbo, manifold, megasquirt, internals... etc...

I saw the block myself, it seems like it can still run and go back in the car but if you spent all this money on parts, the last thing you wanna do is put it in a damaged block...

I'm really bummed out with the whole turbo stuff, its been my goal for so long and everytime i get this close, it all just slips away. I went over my budget so i'm picking up the block tomorrow and putting this whole thing on hold for 2 more months unless i can find a block for around $200 or less....

search the bigger area craigslist. I've seen at least 2 complete 1.6s selling for 100 dollars. May just end up paying shipping.

i found a block for $100... my car is a 93 and i know this is known as the long nose crank...

my question is, are the blocks the same just different crank? Is there a way of telling a short nose from a long nose engine from seeing the block by itself (no crank pulley nor crank)

I've seen a vin stamp on the intake side of my engine before, I know its there. Match that up to this;

Taken from the historic SNC page on m.net - http://www.miata.net/garage/crankshaft.html

Also, I'm 99% sure everything you got for your original 1.6 should work fine with any other 1.6, short nose crank or not. IIRC the only difference between them are specific to the crankshaft and its components. I see the ATI damper pulley for example does not work with the SNC cars. But things such as the rods, pistons, valves, should be the same.

Check the vin and ask FM. I'm sure they could clarify everything for you.

Vash-

The blocks are identical between the short and long nose crank. The only differences are the nose of the crank and the pullys. You should take it all to the machine shop and have them clean and polish it all up, measure everything, and tell you what bearings to use.

Make sure you are extremely careful with the bearing surfaces of the crank. Don't let anything touch or scratch it in any way.



BTW, I never got a PM?

update
 

wow its been a while since i last updated this thread. i wanted to start a new thread so i could start fresh but lets just skip all the above and move on...lol...

here is some damage on the main cap cause by the thrust washer failure...
Attachment 211118
Attachment 211119

i picked up a new (old) 93 1.6 block (on the left)
Attachment 211120

took it to the machine shop and got it bored for $140
Attachment 211121

it still needs to be hot tanked and what not, meanwhile i ported the cylinder head on the intake side...
Attachment 211115

and the exhaust side...
Attachment 211116

and smoothed out some edges...
Attachment 211117

and this picture is to show the imperfections of the head that i had to shave of.
Attachment 211114

i wish i had time to do this. nice.

Just get yourself some headgasket repair in a bottle and throw it in your oil and you'll have all the time you ever need :bigtu:


Sorry Mouglie...had to be said.

lol... i got some left over if anyone needs some...

HA, atleast you're a good sport about it.

a bought some dremmel tips, a burr(sp?).. looks like a drill bit but has alot of fine lines...
i'll try this tip tonight to bore the intake side of the cylinder head...

a little side by side comparison,
Attachment 211099

more work....
Attachment 211097

Don't give up - or listen to the jerks.
 

You should be able to find a short block for a reasonable amount of money.
try searching on car-parts.com to find parts recyclers near you.

I'm taking a 9 hour round trip drive to pick up some seats and my 1.8. Don't be afraid to go for a drive to get your block.

That said, building a motor starts with the machinist and ends with you.
1) Have the machine shop do the head work. It'll save you some major pain.
2)Buy a quality torque wrench. I'm fond of the clicker style these days.
3)Buy a good engine build manual - or buy two and compare the specs! Sometimes they contain omissions or errors.
4)Read through the build process and picture the whole thing in your head before you try.
5)Take your time building it. Don't build it when you're tired!

Good luck!

I'm not impressed by the jerks on the board who waste posts belittling people. It looks like you'll have a pretty impressive dash if you're any good at finishing fiberglass work!

One other thing: You should probably find yourself a decent 1.6 long block and drop it in there to run while you build the new engine up! That way you'll keep from rushing the new engine and if you screw up your turbo install, you'll only risk an old engine.

Oh yea, i forgot about your mega-transformers dashboard, how's that coming along?

Thanks, i found one a couple weeks back, had to drive 6hrs roundtrip for it...

the machine shop has already bored the block and ported the valve seats for my FM valves... the block should be assembled by saturday. I'm porting and polishing my cylinder head to save me the money, once i finish, the machine shop will install the valves, springs, lifters, all the good stuff. Wednesday i pick up the engine... all i need to do is swap the oil pan for the one that i tapped already, valve cover, alternator... intake manifold, etc...
i'll post a pic to show an example
of what i've done...
good advice Willo, i did think about it but i have 2 more cars... all i do is go to work and home to my garage. Work on the miata for 2 or 3 hrs a day and call it a good day. I plan on running the car first on just engine to make sure everything is working fine... once convinced, the turbo install will begin...
Once again thanks for your post.

here is a pod made for a friend...

Attachment 211093
Attachment 211094
Attachment 211095

mega-transformer
 

hahaa you should check out my "mega-transformers" rear wide body fenders...
i'll post that later...

We need more Transformers dash pictures...