huesmann

iTrader: (1)

Where can you get a $200 MS3 kit?

skylinecalvin

iTrader: (2)

He meant if you could buy a Speeduino for $200, might as well spend another $300 and get a diymspnp pro

andym

I downloaded their firmware and basetune and I am not pleased with the features it gives. If I was building purely a non street driven car and wanted to do so on the cheap, it seems decent. For a car that I plan to drive on the street it would be a hard pass for me.

On the speeduino there is no closed loop initial targets for the iacv. There are no idle ve, idle advance, or rpm timing correction to add or retard timing to give a more stable idle. I don't even see an ac idle up feature. Those are all features that are important to me. It does however offer vvt control so for that feature alone I would consider it over a ms2 for a track car that would use a vvt motor. But for a car that keeps ac or that goes on the streets it still seems like the ms3 would be better in every way besides price.

pakmx5

iTrader: (2)

^ this. Very little control outside of bare necessities which I wouldnt recommend for a car you drive often or on the street. Spend a little more and get an ms2 at the very least. I wouldnt even say the speeduino is between an ms2 and ms3 even if it has VVT control, it lacks many other features.

also a DIYPNP Pro is not $500. a unassembled DIYPNP MS2 is right around $500. a pre-assembled is about $200 more. MS3 is about 900-1100. Pro is 1,200+.

Full_Tilt_Boogie

iTrader: (1)

Id say nowadays DIYPNP is bare minimum. There are lots of things youre missing when running the microsquirt board, but its at a great price point, and has enough to work well. I love the idea of speeduino, and I would like to fool around with one, but for a street Miata Id say bottom/minimum tier is DIYPNP. Anything less is going to be disappointing.

SpartanSV

I got my speeduino installed in my 98 f150 around a week ago. Currently fuel only. Will add ignition control at a later date. So far it's been great. I definitely wouldn't want to run one in a stand alone miata application but it has its place.

L337TurboZ

iTrader: (1)

I didn't say an MS3 kit was 200 dollars. I was saying that if the Speeduino unit is 200 dollars then why not spend a few hundred more and build an MS2 or 3. I corrected my original post.

lsdlsd88

1) you cannot compare PNP prices with assemble yourself kit prices.

2) from what i can see ms2pnp starts around 800USD speeduino is 240USD that's more than 3 times the price! "whats a few hundreds more?" for some people, A LOT!

3) everyone has his own needs . its definitely possible to have a perfectly working daily street car, I don't understand the fuss about all these idle features. If I would put a value on adding those functions I'd say 50 usd more, not 560. but again, this is purely Subjective.
out of curiosity does the MS2 have all this?

Full_Tilt_Boogie

iTrader: (1)

You also cant compare a PNP MS to a PNP speeduino. Ive been working with Arduino dev boards and other embedded microcontrollers for many years and I can assure you that its not going to be a polished, easy-to-use, product. Even an assembled Speeduino setup will be pretty DIY, I dont see the assembly of a DIYPNP as remotely difficult compared to the setup and tuning of either of these ECUs.

The DIYPNP is under $500 and has features that I wouldnt want to be without on a street car with AC, varying electrical load, etc.

And yes, the MS2/microsquirt/DIYPNP does have those idle features mentioned by andym. Closed loop idle control, adaptive idle ignition advance, AC idle up, etc.

lsdlsd88

I can assure I'm driving my car every day to work.
I'm more of a software guy, soldering iron is not for me, so only PNP, thanks, and I believe it is the majority of car owners.. the tuner can take care of the tuning, assembling a board is a different matter.

where??

Full_Tilt_Boogie

iTrader: (1)

diyautotune.com

lsdlsd88

sorry I thought you meant the PNP ecu from DIYautotune... not the board kit with components to assemble. again. not comparable.

andym

If we want to make a comparison purely from a cost perspective, why not also mention the ms3 mini that has replaced the ms2e from reverant?

der_vierte

Because it's also 3 times the price...

x_25

If you can't get your car to idle well in closed loop, you need to work on your tuning. I have my NA6 idling perfectly (except AC idle up since it doesn't have AC...) Open loop on my MS3x. For adding or removing timing for a stable idle, you just build that into your timing map, easy. My car sits between 750rpm and 950rpm depending gow mant lights and other things are on. And when it is just sitting there, it is rock steady.

Also, I poked at my friend's speeduino PNP (from AU) and it has everything you need for a basic setup. It will be a good baby's first ECU and tuning experiance it looks like. Only odd things I saw were that the spark map on whatever base map it has only goes to 100kpa and there is no table scaling or 3D or table smoothing options in tunerstudio with it? Though that may be cause he has the free version of tunerstudio?

Full_Tilt_Boogie

iTrader: (1)

Ive tuned cars to idle well with no IACV... That doesnt mean its worth giving up these features, especially on a street car with AC, PS, etc.

noisymime

I'm adding the 2nd fuel table at the moment, which will allow more fine grained blending of things. Doing something similar for the ignition based on ethanol content is a good suggestion and something I will look at.

noisymime

Yep, that needs the registered version of TunerStudio, then you get all those things.

The base map is an NA only one by choice. I can provide a turbo one as well, but those are slightly riskier as people just take them and run without making any changes, which is something you can get away with on an NA, but not so much on a boosted setup.

noisymime

Just in terms of missing features, if you can make a case for something being needed I'll add it. Simple as that. As long as it's something that's adding genuine value and not just handling 1 persons niche setup, then I want to make life as easy as possible for people.
Personally I've never had a problem getting good solid idle on any of the Miata engines I've done, but I can see why some people like dedicated curves for idle ignition etc rather than just using the advance table. AC Idle up was added a couple of months back (though requires a jumper wire on the existing PNP units that are out there).

With the other models, I have a 64-pin NA8 board ready to go, I just need to find some cars to test on. NB8A ones are close, but again I need a test car. NB8B I haven't started on yet.

SpartanSV

Awesome. Not being able to blend ignition tables based on ethanol is currently my most missed feature from my MS3.

I'm eagerly awaiting speedy knock as well. Thanks for the work you're doing.