LC-1 questions.
 

I'm new to this stuff so don't trash me too hard guys!

I'm getting ready to install an LC-1 prior to an MS stand alone. My turbo down pipe has an air sensor installed about 6" back from the turbo. Two questions...

Can I use this sight for the LC-1 or is it too close to the turbo? Should I hold off and install it after the stand alone is installed being the stock cumputer is utilizing the present air sensor?

Thanks!

too close. have a bung welded much further downstream.

I haven't ordered the LC-1 yet so I haven't seen the install instructions but that's what I figured. Thanks! How far from the turbo should I place it? I'll be able to pull the air sensor & cap it and go ahead and run the LC-1 with the stock ECU until I install the MS stand alone?

Wait you have a turbo installed and are still running the stock ecu?

Yes the LC-1 can output a narrowband signal to the stock ecu, I believe by default it is the brown wire.

Yep. Still running the stock ECU but not for long! Thanks for the input. LC-1 then the ECU. One change at a time!

Please tell me you have your wastegate is open and you are not going WOT. Or that you are using some form of bandaids for fuel and ignition.

I am running a Bipes timing controller, Walbro fuel pump with an under the hood fuel pressure gauge and 1.8 injectors. :jerkit: I know!

id say dont hit boost or just park the car.

I say if I had done that I'd have missed out on over three years of autcrossing with this exact set up of which I finished hundredth's of second off top time of day today... The set up works... Could it be better? Hell yes.

If you still haven't ordered it, Innovate has all their documentation available on their website, just like most manufacturers.

C

wtf is this bs with people not running there cars unless they spend 100's on electronic BS come on guys we where doing that shit for years before link and MS came around.

STFU NOOB!!


I was simply asking because he originally said he was running the stock ECU. With the influx of idiots recently who have wanted to run just that and no bipes/fmu I had to ask. Had he listed it in his signature what his setup was and that it ran a bipes/fmu combo I would not have asked.

Didn't mean to piss anyone off. I just meant to convey the setup I've been running has been effective though I am looking to improve on it and make the engine last longer!

Oh... Missed another top time of day by less than 1/10th a second this weekend. I gave it 110% that's for sure so I am happy with it.

you want to put the LC1 half a foot before the stock cat location.

Also make sure you hook it up to a source that will not be disrupted during cranking. I connected mine to the radio ACC which shuts off during cranking. BAD MISTAKE.

as far as instructions go, connect your wires to the gauge and the botton/light combo as the directions say, make sure you have a good 12 volt source, i ran a whole new line from the battery to the LC1, i installed the little thing in the tiny little space right in front of the shifter. I took off the 4 screws holding the rubber boot around the shifter, slid the sensor through there and simply put the boot right on top of it, worked perfect.
. As far as the calibration goes, you do not connect the wideband sensor to the LC1 controller yet, turn the LC1 controller on, the light will blink 2 quick blinks 1 space in between. so blink blink ............blink blink............blink blink.... for 20 seconds, then shut the power off, connect the sensor to the controller and turn the power back on, light will blink slower, after few seconds it will speed up, eventually it will be lit continuously. when that happens press and hold the red button for 30some seconds light will be off when you hold the button, after thats done let go of the button, light will blink once and then be on continuously, shut power off again and install the sensor inside your exhaust, sensor will be hot at this point so give it few mins to cool off before putting ur hands on it. Turn the sensor 5 times the opposite way of the way you would screw it in to add few twists in the wiring so once you tighten it, the wires should straighten out. Once its installed and tight turn on your car and give it a go.
. I dont know how MS uses the sensor however my adaptronic has a 9 pin serial input. The lc1 should come with the serial cable inside the box, it should also have a small terminator plug. The Serial cable goes to the connector that says out, the terminator plug goes to the plug that says in. You will see what i mean when u get ur unit.

Attachment 194627

Attachment 194628

Attachment 194629

Attachment 194630

Attachment 194631

Attachment 194632

No. If I recall correctly, its voltage drops DURING cranking that upset the LC1. Different than cutting all power to it. I've had mine hooked up to the radio and havn't had any problems other than having a sensor go bad, which I can't see being related.

I just replaced my sensor 3 hours ago...

Triple88a.

Thanks for the install info. Mine came without install instructions. I was thinking of running the harness through the shifter opening too being I will be able to get enough length out of it that way. I haven't had any time to work on the damn car lately. I need to get the Lc1 installed so I can get the stand alone ordered!

the LC1 takes roughly 10-20 minutes to install if you fix your wires before you go in the car like i did, unscrew the 5 screws holding the center console, remove the shift knob, remove the center console, install gauge, put the LC1 controller in the gap in front of the shifter, remove the 4 screws hodling the rubber boot to the tub, slide the sensor in there, there should be 2 zip ties on the wiring, put the zipties on the transmission side of the rubber boot and tighten the screws, go under the car find the sensor and remove the plastic cover on it, Turn on the LC1 for 20 seconds, after that turn it off, plug in the senor to the lc1, calibrate it, go under your car again and hook up the sensor in the exhaust, put back the center console and bam, done. To gain access, jack up the passenger front side of the vehicle, not the drivers side unless you welded the bung too far to the drivers side.

Sounds pretty straight forward. Thanks!

It's probably better to continue in this thread than starting a new.

I had problems with my LC1 last year (when i added a DIYPNP etc) that it overheated the sensor (I made the mistake to "upgrade" firmware after the initial tuning, back-graded afterwards). The symptom was that the calibration drifted quite rapidly after the free-air calibration. It started with showing 14-15 AFR at idle and after a couple of sweeps through the revs it started to shoe 18-19 (and TS stopped autotuning thank goodness).
After some more running the AFR got stuck at 22 unless I stomped the pedal to make all the enrichment make it go rich, and then i saw 10-12 flickering past but it still was pinned at 22.
Since I get distracted/bored easily I staid satisfied with the tune I had and just raced the car for the rest of the 2010 season (knowing that I was a bit rich and low on power).

This spring I installed a new sensor to see if that was the problem (the first sensor had seen maybe 8 hours of duty), but it just took two runs to make it behave exactly the same.

The thing I'm wondering, could I have placed the controller in a stupid place next to the lighter socket (in contact with the trans tunnel on the right side). It get pretty warm and it vibrates a lot.
I have cable lengths so I could place it almost anywhere in the passenger area, and isolating it from vibration would be easy.

Or would it be better to go for a MTX-L? Is that controller more "stable" (or is it just the same in another package)?

I need to get this sorted before I start to play with the VVTengine I'm building. Tuning with a flawed WB-system is just stupid.

The power for the LC-1 comes from the lighter socket (no power while cranking, I've seen the problem with low power). Grounded at the same ground point as the ECU (next to TB), with it's own cable.

The MXT-L has different circuits than the LC-1. I have installed 2 MTX-Ls so far and I'm happy with the results. I am recommending that current owners of the LC-1 w/DB gauge upgrade to the MTX-L.

Damn, I was guessing that was the answer...
Oh well, one more thing to order when I order the VVTuner...

Does MXT-L have digital output like LC-1 so I can connect that to my Adaptronic?

If you have an adaptronic, go for TechEdge. They are really stable and you can use the digital output.
I had trouble with LC1's from day one. I never had any problems with the TE 2J series. And I have seen a lot.
Just do not buy a LC-1. They are cheap for a reason.

tell me about it. My LC-1 freezes almost every week on long WOT runs even thought I have new sensor. And this has been going on for two years now....

Replaced the LC-1 with a MTX-L on Saturday and the installation and setup is cleaner and easier (unless you have no space for thick cables behind the dial).
No separate signal ground needed, just decent 12V (off while cranking), a ground "without" offset to the ECU and a signal wire.

I only lack a Innovate default option in TunerStudio. I'm not that confident that the setting for a linear wideband 0-5V = 7.35-22.39 AFR did stick, but the MTX-L and TunerStudio seem to agree (maybe a 0.1 AFR offset) over 12-17 AFR so it's probably OK. The supposed added electric resolution by running 0-5V 10-20 AFR (then why not 11-17 AFR?) is lost when you fail to install the LM-programmer (since the VirtualBox with my XP fail to boot since I upgraded my Ubuntu...).

It feels much better to have the digital reading visible instead of a volt meter that can be off due to my whacky wiring.
Maybe I should place my LC-1 post-cat and there it would probably work without issues, just to spite me...:hs:

Post-cat installation of the O2 sensor is wrong, as any excess oxygen is used to convert the harmful emissions, ie carbon monoxide to carbon dioxide, hydrocarbons to carbon dioxide and water. Also, the breakdown of nitrogen oxides to oxygen and nitrogen will also affect the oxygen %. So the lamda reading after the cat will be wrong.

For any type of feedback to the ECU, very wrong!

For making "use" of a working sensor/dial and maybe tuning for emissions it might not be worthless. The lambda reading will be true for the gas it's measuring :) . Having values both pre and post cat might not hurt if you are interested in emissions (at least you will notice when the cat is gone bad).

But I have too many other things should have done :facepalm: before adding extras so the LC-1 will probably be forgotten.

Can you explain, please?

Dude wat.

I'm not sure why he thinks its bad, but mine has been hooked up to radio power and I've never had issues related to that.

I have seen conflicting reports of whether to leave it powered or not during cranking, and right now I'm forgetting what Innovate's instructions say. I think the gist of it is that some people's controllers have issues with the voltage drop that occurs during cranking. However, mine is connected to the same +12V that feeds the ECU, so it stays on during cranking, and has no problems.

Because i cant tune my cranking fuel for shit and guessing if it needs more or less fuel at -20C sucks:vash:

wtf...

Gonna revive this thread so that I do not need to contaminate the forum with another LC-1 thread. According to the instructions on Innovate's site there are two analog outputs. One of them is a default narrowband and the other is a wideband.

Is it possible to convert the narrowband output wire to output a wideband signal?

I am not using the LC-1 gauge and I need to hook up both the MS2 and the electronic gauge I have to the LC-1 and I assume sharing the same output wire would be a bad idea.

Hook it up using the digital connection?

Yes, you can program the two outputs however you like. You have to connect it to your PC and use LM Programmer.