Boundary pumps, what seal do they come with, pics inside
 

Is this the legit seal that boundary ships with?

If not, what seal is it? I can tell you its as hard AF and feels like a kids toy.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...81477f9924.jpg


Dann

The letters read 'TC', and 'cxlk'.

Dann

Hmmm. Wonder if my giant oil leak on the front of the motor that I installed yesterday has anything to do with that. If it turns out my leak is from the crank seal I will update.

I would contact Boundary directly. They aren't sponsors here and may not be watching.

I hope trackspeed uses a different seal. I didnt really look at mine..just lubed up the inside and installed it. Im not goimg to be happy if i have a leak on first start up

​​​​​​​I doubt TSE uses a different seal if they just sell the pump. No clue if they change to OEM if installing on a motor the build.

Numbers are probably 50,5 for 50.5mm outer diameter. 36.5 for inner diameter.

If someone could measure an OEM seal we could compare.

But its probably the right dimensions. I have an OEM seal at home I can compare to.

The dimensions are right, its just that no one I know recognizes the brand at all and I wonder if this seal 'accidentally' ended up on this pump between leaving boundary and arriving at my shop.

Dann

AFAIK boundary does not modify the pumps themselves in any way other than the gears.

For example I just found that my allen plug leaks. Hopefully not my main seal. I'll know more after I let the rtv dry.

Yes but does the OEM pump body come with a seal installed when boundary gets it?

Or does boundary fit a seal?

If so do they fit this seal?

Dann

Dan, didn't you get that pump from me?

Dropping in to say i am planning on replacing that seal that came with my boundary pump as well - I had a leak at the front and I'm sure this is the cause. Could be, haven't pulled the seal yet - soon™

Andrew I have purchased a few of these from different vendors, and I cant remember who this one came from. I Just want to know if its an abnormal seal or if we did something wrong during assembly because we have had so many leaks on so many builds.

Dann

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...946f9009ce.jpg

I pulled my ATI damper today, just to confirm. pic attached I have a new camshaft seal from mazda i never used when i first put this together - I thought the one that came would be good. Mine came from FAB, but its prob the boundary manufacturer putting these seals in i would think.

This gives me hope. I'll be pulling mine next week.

Motherfucker.

Well, we have some answers at least.

Thanks,
Dann

God dammit. Now I don't even want to start my car for the first time without replacing the seal. Thanks BE. Hope it was worth the $10 that you saved on every pump.

Savington? Any comments?

I bought my stage 2 pump from TSE back in December. Installed it, but havnt started the engine yet. How do I know if mine has a shitty BE seal or an Andrew Kidd approved seal?

Tag for updates. Hope my TSE shortblock won't leak.

Afaik Andrew does not change the seals (he will have a real answer though). And I heard from Travis that they haven't changed anything in 15 years. It might just be bad luck.

You are very much at the mercy of your vendor in many situations. There are times a vendor will change something in design and never tell you until you start having problems. I just put my BE pump on and hope it wont leak. mine didnt feel terrible.

It won't because I just ordered a bunch of OEM front mains and will be replacing every seal in every BE pump I use from now on :hatecat:

Every pump for the last 2 years is probably that design. If they are bad seals, I'll be getting a lot of phone calls. It could be a spot failure, or an issue caused by install. I would also look after your block, if you've align bored the block it moves the crank seal out of concentricity compared to crankshaft (pump remains pinned, but crank center moves).

The only issue I know of with leaking is the high pressure NPT plug on at least 2 units were loose. Which is an unexpected since we don't touch it. We're adding a quality step in to torque each one, so if you do have one my pumps I would highly recommend giving that a snug up.

No we weren't aiming at saving 10 dollars on any seals, if its not a problem we don't spend your money on it. If it becomes a problem we will look at upgrading, but I'm guessing this is isolated. Will keep ears to the ground though.

Thanks for the reply. This one was able to be installed with pinky fingertips at about 20% effort, ie it just about fell out when I looked at it.

Dann

Well, I did 6 units yesterday and we use a gasket form tool and a hammer driving it to pop them in. Usually takes a line up shot to get it started and at least 2 solid blows. I'd give you some serious cred if you could do that to any of the units here.

I'm not sure about this, maybe there were some that were defective? Its not going to be long until we literally have quality every single component on the Miata pump. I guess through volume we're running into oddball stuff at this point. It could also be the pressure we're putting on our casting and components manufacturer. Probably not normal to sell that amount of Miata pumps ever. I will check with them, if you have a sample one and could send it to me I can check it here to see what I can find.

Travis, you are at the mercy of your vendors at times. Some problem they have is passed on to you as we discovered recently with that other issue. Keep up the good work at work at your quality process. Thanks for you quality support and response.

now i'm wondering if that is where my leak is coming from on my recently built motor.

Replaced my front main yesterday. My thoughts echo Dan's. Seal that came in the Boundary pump was hard rubber, very little elasticity. OEM seal was softer rubber, much stretchier. Very different quality.

New FMS seems to have solved my oil leak. 60 miles leak free so far.

Attachment 230191
Attachment 230192

I don't know if Travis's supplier switched on him or something. But as of now I would only run an OEM front seal.

Hmm. I also have a boundry pump and a FSM leak. I'll have to dig into that.

Seems like this is part of a pretty widespread issue.
Y'all should compile a list and reach out to Travis. He's very responsive to feedback and takes customer service seriously, and I'm sure he'd investigate the issue.

I texted Travis when this thread came about, and he posted above. Hopefully he can take a look at it, but as of now I would not use a non-oem seal in a location like that.

I agree with you guys, mine was hard as a rock aswell - Just based off my rebuild / last post in this thread with the oil leakage I'd say this was definitely the cause - but my engine is still on stands so I won't know till its up and going again

With more and more reports, it sounds like i will be pulling it back apart and putting in my spare Fel-Pro.

I have had Fel-Pro gaskets leak on my miata. I only use OEM seals now.

Front main is too shitty if a job to install anything but OEM. Imo

+1, OEM gaskets are not expensive.

i have had great success from Fel-Pro gaskets. If i wasnt in a time crunch i would go ahead with the OEM gasket but for now, i will go with the Fel-Pro.

Can't go to the dealer and get an OEM FMS?

In Australia, even with Mazda being a (the?) leading new car brand, FMS for B series is not in stock.

Dann

I believe that the non-vvt cam seal is the same seal, with a different part number. Might be worth checking out.

Crank: B3C7-10-602A
Cam: FS05-10-602A

FM says it's the same seal for all "big nose" cranks including 01-05.

it will be next week before they can get one to me.

mazda comp should be able to overnight you one.

Glad to know it wasn't me! I had this plus the NPT issue. (Well, my NPT just leaked and was kind of cross threaded in there without sealant) It happened a couple years back. I have a suspicion that this has been on going and people haven't really spoken up about it because this is one of those "parts that should work for everyone" but I could be wrong.

just pulled mine apart to look at it. Looks like the seal has been leaking.

I just noticed the Mazda front seal I purchased from MazdaComp has made in Vietnam on the sticker while every other seal has made in Japan on it. Hopefully no difference in quality.

I have a bunch of idle time and about 30 miles on my fresh build with the stage 2, 1 shim pump and the not-so-good seal that came in it. No leaks so far!!

Attachment 180003
Here she is, waiting for me to put the gtx3071 on after break in

gl. mine didn't leak until I started driving hard. Hope yours is leak free.

Mine has started to leak a little this is less than 5k on the engine since the rebuild.

Will pull at some point and change over to OEM.

Annoying tbh.

Mine leaked at about 200 miles. And by leak I mean made a fat pool of oil on my belly pan. Swapped to oem and never had problems

Hello All,

We did end up switching over to OEM seals. I'm not sure what has happened with the seals we were using, its the same seals we've been using for 15 years without issues. I have sent a request for information from the manufacturer, but they haven't replied.

All pumps we have going out now have new OEM seals, and we will furnish OEM seals if you have an issue.

Thanks!
Travis

lovin' the customer support.

+1. Swapping the main seal sucked, but thanks for taking care of future customers.

Also maybe just an extra twist of that NPT plug before they get bagged up. :D

I have the Boundary pump as well, however I bought mine from 949 back in 2015....really not looking forward to tearing into the front of the motor just to see if I'm leaking oil too. Motor still has under 1500 miles since the rebuild, hasn't seen boost at all. Hmm.

I'm running a BE pump I got in the past year as well. No leaks yet. Fingers crossed.

Pretty positive I jinxed myself by coming to this thread as I have now recently developed an oil leak that seems to be coming from the spot where the pump would be. Haven't been able to confirm but the pool of oil is right beneath the front of the block. There is also coolant leaking, but that is from a rubber cap that has cracked on the old coolant feed to the stock MSM turbohttps://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...2e7ac98ce9.jpg

Had the same issues witha BE pump the seal was the same as here and lasted 1k before it leaked big time. Plus the plug leaked at start up as no sealant had been applied,

Replaced with OEM seal just no fun pulling a ATI damper off with the engine in place. Given the cost of the pump a couple of $$ fitiing a good seal makes more sense along with a bit of attention to detail.

So if your planning on fitting a BE pump I'd pull the seal and trash it.

I purchased one of these pumps about a year ago. I have only driven the car about 10,000 miles, but in that time the engine would leak excessively. A 6" spot in a few hours time and i had to keep oil in the car to add about every other drive. I assumed it was from an ID-10T error, but had little time to get in and fix it.

About 2 weeks ago i finally got brave enough to pull the engine apart, and i confirmed it was the front man seal on my boundary pump. I could move it with my fingers. It was replaced with an OEM seal and no further leaks.

The leak caused all of the rubber on the timing cover to swell and that led to rubbing and deformation of the covers. My once freshly cleaned engine is a sloppy mess, though i have cleaned much of it.
In short would I buy a Boundary pump again? HELL YES! :bigtu:

Yeah it sucked to have a leak, but I have owned 2 Miatas now, my dad has 4 still. We work n them all the time and the fact is; Seals fail and oil leaks happen. Id rather deal with a bad seal than pick metal bits of OEM pump from my failed motor wishing there was a better way.

It is great to hear that Boundary has seen this response and responded well to it. Great customer service.

He just said he would start using OE seals. I bet it was a problem with his supplier.

Need any help? Where in SA do you live? I am nearish to sea world.

True story, they're still great pumps.

I'm near the Forum. I'm pulling the car to Kotzur Racing tomorrow, as we have to weld up that old coolant line to the turbo and finish my IC piping anyways. I appreciate the offer though! I'm sure something else will pop up later on, so I'll shoot you a message if and when