Ceramic Coating Valves? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Engine Performance This section is for discussion on all engine building related questions.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-15-2010, 01:59 PM   #1
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Anacortes, WA
Posts: 2,476
Total Cats: 114
Default Ceramic Coating Valves?

Iím thinking about having my valves coated with a Ceramic thermal barrier. Cost about $7.50 a valve to do.

The piston tops are coated now.

Anybody have any experience with having ceramic coatings on combustion chamber stuff?

Bob
bbundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 03:02 PM   #2
Elite Member
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Central-ish VA
Posts: 4,449
Total Cats: 16
Default

I've had CC and exhaust ports coated. If you are using stock valves it is possible that the coating will stick to the valve faces. However aftermarket valves, I had Supertech, it might not. The coating would not adhere to the nitride coating bonded to the surface.
neogenesis2004 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 03:19 PM   #3
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Anacortes, WA
Posts: 2,476
Total Cats: 114
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by neogenesis2004 View Post
I've had CC and exhaust ports coated. If you are using stock valves it is possible that the coating will stick to the valve faces. However aftermarket valves, I had Supertech, it might not. The coating would not adhere to the nitride coating bonded to the surface.
Good to know. Yes they are aftermarket valves and nitrided. wonder if the nitriding could be sanded off the face first?

Looks like doing the combustion chambers is about $100 think its worth it?

Bob
bbundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 03:23 PM   #4
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (31)
 
Savington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Posts: 14,362
Total Cats: 1,323
Default

Bob, I assume you're trying to avoid burning another valve? Talk to Supertech about whether they can make you a set of Inconel valves. They make them for other applications in the $25-30/ea range.
Savington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 03:29 PM   #5
Elite Member
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Central-ish VA
Posts: 4,449
Total Cats: 16
Default

You burnt up a Supertech valve? Wow...
neogenesis2004 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 04:21 PM   #6
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Anacortes, WA
Posts: 2,476
Total Cats: 114
Default

Picure is the is the first time it happened. back side of the valve looked like a blow torch was used on it.

Second time it happened after compleat engine rebuild rewired entire car new injectors and compleatly different engine management tuned by FM then double checked at another tuner. It burned the other exhaust valve in the same cylinder after it started consuming oil.

Bob
Attached Thumbnails
Ceramic Coating Valves?-dscn0247.jpg  
bbundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 04:58 PM   #7
y8s
2 Props,3 Dildos,& 1 Cat
iTrader: (8)
 
y8s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Fake Virginia
Posts: 19,038
Total Cats: 407
Default

was that from retarded timing or what?
y8s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 05:19 PM   #8
Elite Member
iTrader: (10)
 
leatherface24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Pembroke Pines
Posts: 4,033
Total Cats: 2
Default

wow i cant say ive even seen a more cleaner burnt through valve. +2 on how that happened
leatherface24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2010, 05:51 PM   #9
Elite Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Anacortes, WA
Posts: 2,476
Total Cats: 114
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by y8s View Post
was that from retarded timing or what?
Ive been running the exact same timing and the same fuel map adjusted down to compensate for less displacement on a stock motor for most of the year after the second time this has happend. It hasn't started burning oil or an exhaust valve yet.

I would sure like to know what caused this no one knows for sure that I have found. I think it has something to do with excess oil in the combustion chamber. The only way I can find that it could be getting there is past the rings though. It did not have a huge amount of blow by when it did it either both the pan and the valve cover were vented to atmospere and smoke was not blowing out the breather and it was not filling up with oil quickly. Spark plug would be wet with oil after a tool around the neigborhood though and going hard into boost would send oil smoke out the tailpipe just prior to both times it did this.

The two times it happened were with entirely different ecu's, ignition systems, injectors, fule pumps, fuel pressure regulators, entire chassis wireing, etc. I don't think it has anything to do with engine management I think it is a mechanical issue.

It was being pushed to around 360 rwhp and pushed fairly well on the track however.

Bob

Last edited by bbundy; 10-15-2010 at 06:12 PM.
bbundy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2010, 08:55 PM   #10
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Bay Area, CA and Portland, OR
Posts: 105
Total Cats: 0
Default

How are the valve seats? Most of the heat absorbed by the valves is dissipated into the seat, so if there were some reduction in seat to valve contact area it could contribute to burning the valve. Also, it would likely not be a good idea to coat the whole valve since doing so would reduce cooling ability. Would it be possible to port the head to increase the turbulence in the chamber to reduce combustion time and avoid flowing burning charge over the exhaust valve? Is there any chance that the cam timing might be a touch off, leading to early opening?
gaius49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2010, 09:37 PM   #11
Tour de Franzia
iTrader: (6)
 
hustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Republic of Dallas
Posts: 29,114
Total Cats: 351
Default

There's always copper valve coatings with Beryllium seats:


If you want to go with the ultimate in thermal conductivity, and carcinogens.
hustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2010, 10:16 AM   #12
Elite Member
iTrader: (9)
 
TurboTim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Chesterfield, NJ
Posts: 6,484
Total Cats: 248
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
Bob, I assume you're trying to avoid burning another valve? Talk to Supertech about whether they can make you a set of Inconel valves. They make them for other applications in the $25-30/ea range.
Manley will make them too. My guy there said they could use the subaru? inconel forging to make a miata valve.
TurboTim is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Project Gemini - Turbo Civic on the Cheap Full_Tilt_Boogie Build Threads 57 07-19-2017 05:11 PM
Another Cast Manifold Corky Bell Prefabbed Turbo Kits 18 11-22-2016 10:01 PM
OTS Bilstein to motorsports ASN conversion stoves Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain 5 04-21-2016 04:00 PM
Back to Stock Part Out!! Turbo Parts, MS2 Enhanced 01-05, Suspension, and MOAR! StratoBlue1109 Miata parts for sale/trade 16 10-02-2015 10:39 AM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:35 AM.