If you had to pull the engine, what would you do?
 

2004 MSM, 157k on the motor.

Pulling the engine for a leaking oil pan. Cam seals leaking, too. So going to do a full timing change, etc., the oil pan seal, fix the leaking knock sensor on the tranny and check the clutch. Likely have a proper catch-can installed, too.

The goal is to run the stock turbo with aftermarket goodies (FMIC, down pipe, intake) at 10psi and put it on the track a couple times a year with a Rev. build MS2 but mostly it will daily drive.

Just wondering if there are other major things that are worth considering if the engine is out (I think I can leave internals alone). I am not performing the work.

Thanks.

Crap. What I should add that I already have:
DP
FMIC
Roll bar, Blackbird (race seats/5-spt that bolt/swap in for OE seats)
Intake and TB hose (including new BPV)
Rev. built MS2 (waiting to fix leaks before tuning) so that also means a wideband
Wheels/tires (need alignment)
Brake are fine (i think)
all other fluids, etc. take care of (other than what has leaked out) including new fuel filter
plugs/wires
No CELs! hurrah!

if trans is coming off the rear main isn't a bad idea.

water pump kit too.

1. FM1 Clutch
2. Resurface flywheel
3. Main seals
4. I'd strongly consider the MSPNP Pro; https://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/...ata-p-583.html

yes, sorry I was not more specific about the timing change I think of the water pump as part of that. and not a crappy stamped water pump, either.

I think the tranny is staying put but i'll keep an eye on the that, thanks.

I updated my first post too late, so yes the MS2 will do wonders for the MSM. I can't wait to tune it.

I need to research more on the OE vs. aftermarket flywheels I guess so thanks for the idea.

I wouldn't waste my money on a LW flywheel. I'd spend it on an MS3 based ECU which is the reason I linked the product specifically.

You mentioned MS2 based.

good to know about the flywheel.

Well, the MS2 advanced by Reverent was recommended so that is what I have.

Sorry, misread. Thought you were going to buy not bought. :facepalm:

I would suggest painting the engine bay. I am very happy I did mine while the engine was out.

Ate you pulling the trans/ engine out as 1 piece? I hear this is the way to go...

Change your oil and water pump while you have the sucker out...

Not sure. This felt over my head so a local race shop is doing the work that works on other track Miatas and similar cars like Lotus and Porches...HA!

set aside 2 hours.

Well, time, too. I would love to learn how to pull my own engine but there is a baby due in three weeks and so if I pull it, it will likely stay pulled for some time...and part of my wife's post-birth recovery will be going for drop-top drives in the spring air.

Engine mounts would be a good idea. Coolant reroute as well.

Funny, I was just looking at those today.

Cross-flow and re-route are on my radar at some point...but I might have to build the piggy bank back up for them.

"fix the leaking knock sensor on the tranny"

????????

Leaky oil pan? are you sure its not from the cam seal? My cam seal leaked all the way down and looked like everything was leaking including the front main, the oil pan, etc.

Now the leaky trans knock sensor...that's just hilarious...

This.

This too.

The tranny has to come out to pull the oil pan, so replace the input and output seals on the transmission. Also, insist that AR uses OEM seals EVERYWHERE. Their WorldPac source paper seals are incredibly low quality and like to leak.

Even at 157k, his NB's engine bay is at max 10 years old (yikes!), and is probably in find shape. The more important step is to properly scrub and rinse the factory paint, it'll clean up just fine.

MSM radiator is the best OE radiator you can have, so you're starting off good. Also, keep in mind reroutes are not EGR capable, so prepare to get rid of the rest of emissions when you do go with one.

To clarify these statements, your 6-speed has a reverse switch and neutral switch, but no knock sensor.

This for sure. Your MS2 will sell easily if it's MSM specific. Save some money and buy the Pro, along with Singular's ECU bracket. It can do so much more, much faster, in a smaller case, and has a lot more options. Although your MS2E is quite capable. I look forward to tuning which ever one you choose.

Ha... So you won't have your car back together this weekend to do a hardtop swap eh? Lol

Glad to see proigress being made.

Clean all the old oil w a pressure washer and see where the oil is coming from, the oil pan is not likley the problem.
You will probably need both shifter boots and engine mounts on your parts list if you pull the motor out

Thanks, Culry. Though, you are making me nervous, like AR has not properly diagnosed the issue. Tuning, eh? Also, I did not realize you have to get ride of the EGR for the re-route. I guess I will work on sealing up the radiator tight and work on some hood venting...with a second hood of course.

As for the knock sensor, that might be my bad in reporting what Eddie said. I think he knows better than that.

I am drafting a note to AR regarding the possibility of being mislead by a leak further forward in the engine and to double check on a cleaned engine.

Damn I wish the oil filter was less messy to change.

Thank you, all, very much.

I personally have no idea what the leak is from, my only comment was the quality of the paper gaskets their water pump kits include, they like to leak.

Oil pan leaks are plenty likely at 158k.

Oh, I know. I did not do a good multi-quote there so it kinda seemed like i was commenting only on your info. Sorry about that.

Also, when i am given information on a forum I treat it just as an idea rather than a diagnosis or definitive thing I should do. The final decision is still "mine" regardless of what anyone else says and therefore is my responsibility (for better or worse).

:brain: though right now I feel like Pinky.

Is this the MSM that had the horribly sloppy shifter that I test drove? Wouldn't be too surprised if the oil pan was leaking, it seemed neglected. So if it ran hot at all, it would cook the oil pan seals pretty quickly.

I rebuilt the shifter from the bottom cup all the way up. Shifts like a champ now; no heat transfer through the shifter boot.

The CELs that were on the car were all related to spark. I brought my code reader and used the sloppy shifter and x4 codes to haggle. Changed the plugs and wires and x3 of the CEL went away and have not come back. the 4th was the clutch sensor by the peddle or something and went away with some cleaning and use.

There is a MSM for sale in town in like 35k on it. damn it! Took bad I already put the roll-bar on mine.

Curly, is this from experience? I feel like this is probably one of the more rare occurrences in a miata (at least from my experience). I am more inclined to believe a shitty job on a front main or a cam seal during a timing belt change, than an oil pan leak.

Unless the oil pan was removed at some point...

I emailed AR. They did acknowledge some surprise about the oil pan, noted the cam-seal spread possibility but feel that it really is both. I'm not there, and even if I was would not necessarily know what to look for...besides leaking motor-blood.

Well, if the PO let the shifter get that bad, he/she probably ran it low on coolant, low on oil, cooked all the seals, etc. So once the front main and rear main are cooked, they leak. It runs low on oil, running hotter. Turbo really doesn't help here. Then this hot, low oil car runs even hotter, cooking the oil pan gaskets, and that's where my lack of surprise comes from.

However, I also believe that a factory sealed pan would last a few thousand miles with all of the bolts removed, they seriously stick on when they're cleaned well. So I guess I'm 50/50 in believing the leaky pan story.

I just hope there is not reason to believe that AR would purposefully get that wrong vs. just not looking closely enough.

well, just about anything that is a gasket on the tranny and engine that can be replaced without cracking the block or tanny case was replaced.

went with the "FM level 1 clutch" which is just a Competition Clutch that I sourced elsewhere for like $55 less. Drives amazingly well.

Anyhow, just need to nail down one last plumbing thing as we wired in the MS2. Other projects remain like sealing the radiator well, etc. etc., but I think the car will be happier with me once tuned, esp. now with the other stuff I have added.

Thank you all for the input on ideas about what to service.

Cheers.