Oil Leak! with pics...RESOLVED with cool black light pics
 

Ok.

I've been meaning to put a thread up here for a while and maybe I'm just looking for ideas.

This is a new engine and its leaked since i put it in.

I just dropped the subframe and replaced the oil pan seals along with the oil cooler ring just in case. I thought that was the leak but i was wrong :facepalm:

I started the car before i put the subframe back up and after about 5min the leak started up again. It doesn't seem to leak unless the engine is revved up.

I can start to see oil running down near alternator between block and oil pump. It the oil pump the culprit here? I just installed it and it has a new O-ring so technically it shouldn't leak. Should I put RTV anywhere on it as well when I put it in? Is there somewhere further up I should be looking??

The red line shows the leak.

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...207d8f0b-1.jpg

HELP!

love
Alex

Valve cover, cam seals and oil pump gasket or seal those are the only oil seals i can think of in the front of the motor. I would take the front of the motor apart and see if you have oil in there if you then you know your getting close. Also try to find the highest point of where you see oil as oil and all things try to go down.

HA! I wish all my work was guaranteed, "just because I did it".

Oil pump should be bathed in RTV before installing. Not literally. Both sides of gasket, block, and the pump itself. Isn't there a little groove? That little groove means there's supposed to be RTV in there. Use rubbing alcohol to really clean all surfaces. My main culprit is generally the stupid half circle rubber gaskets on either side of the oil pan. They always leak.

BTW, oil pan has to be dropped again to take the oil pump off. :fawk:

Dammit! I definitely put the pump on dry aside from the O-ring. I knew the 1.6L had a gasket but I thought the 1.8L only had the Oil control ring.

I can see the Cam seals clearly (No front cover on engine) and its not those...I guess i was hoping it was something else. I did such a good job sealing the pan this time too.:vash:

The alternator,PS,AC and brackets need to come off too, as well as the oil pump. :facepalm:

Can someone else confirm the 1.8L need RTV on the oil pump so I can feel better about taking it all apart tonight?

Good call, all my knowledge is 1.6

On a 1.8L oil pump/block

I've been told that no RTV is needed between the oil pump and the block.

I've also been told that a light coat of RTV is fine between the block and the oil pump.

Which of these statements is true?

OP you have done all this work and waited this long to post this and have not put oil dye in. Good luck.

As far as fipg between the oil pump and block. Yes, there s supposed to be some there. At least that is what the factory shop manual shows. That is what I did and there is no leak.

Have a great time fixing the leak.
Jared

Source where the leak is coming from.

If it's all oily everywhere spray multiple cans of engine degreaser (NOT the foamy type) all over that bitch and let it dry.

Then find leak.

It's only leaking at RPM because the oil pressure increases with RPM.

If it is leaking at the oil pump-block surface, it wouldn't hurt to RTV THE EVER LIVING SHIT OUT OF THE FUCKING OIL PUMP. And I mean like one inch of RTV. Fuck it. Why not. What do you have to lose? If it works, you don't have to pull motor. Win

Jared - I already new the oil pan was leaking so I didn't figure I needed to use dye. I simply dropped the subframe and changed the oil pan seal, this fixed one of the leaks (I thought they were both the oil pan)

After replacing the seal, I still found it was leaking when revving (luckily I didn't replace the subframe yet)

Faeflora - Your idea is very tempting, but I know I would be kicking myself in 6 months if it started leaking again. The subframe is already down so whats another few hours yanking the timing belt, AC pump, brackets and alternator.

The block was cleaned thoroughly before inspection and its still hard as hell to see in there from the alternator hiding the oil pump so dye or no dye I still have to start taking stuff off to see the location where the leak is coming from.

At this point, everything points to the Oil pump that apparently should have been rtv'd but wasn't. The Oil cooler, Oil Pressure sensor T, cam seals are dry as well as area near front main seal. I think I have it the culprit nailed down. I'll take off alternator tonight and if the area over the oil pump is dry then it'll be pretty much a sure thing.

I really don't know how i missed RTV'ing the pump when putting things together, seems rather obvious now that I think of how it all works.

My point is that you should put it in and clean the engine off. Then start it up and check for the leak before you even turn another bolt. You can also remove the alternator and run the car for a bit to help you gain access to that location. You just don't want to do it on a hot engine since you will be removing the water pump belt.

Its better to know what you are dealing with before you turn a bolt. Thats just me.

Have a great day,
Jared

First off, I'd like to thank Jared for making me feel like an idiot by not using dye. :facepalm:
I went into Napa and paid 5 bucks for a bottle of dye. This stuff is pretty cool.
Took off alternator, charged the battery and start the car cold... i figured I only had about 3-4 min before it would heat too much so I got to work... I'll let the pictures tell the story.

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...g/c3808bb3.jpg

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...g/c3785487.jpg

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...g/bbdee346.jpg

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...g/c0feab30.jpg

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...g/fe61ecb9.jpg

To all of you who have purchased an oil pump at any time from the dealer or otherwise. Please be sure to double check the relief bolt. Mine was tight, very tight, Yet oil still got past it very VERY easily.

After some research I found that the differences in the cast metal essentially leave of bunch of gaps regardless of how tight it is.

I removed the bolt, applied a generous amount of Permatex Thread Sealant and replaced the bolt.

After starting the car and going through the same procedure as last time, I no longer spot a leak.

I'll let the car sit over night and check again tomorrow after work.

Thank you for sharing those pictures, sir.

neato burrito!

is THAT why civics run lights under their running boards??

Allow me to go kill myself for not trying dye, even though I was told to. That's pretty sweet.

Which bolt in in the day light pics is that?

Spooky - In the very first pic, Its the black bolt on the oil pump (you need an allen key to take it out)
Here you go, I circled the area.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i1...c3808bb3-1.jpg

Bryce - welcome to the club, thats why I took all the pics.

I check over the car late last night a few hrs after the initial check when it was pitch black in the garage. Its amazing how many things glow in the dark...and how well you can view things in the engine bay that might be leaking.

Cool, maybe that's where my mystery oil leak is coming from, not the main-seal. I went to an ALMS race a decade ago and remember looking at the Audi after 6-hours of Texas Motor Speedway and was amazed about how everything was so clean...I want that.

well that bolt is accessible with the alternator and everything in the car... it would be a 5 min fix.

....and I would get the satisfaction of knowing I helped the huslter.

Good shit - I used dye to find out that my rear oil pan seal was fuxored - Wished I had dyed it weeks prior, would have saved me much work.

Preluding - You are welcome. Lol. Now, how much better do you feel now that you don't have to remove the oil pan again to reseal the pump and find out that that was not the problem.

BTW I had the same leak the other month when I built the motor that is in my car now. I was baffeled since I did seal the oil pump. I installed a BE HP oil pump. I contacted Travis to let him know so that other pumps would not leak.

Have a great day,
Jared

I guess it wasn't just my pump then...at least its an easy fix!

I've never used the dye before and it pretty amazing how quickly you can see oil coming out, very impressive.

I probably bought my pump before you so he didn't get the chance to address the issue yet.

If you have not contacted Travis I would. Just to let him know how far back the issue may be going on. Also I put some teflon tape on the threads.

Glad that you got it all taken care of.

Have a great day,
Jared

Just for future searches; I used teflon tape on a oil pressure sender fitting and it leaked pretty bad, ended up fixing it with jointing compound.

Thanks guys!

Shes all sealed up now... Haven't put it all back together yet.

Need to redo my SS oil return line, replace a slightly wobbly crank pulley with another used one in hopes that fixes it, and seriously port my wastegate so I'm not hitting almost 20psi anymore....before the subframe is put back up.

dude that dye is super cool

WTF. That was probably the bolt that was leaking for years on my 92. I could not figure it out.

Interesting thread. This may be the solution to my phantom leak.

I believe I may have found another leak coming out of AC bracket bolt as well.
I'll know more once I start driving the car again, it is either left over from the last leak or extremely slow. Just another spot to check.

I'll probably take them all out and seal the bolts.

I know this is a mega old thread...well not that old...but.

See above...Preluding says something about the AC bracket bolt leaking....

How the heck could that be leaking...its a blind hole?

I have oil leaking from that area...it appears to be the oil pan gasket...but if it was as simple as a hole from the AC bracket I removed that would be awesome...but a little unbelieveable.

What do you guys think?

***The A/C bolt hole troubleshooter***

1. Did you remove the A/C bracket?
(If yes, go to 2. If no, go to 5.)

2. Did you replace the front bolt after you removed the bracket?
(if yes, go to 5, if no, go to 3.)

3. Oil is leaking out of the hole where the "5th bolt" of the A/C mounting bracket bolts to the front of the engine. Find a bolt that fits the hole and put it in there.
(You have completed this troubleshooter)

4. Your mother is a wh0re.
(You have completed this troubleshooter)

5. Your problem is not the A/C mounting hole.
(This troubleshooter cannot assist you any further)

Thanks.

My Mom says HI!

Wait...how the hell did you get to 4?

This is how.

4

I got to 4, told my dad and the b1tch is now dead.

Thanks Fooger!

I have leaks from my Power Steering(Need a rack, too lazy to get one) and Return line(ebay special AN fittings suck). I also have small bolt in on the front of my AC Bracket.

I'm sure that leak, is one of the two I just mentioned above and not what I originally thought.

Smoke...on the watttttterrrrr.

That dye is amazing when it only uses .5oz to test a 5-6qt capacity.

The ---- I was selling (all sold out) was 4 in 1 (oil, p/s fluid, atf and fuel).

I also have coolant dyes but for some reason those ones don't sell as well. Probably cause coolant leaks are a little easier to track down than greasy leaks.

Fooger, issue with your troubleshooter.

What if you didn't remove the AC bracket, but sometime in the past some hack mechanic (that you overpaid) replaced an AC compressor but didn't properly resecure the bracket and left the 5th bolt out entirely?

When this happens, the step 1 to step 5 leads you astray.

Just sayin'.

:vash:

Does anybody know where to get the dye locally (I'm in Metro DC). Would autozone or Pepboys have it in stock?

I'm chasing two oil geysers that if not resolved on this engine pull are going to result in a parted and sawzalled car.

Yes. I got some from advance. It was by the refrigerant dye, oddly.

i got it from napa....wasn't on the shelf had to ask at counter

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...0e1cf7717c.jpg

This is the dye I use for everything except AC

This is the dye I use for AC work. Most of the PAG oil available is already dyed and a bottle of this will last me 2+ years. I do 200 systems a year.


And this is the single best UV light source I've ever come across. This puppy will give you "flash" blindness if you look at it directly. The yellow glasses are mandatory.
TP-1300 - Tracerproducts.com

A common UV flashlight will work just fine but it helps if the shop is dark.

I know this thread is ancient, but I thought a current source for this stuff might be appreciated...

Good info thanks. Personally, since im on a timeline here, i got some dye from advance auto and rented the UV light from autozone. Looks like its the front main. I had the new one in my hand and decided to leave it be since it looked fine. Looks like i cost myself 40 bucks and another Saturday :(

I did, got it taken care of. the front where the oil pan meets the pump was not sealed up well. cleaned it, rtv'd the crap out of it, and its no longer leaking that i can see.