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Old 06-05-2011, 07:24 PM   #1
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Default Oil Leak! with pics...RESOLVED with cool black light pics

Ok.

I've been meaning to put a thread up here for a while and maybe I'm just looking for ideas.

This is a new engine and its leaked since i put it in.

I just dropped the subframe and replaced the oil pan seals along with the oil cooler ring just in case. I thought that was the leak but i was wrong

I started the car before i put the subframe back up and after about 5min the leak started up again. It doesn't seem to leak unless the engine is revved up.

I can start to see oil running down near alternator between block and oil pump. It the oil pump the culprit here? I just installed it and it has a new O-ring so technically it shouldn't leak. Should I put RTV anywhere on it as well when I put it in? Is there somewhere further up I should be looking??

The red line shows the leak.



HELP!

love
Alex

Last edited by Preluding; 06-07-2011 at 09:12 PM.
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Old 06-05-2011, 10:48 PM   #2
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Valve cover, cam seals and oil pump gasket or seal those are the only oil seals i can think of in the front of the motor. I would take the front of the motor apart and see if you have oil in there if you then you know your getting close. Also try to find the highest point of where you see oil as oil and all things try to go down.
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Old 06-06-2011, 01:21 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Preluding View Post
I just installed it and it has a new O-ring so technically it shouldn't leak.
HA! I wish all my work was guaranteed, "just because I did it".

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Should I put RTV anywhere on it as well when I put it in? Is there somewhere further up I should be looking??
Oil pump should be bathed in RTV before installing. Not literally. Both sides of gasket, block, and the pump itself. Isn't there a little groove? That little groove means there's supposed to be RTV in there. Use rubbing alcohol to really clean all surfaces. My main culprit is generally the stupid half circle rubber gaskets on either side of the oil pan. They always leak.

BTW, oil pan has to be dropped again to take the oil pump off.
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Old 06-06-2011, 08:26 AM   #4
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Quote:
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.....Oil pump should be bathed in RTV before installing. Not literally. Both sides of gasket, block, and the pump itself. Isn't there a little groove? That little groove means there's supposed to be RTV in there. ...
BTW, oil pan has to be dropped again to take the oil pump off.
Dammit! I definitely put the pump on dry aside from the O-ring. I knew the 1.6L had a gasket but I thought the 1.8L only had the Oil control ring.

I can see the Cam seals clearly (No front cover on engine) and its not those...I guess i was hoping it was something else. I did such a good job sealing the pan this time too.

The alternator,PS,AC and brackets need to come off too, as well as the oil pump.

Can someone else confirm the 1.8L need RTV on the oil pump so I can feel better about taking it all apart tonight?
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Old 06-06-2011, 08:35 AM   #5
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Good call, all my knowledge is 1.6
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Old 06-06-2011, 03:21 PM   #6
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On a 1.8L oil pump/block

I've been told that no RTV is needed between the oil pump and the block.

I've also been told that a light coat of RTV is fine between the block and the oil pump.

Which of these statements is true?
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Old 06-07-2011, 01:38 AM   #7
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OP you have done all this work and waited this long to post this and have not put oil dye in. Good luck.

As far as fipg between the oil pump and block. Yes, there s supposed to be some there. At least that is what the factory shop manual shows. That is what I did and there is no leak.

Have a great time fixing the leak.
Jared
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Old 06-07-2011, 02:17 AM   #8
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Source where the leak is coming from.

If it's all oily everywhere spray multiple cans of engine degreaser (NOT the foamy type) all over that bitch and let it dry.

Then find leak.

It's only leaking at RPM because the oil pressure increases with RPM.

If it is leaking at the oil pump-block surface, it wouldn't hurt to RTV THE EVER LIVING **** OUT OF THE ******* OIL PUMP. And I mean like one inch of RTV. **** it. Why not. What do you have to lose? If it works, you don't have to pull motor. Win
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Old 06-07-2011, 09:15 AM   #9
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Jared - I already new the oil pan was leaking so I didn't figure I needed to use dye. I simply dropped the subframe and changed the oil pan seal, this fixed one of the leaks (I thought they were both the oil pan)

After replacing the seal, I still found it was leaking when revving (luckily I didn't replace the subframe yet)

Faeflora - Your idea is very tempting, but I know I would be kicking myself in 6 months if it started leaking again. The subframe is already down so whats another few hours yanking the timing belt, AC pump, brackets and alternator.

The block was cleaned thoroughly before inspection and its still hard as hell to see in there from the alternator hiding the oil pump so dye or no dye I still have to start taking stuff off to see the location where the leak is coming from.

At this point, everything points to the Oil pump that apparently should have been rtv'd but wasn't. The Oil cooler, Oil Pressure sensor T, cam seals are dry as well as area near front main seal. I think I have it the culprit nailed down. I'll take off alternator tonight and if the area over the oil pump is dry then it'll be pretty much a sure thing.

I really don't know how i missed RTV'ing the pump when putting things together, seems rather obvious now that I think of how it all works.
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Old 06-07-2011, 04:05 PM   #10
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My point is that you should put it in and clean the engine off. Then start it up and check for the leak before you even turn another bolt. You can also remove the alternator and run the car for a bit to help you gain access to that location. You just don't want to do it on a hot engine since you will be removing the water pump belt.

Its better to know what you are dealing with before you turn a bolt. Thats just me.

Have a great day,
Jared
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Old 06-07-2011, 09:01 PM   #11
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First off, I'd like to thank Jared for making me feel like an idiot by not using dye.
I went into Napa and paid 5 bucks for a bottle of dye. This stuff is pretty cool.
Took off alternator, charged the battery and start the car cold... i figured I only had about 3-4 min before it would heat too much so I got to work... I'll let the pictures tell the story.











To all of you who have purchased an oil pump at any time from the dealer or otherwise. Please be sure to double check the relief bolt. Mine was tight, very tight, Yet oil still got past it very VERY easily.

After some research I found that the differences in the cast metal essentially leave of bunch of gaps regardless of how tight it is.

I removed the bolt, applied a generous amount of Permatex Thread Sealant and replaced the bolt.

After starting the car and going through the same procedure as last time, I no longer spot a leak.

I'll let the car sit over night and check again tomorrow after work.

Last edited by Preluding; 06-07-2011 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 06-07-2011, 10:12 PM   #12
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Thank you for sharing those pictures, sir.
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Old 06-07-2011, 10:18 PM   #13
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neato burrito!
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Old 06-07-2011, 11:03 PM   #14
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is THAT why civics run lights under their running boards??
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Old 06-08-2011, 01:23 AM   #15
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Allow me to go kill myself for not trying dye, even though I was told to. That's pretty sweet.
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Old 06-08-2011, 05:59 AM   #16
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Which bolt in in the day light pics is that?
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Old 06-08-2011, 08:31 AM   #17
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Spooky - In the very first pic, Its the black bolt on the oil pump (you need an allen key to take it out)
Here you go, I circled the area.


Bryce - welcome to the club, thats why I took all the pics.

I check over the car late last night a few hrs after the initial check when it was pitch black in the garage. Its amazing how many things glow in the dark...and how well you can view things in the engine bay that might be leaking.
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Old 06-08-2011, 09:33 AM   #18
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:30 AM   #19
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Cool, maybe that's where my mystery oil leak is coming from, not the main-seal. I went to an ALMS race a decade ago and remember looking at the Audi after 6-hours of Texas Motor Speedway and was amazed about how everything was so clean...I want that.
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Old 06-08-2011, 03:14 PM   #20
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well that bolt is accessible with the alternator and everything in the car... it would be a 5 min fix.

....and I would get the satisfaction of knowing I helped the huslter.
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