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Old 10-21-2008, 11:50 PM   #1
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Default please estimate

how much power my engine will hold (approximately):

'92 1.6L
- oem pistons w/ some kind of performance rings (didnt find anything suitable yet... advice if you can)
- m-tuned rods
- oversized intake and exhaust valves + valve job (3/5-angle intake/exhaust)
- MAYBE solid lifters and different valve springs if my oem ones are fucked
- mild head porting
- clevite or acl bearings

just would like to know if this could hold 300-320whp safely (tuned by VERY good tuner.) anything i need to add? i dont really want to cash out on new pistons at this point as im already WELL over my head in this build (as usual)
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:10 AM   #2
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Curious also.
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:12 AM   #3
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hmmm... just found a set of wiseco 79mm pistons for allright price. might just have to pick those up...
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:16 AM   #4
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I'd say about e^(5.70378) whp. Maybe e^(5.85793) but the ring landings on the stock pistons soon become the weak link in the engine. Only REAL weak links are the 1.6 composite head gasket, and stock rods and pistons. Put a MLS head gasket and forged rods and pistons, leave everything else stock, and the sky's the limit with boost.
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:24 AM   #5
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so 300-350, eh? ok... got the point... spending some $ on pistons also...
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:35 AM   #6
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Yeap. But you'll never make the power my Suncharged and Neptune cooled motor will.
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:39 AM   #7
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how about 2860 + lots of boost + good porting + methanol/water + one of the best tuners in town?
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:40 AM   #8
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i just want to hit 300 really magic number! i will be driving at around 5-7psi on street, and full boost (15-16?) on track.
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:42 AM   #9
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I don't remember what the top land width is on the OEM piston, but 300-350 is pretty optimistic.
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:45 AM   #10
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yeah yeah, its settled already - im getting pistons too!
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:51 AM   #11
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I'd say a 100% stock 1.6 in good condition, with that turbo and a hefty shot of meth injection, good, somewhat conservative tuning w and w/o WI, 300whp is safe as hell. There's a lot to be said in tuning. Power don't break stuff. Knock does. I'll be going for 350 whp on my stock 99 soon. I hope over Christmas. I'll set it up for the usual 250whp "safe" numbers at first, but once it's dialed in and I get comforable with the setup, I'm adding WI and gonna run 20 PSI on a GT 3271.
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:56 AM   #12
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sweet

i was thinking about 2871r at first but i want better spool then that... hopefully 2860 will do the job

im really really hoping to break 310-320whp on this setup. gotta figure something out for my drivetrain now... i dont think 5 speed is going to cut it anymore...
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Old 10-22-2008, 12:57 AM   #13
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by the way, wi kit im getting has 7 gallon tank and im doing hard lines from trunk all the way under the hood while my engine, transmission, and rear end are out.

also, 100 shot crossed my mind few times...
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Old 10-22-2008, 01:04 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanSoot View Post
by the way, wi kit im getting has 7 gallon tank and im doing hard lines from trunk all the way under the hood while my engine, transmission, and rear end are out.

also, 100 shot crossed my mind few times...
Wait, you could PM me and ask 32 questions and then not buy it!! I've responded to a combined total of no less than 50 emails and PM's. You'd think I posted that the person who asks the most questions gets it free... And supposedly, someone on the forum with 2 post is gonna pay for it tomorrow... We'll see.

What WI kit you getting? What shot of meth you gonna run? I'm just gonna run straight water, but lots of it. Have it come on after say 10 PSI and just hose her down. Yeah, I want at least a 5 gallon tank. I wouldn't run it with a small tank and no fail safe circuit to pull timing if you run out of WI. This summer I wanna build a fiberglass tank into the trunk where the spare tire goes. Several gallons of area there I know, and low center of G. And best of all, pop the trunk it will look stock. My entire car will forever look stock.
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Old 10-22-2008, 05:02 AM   #15
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im trading my carpc for a snow performance stage 2 kit with 7 gal tank and upgraded solenoid.

im thinking about 50/50 meth/water because i only have 420cc injectors and im not sure how far i can take them..

100 shot is nice but i wont pull a trigger on it until everything is finished and car is tuned so i know what my engines limits are. i know my limits are way beyond of what my car will be able to do even at low boost
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Old 10-22-2008, 03:29 PM   #16
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16-17psi on built motor? You could do that on a stock one. Build it, boost it 22psi w/ meth. Make 350whp.
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Old 10-22-2008, 04:42 PM   #17
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22psi on 2860? is it within it's efficiency range?
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Old 10-22-2008, 06:42 PM   #18
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I still find it strange that somebody would "build" a 1.6. You can pick up a 1.8 longblock for cheap and the FM swap pieces for $150... subtract a few $ from the FM swap kit cause you won't need the coil bracket after your switch to COPs.

It's the same money to "build" a 1.8 vs. a 1.6, so for the cost of the swap pieces is well worth it for the extra .2 litres and increased spool. If you're even considering a 2871, a 1.8 is the ticket.

If you already have a 1.6 turbo setup, just wait until somebody is selling a decent 1.8 mani/DP combo and sell your 1.6 stuff to fund it. Am I crazy?
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Old 10-22-2008, 06:51 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samnavy View Post
I still find it strange that somebody would "build" a 1.6. You can pick up a 1.8 longblock for cheap and the FM swap pieces for $150... subtract a few $ from the FM swap kit cause you won't need the coil bracket after your switch to COPs.

It's the same money to "build" a 1.8 vs. a 1.6, so for the cost of the swap pieces is well worth it for the extra .2 litres and increased spool. If you're even considering a 2871, a 1.8 is the ticket.

If you already have a 1.6 turbo setup, just wait until somebody is selling a decent 1.8 mani/DP combo and sell your 1.6 stuff to fund it. Am I crazy?
While I agree, I also disagree... Your logic is sound for the most part. But you have to ask yourself: Is it worth it? To some, like you and I, the answer is definitely yes.

But some just want more power. So they put a turbo on it and adjust boost to make the power they want. Whether it's a 1.6 or 1.8 doesn't much matter (except for spool, but .2L isn't the end of the world). Some actually like a laggy setup. Helps with traction and also gives a bigger "rush" which is desirable to some.

And for christ sakes don't make Urban change his setup again.
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Old 10-22-2008, 07:22 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samnavy View Post
I still find it strange that somebody would "build" a 1.6. You can pick up a 1.8 longblock for cheap and the FM swap pieces for $150... subtract a few $ from the FM swap kit cause you won't need the coil bracket after your switch to COPs.

It's the same money to "build" a 1.8 vs. a 1.6, so for the cost of the swap pieces is well worth it for the extra .2 litres and increased spool. If you're even considering a 2871, a 1.8 is the ticket.

If you already have a 1.6 turbo setup, just wait until somebody is selling a decent 1.8 mani/DP combo and sell your 1.6 stuff to fund it. Am I crazy?


Assuming on the lowside of things.

$150 for unknown history longblock locally.

$100 ish for DIY COP.

$100 ish for mentioned FM swap kit without coil bracket.

$200 New manifold, turbo and dp.


You're adding at least $500 to your build on the lowside. That's adding at least 25% to the cost of a 1.6 build, and would have added at least 30% to the cost of my mild 1.6 build. It wasn't worth it for my goals.
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