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Old 06-12-2012, 11:17 PM   #1
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Default Timing 180* off

As the title says, my timing is 180 off.

I started looking for my timing marks to set my timing to 10* and I couldn't even find it. Looked under the car and there it was, about 180* off. When I check timing on #2/3 cylinder my mark is right in the ballpark.

What could make my pulley be 180* off? The pulley only fits on one way, I wouldn't see an issue with my engine considering its a 96 in a 93 car, it would be the same wouldn't it? I am using a non advanced timing light, works pretty well so what tha hell? The car runs great, no misfires, no stutters, no problems at all. So I know my spark is good
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:31 PM   #2
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Impossible to be 180 out with batch fuel and waste spark, lol.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:37 PM   #3
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The mark on my pulley reads almost 180 off. Timing light set on my #1 spark plug wire, I marked the notches on the pulley where it should read, it is 120-180* off. I don't see how it's possible
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:42 PM   #4
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The plug fires at TDC and 180.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:44 PM   #5
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But shouldn't #1 cylinder fire at my timing marks and #2/3 fire 180 opposite of that? Because I have the opposite. #2/3 read at my 10* mark while #1/4 read 180 off
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:51 PM   #6
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Check the ignition timing section http://www.miata.net/garage/ignition.html
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:51 PM   #7
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Show us your cam "loaves" at TDC.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:53 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by hustler View Post
Impossible to be 180 out with batch fuel and waste spark, lol.
It's quite easy, actually. You just have to have the CoilA and CoilB connections reversed. Happens all the time with NA MS1 users who do the wiring according to DIY's specs (which are technically backwards) but configure the wheel decoder the "correct" way.

Just reverse the plug wires between the two coils.

EDIT: I just saw that you (Justin) have a '96 engine in a '93 body. Mazda reversed the orientation of the coils on the 1.8 engine relative to the 1.6, so I guarantee that you simply have the plug wires backwards. Pull the wires, and put the ones that were on the left-side coil onto the right-side coil and vise-versa. Problem solved.

EDIT 2: Ok, I've been drinking, so I just noticed that you said the engine actually runs (I assumed this was a "help, my engine won't start" post.) Based on this, I conclude that you're insane. Either that, or you have the most radically slipped crank pulley I have ever seen (the pulley is not one solid piece- it's an inner hub and an outer ring, joined by a rubber donut. They've been known to slip as they get old, but I've never seen one 180* out.)


Remove the #1 spark plug, drop the oil dipstick down the hole, and turn the engine clockwise by hand until you find the actual #1 TDC. Look at the pulley.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:58 PM   #9
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Pull the wires, and put the ones that were on the left-side coil onto the right-side coil and vise-versa. Problem solved.
I tried that Joe, car runs like ----, backfires, wont even run actually.

It is to dark outside to get any photos/videos of the problem, I can do so tomorrow.

As for my timing belt marks they are 100% dead nut, plug wires are also correct. Car runs GREAT! But my pulley marks are wayyy off.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:59 PM   #10
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I've tried starting the car at 90 degrees out, which lead me to this assumption.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:02 AM   #11
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Everything seems to be good, I have no problems with the engine at all. It is just my pulley notches are off for some odd reason. Could that pulley be bolted in wrong? Like can you unbolt that pulley from the dampener and reposition it? That's my only thought.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:04 AM   #12
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I tried that Joe, car runs like ----, backfires, wont even run actually.
Yeah, I was drunk-posting.

Go back and re-read my Edit #2. That gives you the simple procedure for finding the problem.

The only way to have the pulley installed incorrectly would be for the little tit-like thing that aligns it to be missing. I guess it's possible.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:06 AM   #13
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Yeah, I was drunk-posting.

Go back and re-read my Edit #2. That gives you the simple procedure for finding the problem.

The only way to have the pulley installed incorrectly would be for the little tit-like thing that aligns it to be missing. I guess it's possible.
Not sure how many times you will re-edit that Joe lol but I just read it again. My pulley wobbles a tad bit but nothing I am concerned about. It MAY be worn out and needing replacing and I have been considering it. What's the best way to check it out?

EDIT JOE: What do you mean by tit-like thing? I only recall a woodruff key?
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:10 AM   #14
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Oh ----, I'm an idiot.. Stop and check to see if the balancer slipped out of place. I've seen this several times. Confirm with a screwdriver in the plug hole.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:14 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FowlerMotorsports View Post
Not sure how many times you will re-edit that Joe lol but I just read it again. My pulley wobbles a tad bit but nothing I am concerned about. It MAY be worn out and needing replacing and I have been considering it. What's the best way to check it out?
I'm done editing it.

The trick with the dipstick in the plug hole is pretty handy. You can also do it in the #2 cylinder to determine whether they pulley has slipped or is in fact installed "backwards." If, with the dipstick in the #2 hole, you find that #2 TDC corresponds exactly with the alignment of the crank pulley notch to the "T" mark on the cover, then the pulley might simply be bolted on wrong (and the alignment tit missing from the plate that goes between the pulley and the cambelt gear.)

If it's not exactly aligned, then they pulley has probably just slipped.

Also, I'm going to stop giving technical advice for the evening. I'm pretty deep into a bottle of Cruzan right now, and even this simple post has taken me far too long to write. Nothing says "I'm a normal, well adjusted guy" like drinking to stupor alone on a Tuesday night while stalking the web forums like a child molester at a playground.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:16 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FowlerMotorsports View Post
EDIT JOE: What do you mean by tit-like thing? I only recall a woodruff key?


The woodruff key aligns the cambelt gear to the crank.

Then the piece pictured above goes on top of the cambelt gear and is also aligned by the woodruff key. Finally, the pulley bolts over top of it. That dowel in it (the tit-like thing. Took me a while to remember the word "dowel") is what the crank pulley aligns to.

So the part I pictured goes between the pulley and the cambelt gear, and it is what the pulley aligns to.
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Timing 180* off-3e47643af660cb8b0c126b6eaa907084__30118_zoom.jpg  
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:17 AM   #17
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We used a screwdriver to indicate TDC, and according to that it seems to be WAY off. I didn't know if the pulley could have been installed wrong on the balancer (i dont remember if it had bolts near the crank or not) but thats what I thought.

Here's a crappy pic so yal can get an idea on whats going on.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:19 AM   #18
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Based on your picture, the mark on the pulley is not exactly 180 (or 90) degrees off. Thus, the pulley has slipped and you need to replace it.
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Old 06-13-2012, 12:21 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post

Also, I'm going to stop giving technical advice for the evening. I'm pretty deep into a bottle of Cruzan right now, and even this simple post has taken me far too long to write. Nothing says "I'm a normal, well adjusted guy" like drinking to stupor alone on a Tuesday night while stalking the web forums like a child molester at a playground.
I'm drinking 98 point cab in a wine bar, miss you.

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Old 06-13-2012, 12:21 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FowlerMotorsports View Post
I didn't know if the pulley could have been installed wrong on the balancer
Also, FWIW, the pulley IS the balancer. It's actually two pieces (although you can't tell by looking at it, nor can you separate it) and that it the root of the problem. The inner and outer portions are bonded together by a piece of rubber, and as this ages and hardens, the outer ring can slip relative to the hub.
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