What can my engine build handle? (RPM/power)
 

Hello. Finishing up my first miata long block, its almost done. Did some research and read the engine building ideas thread. I'm hoping to have a 300whp (daily), 350+rhhp (weekend) reliable engine capable of 8000rpm. WIll it handle this?

2004 MSM with 2005 engine block 83.5mm holes, BP4W head. EFR 6258 and methanol injection.

Manley H-beam rods
Wiseco 8.5:1 Pistons/rings
ACL bearings
ARP head and main studs
Boundary OIL pump (72 psi)
ATI super damper
Mazda OEM headgasket
+1mm intake valves
+1mm inconel exh valves
+supertech heavy double springs
+supertech shim under bucket lifters
272/10mm lift intake and exhaust regrind cams
Mild intake polishing


a few other goodies coming to help support such as skunk manifold/tb, COP, etc. What do yall think?

ECU?

300whp is easy with the right parts, and you have a lot of them. But the devil is in the details.

Right now I'm undecided between hydra nemesis and adaptronic. Leaning towards adaptronic though simply because I know theres atleast one shop within a 3 hour drive that can do dyno tuning with it. Made several calls and it seems like no one messes with hydra.

Yep just want a reliable 300rwhp/8000 rpm machine....provided it makes power to that rpm.

Are you in Australia?

why not megasquirt 3?

No, I'm in Texas. Honestly I really don't know what the differences are between the ones available. I just know I want plug and play and a preloaded startup map at the bare minimum. I don't know which is best to suit my needs. I was going to do some more research later and then ask about this later down the road in this forum.

I don't know what I'm talking about.

I think you went FAR overkill for only 350whp sometimes, except the turbo sizing, which might limit you?

350whp on the street and strip is easily reliable with a rods only refresh.

Skunk 2 manifold didnt test well, although it was just a naturally aspirated test. https://www.miataturbo.net/engine-pe...anifold-94978/

Rods and pistons for reliable 350whp.

Megasquirt 3 is far superior to Adaptronic and a turd on the end of a stick would be better in your Miata than a Hydra.

reason I asked is because in Australia many run adaprtonic. But being in Texas, I would strongly recommend you run ms3 or ms3 pro.
It is by far the most popular and most supported platform on these forums.

and I am sure you can find tuners in Texas to tune megasquirt

Where in Texas are you located? We have a pretty amazing Megasquirt tuner down in Houston. He also has a dyno in Little Rock (near austin) that he can tune at.

I'd much rather hear overkill than "might not be enough,". This build started out as 400rwhp capable but after much research I've found the transmission becomes a consumable at that point. I don't want to have worry about grenading a transmission at in inopportune time as I'll be driving this thing all over Texas. I've also not found anything as far as decent transmission swap kits. Just a FC RX7 bell housing. Looks like a lot of fab work involved that I don't want to get into. As for the skunk Intake, I'm half committed just for aesthetics, easy access to rail, less vacuum ports and no VTCS.

As far as I can tell from the compressor map, the 6258 should be near maxed out around 375ish. I'd be happy to have that power on tap on the weekends with a bit of cooling help from my methanol injection system (already on the car, no access to E85.)

I never gave MS a second look. I've always though of it as one of those projects where you buy breadboards and build the ECM from scratch. Is it not like that anymore? If it's plug and play I'll definitely give it another look.

Thanks for all the input guys. I'm trying really hard to turn the key on this thing around february.

Abilene area.

For the transmission..

https://kmiata.com/products/mazda-bp...dapter-package

I meant round rock texas. I know your a far way from Houston but join the Facebook - Houston Miata Group. If your fine to drive to austin or houston, we have people that can tune a megasquirt for you.

I've tuned heaps of adaptronic.

I am australian.

They're shit.

go ms3

I will tune your car. Just started a tuning company called google and ve analyze live. Oh wait..adaptronic?


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...1b7bfc4bbd.gifYo dog, you are breaking real ground down here. Those backwards TX folks have no idea how dem new fangled puters work. You bought a bunch of expensive things and you dont know how to use it. Awesome.

There hasnt been a bp break through in a half decade. It is figured out. They are so cutting edge with that adaptronic though.

Yes MS3X is absolutely pnp at this point.
There are several versions being produced by different companies/angry cat-loving East Coasters.
Do a bit if reading to decide which one you want, and go for it.

Wow, lots of great information guys. Thank you so much. Awesome on the transmission swap, now I know what I'm doing when this 6speed goes south. I will also dig into MS3 and learn as much as I can. I also will look into that houston miata group. I have no problem driving around Texas.

Attachment 218730 Where I'm at now. More parts are in the mail. Not to mention those on the floor behind it.

Please please please go back to stock cams. The 272/10mm sticks are just going to shove peak torque up the rev band needlessly. That turbo with your head will definitely do 325whp, should do 350whp with the stock cams. It will make that with less boost on your 272s, but with a TON less torque. The only not-impressive B1 EFR setup I've ever seen had 272 cams.

It was my understanding that I needed those to get power to 8000RPM. I'll keep your advice in mind. Thanks sav.

Our engines don't like 8000 RPM and up very much. They are unfortunately not designed much like Hondas. More designed like a Kubota. Our heads don't flow well and the balance and strength in the bottom end is more like a jump rope than we would like from 8000 RPM up. It's really best for longevity to try to maximize the power the engines can make in the RPM range where they are designed to make power. Or you could go to billet main caps and balance everything and just be prepared to rebuild the engine as often as real racers do.

Have you ridden in a 300whp Miata yet? The light weight of the car helps you do a lot more with less. It's faster than my buddy's 600whp SRT8 Procharger Challenger.

Yeah from what I understand, going beyond 8000 makes the stock crank very unhappy. Funny, I almost went with billet main caps but talked myself out of it cause I didn't find it necessary if I didnt go to a stronger crank, which is FAR out of my budget lol. The MBSP and arp studs will have to hold her together.

No I have not ridden in a 300hp miata yet. In fact, mines the fastest one Ive been in which is dissapointing. Not many miata fans in this part of Texas. Before I bent a con rod, I ran a 9.3 1/8th mile with a passenger. 17psi boost on methanol with stock msm turbo and supra injectors. probably wasn't even 200rwhp....slow lol.

Its funny you saythat sixshooter. I really want to hang with hellcats. Not really building a drag miata but....I gotta grudge :)

300 hp in a Miata is nuts. im "only" at 250-265hp right now and its a wild ride. forget 1st gear and will roll spin 2nd gear and thats with a 5spd and 3.9 rear, so long gearing.

with your 6spd and 300hp, forget first two gears and im sure you will still manage to spin 3rd.

BP engines are not S2K engines, they make lots and lots of midrage torque. not a high revving screamer.
whats the point to spin a motor to 8k? you want to have more speed in each gear? get longer gearing 3.63 rear for example. 8k+ rpm is just unnecessary stress that breaks shit faster.

Sixshooter and borka are correct, you don't need to rev the motor to 8k to make 300whp. In fact, it's less desirable if you don't, for several reasons (powerband, reliability, gearing).

there is no point in revving higher then needed, listen to these guys. once upon a time I built a engine with massive 290/13.5mm cams and it fucking killed torque but made insane up top. The power band was useless, unless your drag racing and geared to run between 6500-8000. Even drifting you would think that your in those revs all the time, and thats not the case. Burning tires I spent more time at 5k then I do at 7k.