Another Transmission Option? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

General Miata Chat A place to talk about anything Miata

Another Transmission Option?

Old 01-03-2019, 03:32 PM
  #1  
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Woostuh, MA
Posts: 3,796
Total Cats: 101
Default Another Transmission Option?

Saw this pop up on the MT facebook group.

https://walter-motorsports.com/shop?...ission-5-speed

Shop advertises rebuilt 5 speeds that can take 300+ hp. I feel like I read similar things about quaife, no? Has anyone dealt with them? I'm just super curious about this option because a 5 speed set up to handle 300ish hp for 1250-1500 sounds almost too good to be true. I wonder if they guarantee their work...
ridethecliche is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 03:57 PM
  #2  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Richmond, VA
Posts: 184
Total Cats: 39
Default

Interesting stuff, I've noticed some of what they talk about in the NB 5 speed I'm rebuilding. Though, it seems all of their strength upgrading is in going to hardened studs to replace the bolts that hold the whole trans together. I am dubious as to how much strength those really add. But then again, they are only claiming a ~30% increase, so that is maybe reasonable over stock.
themonkeyman is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 03:58 PM
  #3  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 106
Total Cats: 7
Default

This looks amazing but sounds way too good to be true. As I understand it the main weak point in the 5 speed trans is the lack of bracing on the casing not holding up to twisting and torsional loads under high torque output. It seems the only way this is directly addressed is using studs instead of bolts... I doubt the resolution is that easy.

I believe the Quaife was just an upgraded gear set and didn't really address the weakness in the casing.

We'd need someone like Sav or Emilio to really put it through its paces.
cpierr03 is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 06:12 PM
  #4  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Lansing, MI
Posts: 136
Total Cats: -5
Default

Subbed
WigglingWaffles is online now  
Old 01-03-2019, 06:23 PM
  #5  
Moderator
iTrader: (12)
 
sixshooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 18,130
Total Cats: 2,158
Default

And nitrodann says you can run stock 6 speeds on the track at, what did he say, 360 horsepower without failing? Total bull. Claims are not worth a **** until you have backup. A sample size of a couple does not a solution make.
sixshooter is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 06:41 PM
  #6  
Elite Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Staunton, Va
Posts: 3,011
Total Cats: 347
Default

OEM case. no improvement. Its a big pile of lying to the masses. I think they are kind of just delaying failure with stronger gears.

somewhat unrelated,here is a transmission meant for big power. 11.5" r&p. Even a world class manufacturer wont rate this as a race transmission. still call it a trans for Hi-hp street legal buggies. strong boxes aint cheap.

PS, I got to drive a car with this trans backed by 600 hp. It was glorious banging gears without a clutch.




https://weddleindustries.com/products/1000165/1004528

Last edited by ryansmoneypit; 01-03-2019 at 06:53 PM.
ryansmoneypit is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 06:44 PM
  #7  
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Woostuh, MA
Posts: 3,796
Total Cats: 101
Default

Originally Posted by ryansmoneypit View Post
OEM case. no improvement. Its a big pile of lying to the masses.
Right? That was my first question. From everything I've read, case flex was the issue. I wonder if there's external or internal bracing that can be done there, but even so... I'm not sure how this all helps when case flex causes the kablooeys.
ridethecliche is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 09:45 PM
  #8  
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (3)
 
emilio700's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 5,894
Total Cats: 1,641
Default

To be fair, most of the opinions on the cause of Miata 5 spd torque related failures are speculation. A specialist can identify the causes of failure that a non-specialist might miss. I have never seen any conclusive evidence that case flex is the sole factor in 5spd torque failures. Maybe it is.
Browsing through their site, I get the impression that he (they?) know what they are talking about. The claims of 300whp capacity for their stage 2 might be optimistic but my guess is that it does have a significantly raised capacity over an OEM rebuild. Curious to see what reports come in from the
Miataverse after a few folks try these boxes.
__________________


www.facebook.com/SuperMiata

949RACING.COM Home of the 6UL wheel

.27 SNR
emilio700 is online now  
Old 01-03-2019, 11:21 PM
  #9  
Tweaking Enginerd
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 880
Total Cats: 103
Default

I will be keeping a close eye on this. Wonder if these guys would let one of our more reputable vendors test one of these.
Ted75zcar is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 11:29 PM
  #10  
Senior Member
iTrader: (1)
 
TNTUBA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Chattanooga, Tn
Posts: 1,104
Total Cats: 205
Default

Here's the latest Transmission option for me.

TNTUBA is offline  
Old 01-03-2019, 11:30 PM
  #11  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Richmond, VA
Posts: 184
Total Cats: 39
Default

Originally Posted by Ted75zcar View Post
I will be keeping a close eye on this. Wonder if these guys would let one of our more reputable vendors test one of these.
Given the abundant supply of dirt cheap 5sp boxes it would be interesting to see side by side torture tests to failure😈
themonkeyman is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 12:06 AM
  #12  
Boost Pope
iTrader: (8)
 
Joe Perez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Chicago. (The non-murder part.)
Posts: 28,336
Total Cats: 2,596
Default

Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
Saw this pop up on the MT facebook group.

https://walter-motorsports.com/shop?...ission-5-speed

Shop advertises rebuilt 5 speeds that can take 300+ hp.
Links to people who have run this gearbox on the track with high-output engines?
Joe Perez is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 12:52 AM
  #13  
Elite Member
iTrader: (13)
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Taos, New mexico
Posts: 5,726
Total Cats: 274
Default

Subbd. I found this to be very interesting as well.

https://walter-motorsports.com/techn...on-differences
Fireindc is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 07:32 AM
  #14  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 106
Total Cats: 7
Default

Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
Links to people who have run this gearbox on the track with high-output engines?
I think this is what they really need. As Emilio said based on their site they do give the impression that they know what they are doing and are familiar with the Miata chassis on a grassroots motorsports level. So I don't doubt there is at least some merit to their claims, but they simply can't throw numbers like 300+hp out without providing some sort of reconcilable proof.

Show us the cars you guys run these in, the power they are making, and how they are using them.

Also, curious (if their methods actually work) if they could further strengthen the 6-speed as well.... Looks like one of their product photos has one hanging around int he background.

Last edited by cpierr03; 01-04-2019 at 07:53 AM.
cpierr03 is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 09:19 AM
  #15  
Elite Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Staunton, Va
Posts: 3,011
Total Cats: 347
Default

I might have to retract my statement a bit...

Thinking back to my VW days, Big turbos would spread the Transmission box open and allow the gears to shear, but the event left a lot of evidence. So, has anyone seen evidence of a 5 speed box cracking after a gear failure.? sheared mainshaft? less that round bearing bores?
ryansmoneypit is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 09:39 AM
  #16  
Tweaking Enginerd
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 880
Total Cats: 103
Default

I think they do say they are working on 6 speed enhancements on the site. We need data. If they are marketing to this community, they should be at least lurking here.
Ted75zcar is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 09:56 AM
  #17  
Elite Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Woostuh, MA
Posts: 3,796
Total Cats: 101
Default

Since I started this thread, I might follow through and give them a call or drop them an email with a link to this thread to see if they'd like to chime in. I'm sure they want to protect their product and whatever innovation they've done, but it would be neat if they were able to give more info and/or evidence about the trans surviving with the added power.
ridethecliche is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 10:10 AM
  #18  
Elite Member
iTrader: (14)
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Murfreesboro,TN
Posts: 1,511
Total Cats: 87
Default

They have been fairly forth coming on information on Facebook posts I've seen about their reasoning for their claims. They do have a degreed metallurgist on staff according to their post. They supposedly have been testing a few of their 300whp capable units on multiple cars, but nothing has been definitively shown yet. While I don't for see needing a 300whp capable 5 speed anytime soon, I am interested in the stud kit for a future 5 speed rebuild just for peace of mind.

They do work on 6 speeds for the NC's too. Not sure how much translates to the NB1/NB2/MSM variations. They have a few good options for improving their strength as well. I believe they are currently the ones building all the transmissions for the Spec MX-5 series (rental NCs)
Midtenn is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 11:52 AM
  #19  
Moderator
iTrader: (12)
 
sixshooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 18,130
Total Cats: 2,158
Default

Even if it did hold 300 horsepower, 300 horsepower is not enough.
sixshooter is offline  
Old 01-04-2019, 11:59 AM
  #20  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 106
Total Cats: 7
Default

I'm more interested if they could make a 6 speed reliable at 400whp and the kind of torques EFR builds push.

At their prices for 5 speed, I feel like most would just find a 6 speed + MR Shifter + gears for 300whp reliable.
cpierr03 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: Another Transmission Option?


Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

© 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.