Car died tonight...I don't think I want to fix it...
 

WTF? So I head out after school, meet a friend for a beer and head home.
Driving normally, no boost or anything I cruise to a stop and notice the smell of fuel...car seems to be running a bit rich. Light turns green, I get to 3rd gear (granny shifting at like 2.5k) and it loses power. I give it more throttle but nothing happens. It felt like I turned the key off. I try applying throttle again and get a loud backfire from the exhaust. I decide to pull over.

Once stopped I tried cranking the car. It turns over fine. Had a friend come help me and here are the observations-

Car has spark
Car has fuel
Checked all visible conectors
Plugs look normal
Cams turn over (not a broken t-belt)
Turning engine over results in nothing but the sound of an engine turning over
Turning engine over with throttle depressed 100% results in car huffing at times like it wants to fire......like a flooded engine....but it never fires. Tach slightly dithers at times.
Verified fuel pump primes when the key is turned on
Car was not having any problems when this happened..no over heating, oil leaks, coolant leaks, smoke....nothing.

This happened just before 11pm...and by the time I was done getting the car towed, I finally settled down to write this at 2:30am...I fuking tired and I don't know how motivated I am to figure this out. FML. At least I was on a surface street that wasn't busy and only 13 miles from home...and not on the interstate or far from home. Tow damage- $127.

Connect to the Hydra and see if you have RPM.

Fuck Hydra.

Hmm, sounds similar to an issue I had, when the fuel pump wasnt working. Can you jump it to keep it on like you can with NAs? I know you said you heard it priming, but worth a shot. Also worth a shot is plugging in a stock ecu and seeing if anything changes.

Jumped time?

I wish i had a better suggestion, you covered most the basics.

Had the same exact same problems when my CAS died

Same symptoms when I had cops problems (slight bit of oil on cops power wire connection). Car ran fine but would intermittently loose all power, I could always eventually get it going but there was often a large backfire (like an air bomb firecracker) just prior to functionality returning.

Mine was flooding due to intermittent spark and smelled like fuel before dying, the root cause was a small VC gasket knick that seeped oil onto cops wiring.

If you know you have spark, try unplugging the injector harness and crank. If it fires on what's in the cylinders, that suggests to me you may have an over fuelling issue (injectors / fpr), at a minimum it will clear your flooding (if that's the case).

Does it feel like it turns over faster than normal?

Did you hit a bump in the road when this happened?

I had a problem that seemed like the relay under the column (forget what it's called off the top of my head). Ended up being one of the relays in the fuse box being loose. The female contacts wore over time and were loose on the relay. Caused intermittent headaches for a good year.

I'm guessing fuel delivery.

Just hooked up the laptop- saw rpm when cranking and afrs dropped to 10 when cranking. Got one backfire when cranking. Damn. Was hoping to see no rpm or something that might make this easy.

I'm about to put like $300 up to who can come over and get the car running :/

Check your rectum for abrasions.

You need to get AAA. For less then $100 a year you can get free towing for up to 100 miles. Would have easily paid for this one tow.

Can you get a datalog and a video of you trying to start the car?

you smelled fuel and see AFRs go pigrich and it backfires...

this is a returnless system?

Yes, typical NB stock fuel system sans RC550s.

As for the tow- My insurance will reimburse me for the bill, so I'm not worried about it.

Will get video of the car trying to start when I get home.

I'm going to grab a compression tester just to make sure and pull the vc and timing covers off to make sure timing is on. This is strangely like what happened 2 years ago when I replaced the engine :( (I still don't know what happened to that engine- it had OK compression but wouldn't start).

Will try connecting the stock ECU to see what happens, but without an AFM and 550cc injectors, I don't know how successful that will be. I don't mind mechanical problems...stuff that is obviously broken, but sh!t like this (right now) makes me not want to even mess with it...

Here's a remotely unlikely idea...take off the valve cover and check if the cam timing wheel on the cam is ok or if it is loose.

I'm not very smart on the NB fuel system, but possible the regulator failed and you have shit tons of fuel pressure at the rail?

That's another thing I need to figure out how to check. So, how does one check fuel press. on a NB?

until you figure that out, you can look for vacuum lines that might have come off?

Or an injector went static? I had these exact symptoms on an 06 WRX with SHITTY PE850 injectors (almost as shitty as your RC's)...swapped to non-shitty injectors = car was peachy

Scenario was 100% exactly the same.

or that. there's something going on in that you're dumping in too much fuel.

Which is what I am wondering. What would cause injector(s) to go full tilt?
I have not heard of any problems with the RCs in Miatas....but I'm open to hearing cases of this in Miatas. If it were the injectors, what would be a good bet? IDs?

When tinkering with the car on the side of the road, I didn't check all of the plugs, just 1 and 3. I will check all 4 today when I get home.

Seems the best way to check fuel pressure on the NB is to pul lthe carpet up, and access the lines from the pump and add a t-fitting and go from there. Would be a good time to check the strainer as well.

Not sure what would cause this, but in the scoob I was tuning we just finished tuning it, having taken the injectors to about 80% IDC a few times while logging, and on the way back to the shop. He comes to a stop light, the car stalls. Takes like 10 tries when it finally fires back up, but is super weak. Strong fuel smell. A block later it dies again, this time not re-firing no matter how many times we tried. Fuel is pooling in the manifolds at this point. Got it towed. I tell him to replace injectors. He does. Car is 100% fine.

RC's are older then dirt, and ev1...or something. I wouldn't be surprised to see them fail. Most people I talked to wouldn't run them even if they were paid to do it.


Good luck
Hope that helps a little

I guess I can check that by pulling all the plugs and turning it over to see if any spray more vapor out over the others....which is something I was going to do anyway when I check all of them.

The quick-disconnects at all junctions in the NB fuel system make adding a t-fitting kinda difficult.

Here's how I would troubleshoot:

1. Bring up the Hydra software. With the car on (not started) make sure you have MAP signal! Make sure you have air temp sensor signal, water temp signal.

2. Visually Inspect crank angle sensor, cam angle sensor wiring, and wiring going to your coils. If your cam angle wiring is fuxed car will be unhappy but may still run with Hydra.

3. Disconnect Fuel rail line from hard line in engine bay. Turn key, and when pump primes make sure fuel flows out of hard line. A lot of fuel should flow out.

4. Reconnect Line. Crank car for ten seconds with throttle closed. Pull plugs and look at them. If one is not wet then you have an injector problem.

5. While plugs are out, connect them to your cops and lay them on your valve cover. Crank the car with the throttle wide open. Visually check that each plug is happily sparking.

6. Vacuum leak test, compression test.


My bet though is that it is a problem with an injector or plug. Or maybe a coil pack. I have an 03 coil pack I can sell you if that's the problem. If it is a coil pack, you will have problems on two cylinders. If one cylinder is down it will sound like a diesel. If two cylinders are down it won't sound like anything because the car won't run.

Why don't you have AAA?

e: Didn't actually read the thread before posting, just stunned at the idea of someone driving a heavily modified car WITHOUT having an AAA membership. (Or really driving anything anywhere ever without one.)

Why would you pay extra for that? My insurance covers towing for a whopping $4 per car every six months. So, 16 bucks a year covers towing.

checking the MAP signal is a good idear.

Because of this....

lol!

It's apparently a massive problem which every MK2.5 suffers from in the UK (If you believe some people). It's not that bad but it does happen.

So definitely check the pressed on timing wheel on the back of the intake cam isn't loose/has moved.

I'll bet it was that damn sasquatch!

I check nb fuel pressure where the fuel line first goes into that pulsation dampener thingy by the passenger shock tower. My master fuel pressure tester has an adapter that will fit but will not lock, requiring you to manually hold the two ends together while someone else does the cranking/ko test.

It sounds computer related to me, but it never hurts to check around the injector harness for bare wiring or something that would have rubbed through and contacted metal causing a stuck on injector or four. :party:

I drive 300 miles each way to Lake Havasu City every month or two in the vette, and I don't have towing or AAA. :giggle:

Dop, did you figure out what was going on with your NB?

I honestly have not even touched the car since it was towed home on Wednesday night. I want to get someone to come over and go over the car with me as an outside point of view.
I really am stumped about it though...and am pretty discouraged :/

I have to agree with what someone said earlier about AAA. AAA has helped me out so many times when I've been stuck in similar situations. You can get 7 tows for what you paid for in one night. It's a good investment. But don't be discouraged on wanting to get the miata back on the road! A second opinion from someone by you will help!

Oh, on the subject of towing- When I went into my State Farm rep. to get my refund check, they said that they recently added a new service for towing. Now, insted of paying the bill and filing for reimbursement, you just call a 1-800 number and they find a truck and send it out. Nice to know this now. So no more paying for tows.

You should follow the troubleshooting checklist i posted. If MAP line fell off you would be very rich cranking.

Oddly enough, that was one of the first things I checked.

Well, I figured out why there is so much fuel is getting by. I have fuel, I have spark.....but I have no compression.
1- 75psi
2- 79psi
3- 75psi
4- 76psi

So...W T F??
I want to say no way is it a bad engine..not all 4 cylinders like that. It was a sudden loss of power while driving at low rpm and not in boost. I'm thinkin something cam/VVT related...was told by Jeremy @ FM to lock the cam gears together and put a wrench on the cam and see if it moves at all...indicating a funked VVT system.

too even to be bad motor...but there's obviously something preventing full compression...

HAS to be something with timing, intake and exhaust valves overlapping or something.

Snapped cam or damaged Woodruff key?

you done jumped some teeth on dat dem der timin belt boy

Herpderp.

Ever check on this??

I could be an asshole and say that you pointed out the only other big possibility :brain: But I won't haha. I hadn't had the time to pull the t-belt covers off and inspect the timing yet and I don't have a compression gauge, otherwise the comp. check would have been done on day one :( But, yes, you called it :makeout:

Unfortunately I will not be able to work on the car until next Tuesday...yay. I don't know if I even want to bother with it and just have the car towed to R*Speed and have Hector find and fix the problem.

I did something good?

You never do anything good, Scott....never. You got my hopes up, but they were only crushed by reality. I hate you! Get out of my life! Why do you keep doing this to me?!?!?! WHY SCOTT?? WHY????????

lol. sorry, i have the effect on women mostly.

OMG! I got a "lol" form Le Great One! Time to go 'bate!!

So it IS a jumped belt? Or you don't know yet and just think it is?

Dunno if it's a jumped belt or a funk in the VVT syste or something else related to the cams. I did take a video of the car trying to start though....doesn't sound right...

sounds kinda like shuiend's when his VVT cam was incorrectly installed and his vlaves were comepltely out of sync.

but i think your cam might have broke...you're not getting RPMs on the dash, which means youre not reading off the cam sensor...

I don't recall ever seeing rpms jump up when starting, only after the engine has fired :dunno:

I know jack about NBs.

Or Hydra :rofl:

s'all good though...the mechanical systems are pretty much the same...suck, squish, bang, blow.

yeah, but i think your intake cam has dun gone dun somfin silly.

The intake cam has been Hyperized :bowrofl:

You just summed up MT:party:

I can work with that.


When you see it: bricks.

Winning!!!!

Bricks have dropped.

:)

Oh lawd I dunn did seen it:idea:
EHMAHGERDDD:laugh: