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Old 04-21-2015, 03:16 AM   #1
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Default Help, Online Vendor shortchanged me of parts.

Good day, MiataTurbo.Net

I need help to understand the purchasing process of America. I'm in Singapore and I've purchased items from Fab9.

I had ordered COP from him 3 months ago along with ECU, Wideband, injectors. The goal was the COP, the AEM was needed to support the COP.

I tried posting messages on his subforum, but I think he is the administrator of the forum and was able to delete my messages.

2 month ons. I've not received my oil pump.
2 months on. I've not received my suspension bushings.
3 months on. I've not received the COP.
2 weeks ago. I received the wideband, 2 months after it was ordered.
3 months on. The AEM is still not configured, waiting for the final COP part.

I paid for everything in full, amounting up to a princely sum of USD $4500. I know its not alot of money in the States but it's still hard earned cash. In Singapore dollars it amounts up to SGD$7000. Thats a lot of money where I'm at. That is 2 months pay.

In the short time, that my thread was up, I received props for it. That tells me that I was not alone and someone else shared my plight.

I've had my miata for 8 years and have been reading the forums and using the information on the forums to decide the vendor to make my purchases from. I didn't see any negative information during my research but I know now that such post can be deleted.

What kind of recourse do I have on the issue? What can I do to get my money back? Are there any consumer protection which could benefit me?
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Old 04-21-2015, 03:33 AM   #2
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You've been refunded for the items you did not receive, you've since created a second PayPal dispute for items you have received and I'm going to let PayPal resolve it. Your consumer protection is PayPal and it will be resolved accordingly.

I've offered a partial refund for your troubles because we take responsibility for the missing items. I've also offered to simply ship the items you were missing and you've denied it, at this point we don't have any options but to allow the PayPal dispute to play it's role, this is why we have "seller protection" as well.

I'm sure the feeling is mutual but it's been the most time consuming and unpleasant of experiences to have dealt with you. I've tried to reason on a number of levels and I think it's best we let your buyer protection through PayPal deal with the situation.
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Old 04-21-2015, 06:16 AM   #3
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Without knowing the whole back story, I'm not sure how there is any issue here. Someone gives you 2 months pay for goods and service. On the day you receive payment you put those goods in a box and ship them, transaction over.

If you don't have the goods available, you give the client the date that they will be available. If on that date you still don't have the goods, you refund the clients money, apologize and ask for their business again in the future once you have your inventory worked out. Transaction over.

I don't see how this is time consuming or difficult. If the above two scenarios have played out then the transaction is over. But if someone gives you two months pay and they don't get what they pay for in the agreed upon time frame ...they have every right to be difficult, upset, unreasonable and to call, email and pester you every day until they get their goods or a full refund.
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Old 04-21-2015, 08:17 AM   #4
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I agree with you. But for lack of mention, you don't know the back story. A simple order placed would have been just that. Instead I have a search folder in Outlook dedicated to this customer.

Every step of the way there was something difficult and part of me believes that the customer simply got ahead of himself and ordered the wrong items without having an idea of the big picture, but honestly it's been so sporadic who knows at this point.

- Custom Infinity ECU harness requested, produced for a 94 and shipped. Then he decides he's going to use a VVT engine harness so he'd like a connector and a pin out of how to adapt it. (All of this against our original recommendation of a simple EMS4 configuration due to the fact that for his build the Infinity offered no additional features that would benefit him.)
- Every other email he would add/remove items or request special order items that we either don't inventory or usually don't offer but had the ability to access. Only once did he say "let's ship these items" so for the longest time in my eyes, it was an open order waiting to finalize before making an international shipment.

To sum up why I considered the process "time consuming and difficult": There were literally 7-8 emails over the course of 5 days discussing how we could change the color of the anodized adapters on the ID injectors because he didn't like the color they came in. One day he's frustrated about communication and making threats, the next day he's asking for additional parts. Never have I put so much effort into communication, trying to accommodate someone.

Bottom line - the line items missing from his order have been refunded (only after offering to provide them and an apology + offering to simply refund $200 for his trouble). We're now sitting on special order parts that have not been paid for and he has a PayPal dispute open for items he did receive and confirmed the receipt of. I'm looking forward to letting PayPal resolve this because I'm spent and I'm sure the regret is mutual.
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:46 AM   #5
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I'll add my two bits and be done with it.

Almost all my purchases through Bryan have been special order parts that weren't available through his website or stocked in his inventory. All of my dealings went extremely smooth and getting a hold of him got me a response in less than an hour, or at least a message letting me know when he had time to look into the problem.

You have to realize when you make a special order you can't just back out of the order. It is "special order" for a reason, and it is your responsibility to know exactly what you need for your application because you are on the hook for it regardless of it working or not. The vendor usually doesn't have full knowledge on a special order, unless background was given, and opinion asked, as to what you are doing with the part, and will order it for you.

Ive spent many a months wages on parts with him and never had an issue getting a hold of him when a problem arose. I have an especially hard time having pity for you after hearing his side of the story in contrast to yours.

No vendor is perfect, **** happens, life gets busy, but don't go waxing piously as the taken advantage of customer.
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:34 AM   #6
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There are always 2 sides to a story. Bryan, Maybe its time we told them both sides? With your permission, may I paste transcripts of our emails, so the community may have a better understanding of the situation?

You hide behind very nice responses like your initial email replies, but once the money is in your pocket, we are left hanging.

A COP that takes 3 months. MiataTurbo acknowledges this as acceptable?
An ECU that arrives after 6 weeks, MiataTurbo acknowledges this as acceptable?
An wideband that arrives after 9 weeks, with an ECU sitting idle, MiataTurbo acknowledges this as acceptable?

These are not special order items. These are items listed for sale on Fab9.

Reference the following links. I am not alone in this issue.

Fab9? - MX-5 Miata Forum

Fab9 Tuning Coil on Plug setup

https://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtop...65393&start=75

[NA] Fab9 TERRIBLE EXPERIENCE - MX-5 Miata Forum


There is a systematic pattern here. Things like this don't just happen to one person. There is a pattern.
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:44 AM   #7
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There is no way to make everyone happy all the time. As initially presented it did appear to be sour grapes on the part of the seller. But after hearing a further explication I'm not quite sure that's the case.

If the parts have shipped and the money has been returned for the parts that havent....I don't see how this is an issue for the buyer any longer.
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Old 04-21-2015, 10:46 AM   #8
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I don't believe anyone is acknowledging the delays as acceptable. Also given the circumstance, I've apologized and I'm sympathetic towards you. I have come to the conclusion that I can't please everyone despite my efforts.

That being said this is something that I have an will continue making an effort to resolve within reason. Before mentioning you'd like to return items, you've created a PayPal dispute and we're now at the mercy of their better judgement.
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