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Old 01-10-2008, 05:38 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Sleeper_MX5 View Post
it looks to fat and big
Oh *****. The ****** NC Miata weighs 50 pounds more than a 2005 fully loaded miata. Don't give me that fat and big ****.

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daily driver, and low 13s on the 1/4? i uderstand that this car is only doing high 14s in the 1/4. what's the stock boost on these car anways?
You won't get low 13 second quarters out of a Stock MSM. They're low 14 second cars factory stock, and the NC miata has basically the same power. The turbo on the MSM is a very small IHI unit that could be upgraded, but its very laggy and pretty much maxed out on flow with its measly 7.5psi.

If I had my MSM to do over again, I'd have ripped the factory manifold to tail pipe off and done a DIY manifold, T3/T4, upgraded boost pipes and FMIC, most likely a megasquirt. You have to consider there is possible power to gain from the MSM, at 7.5psi with a cheeze dick turbo you've got 170hp...

Problem with MSMs they're too expensive and the market isn't there for them. I got mine in Feb 2006, Jewed (pardon my expression) a mazda dealership out of it hard core. Seen the car sitting there for seven months because there was a $19,999.95 sticker on it, which is what everyone trys to sell them for. Had 21,000 miles and I offered them 15k. Three weeks later they called back and accepted my offer, drove it for 18k miles and sold it to a dodge dealership for $17,590. I do miss my little MSM though.


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Old 01-10-2008, 05:42 PM   #22
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paul had a msm turbo in his car before the 2560. he was pushing 17+ psi on that turbo. where did u get 7.5 from? flynmx5 now has that turbo an i believe hes running it around 10psi himself
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Old 01-10-2008, 06:03 PM   #23
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with the 3" exhaust and custom intercooler and intake piping the MSM turbo on my 99 motor was making ~240hp to the wheels. With all that restriction taken out on the intake and exhaust sides the boost was creeping and I was seeing 17-19 on the cooler days. it spooled quick and pulled hard to redline. Instead of modifying the wastegate opening I chose to swap out the kit and go with a GT2560R. which i had to modify in the same way because it was making 17psi with the stock wastegate actuator. go figure
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Old 01-10-2008, 06:55 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan View Post
If I had my MSM to do over again, I'd have ripped the factory manifold to tail pipe off and done a DIY manifold, T3/T4, upgraded boost pipes and FMIC, most likely a megasquirt. You have to consider there is possible power to gain from the MSM, at 7.5psi with a cheeze dick turbo you've got 170hp...
Which would pretty much be a 99-00 with an aftermarket kit and a suspension upgrade. only the 99-00 idea would be less money.
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Old 01-10-2008, 07:12 PM   #25
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Oh nice. I was of the impression from a couple places there wasn't much left for the MSM turbo, but I didn't care to look any further into it. Bought it stock, sold it stock. Everything from the tires to the air filter.
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:09 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan View Post
Oh *****. The ****** NC Miata weighs 50 pounds more than a 2005 fully loaded miata. Don't give me that fat and big ****.



You won't get low 13 second quarters out of a Stock MSM. They're low 14 second cars factory stock, and the NC miata has basically the same power. The turbo on the MSM is a very small IHI unit that could be upgraded, but its very laggy and pretty much maxed out on flow with its measly 7.5psi.

If I had my MSM to do over again, I'd have ripped the factory manifold to tail pipe off and done a DIY manifold, T3/T4, upgraded boost pipes and FMIC, most likely a megasquirt. You have to consider there is possible power to gain from the MSM, at 7.5psi with a cheeze dick turbo you've got 170hp...

Problem with MSMs they're too expensive and the market isn't there for them. I got mine in Feb 2006, Jewed (pardon my expression) a mazda dealership out of it hard core. Seen the car sitting there for seven months because there was a $19,999.95 sticker on it, which is what everyone trys to sell them for. Had 21,000 miles and I offered them 15k. Three weeks later they called back and accepted my offer, drove it for 18k miles and sold it to a dodge dealership for $17,590. I do miss my little MSM though.



In my opinion the NC is so UGLY! and research says it doesn't handle as well...
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Old 01-12-2008, 11:31 AM   #27
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I am opposite of what most here would say. If you find a decent MSM for a decent price (and thats a big if because people want way more than they are worth), get it. You can make plenty of power on it. I have seen it done on my friends MSM and you have a factory support up to a certain point.
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Old 01-12-2008, 12:57 PM   #28
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MSM's are still in the $14k-$18k for a decent example.

For that, you can find a low mileage late model NB, plus a full Begi system and some decent suspension.
This:
http://www.miata.net/cgi-bin/isc/cla...revaction=show
Plus any Begi Series X w/Xede:
http://www.bellengineering.net/Pages...bosystems.html
Plus:
Konis, Sways, Springs, and some decent rubber...

You've spent less than this: http://www.miata.net/cgi-bin/isc/cla...revaction=show and it will be twice as fast and nobody will suspect.

In the end with the MSM, your biggest limitation is the ECU. The turbo still has plenty of room to grow, but the rest of the turbo hardware is a little small to support quick spool and/or high numbers. I believe they dyno stock at around 145whp.
Switching over to Xede/Hydra/Injectors/Exhaust/BigIC (like you would with any other Miata) and turning up the boost can get you plenty of power... but why buy an MSM in the first place unless you are in love with the F&F styling.
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Old 01-12-2008, 01:59 PM   #29
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the MSM has a better suspension set up from the factory than the 99 sport. Stiffer springs, extra bracing, bilsteins. You really do not need to do much to it except maybe revalve the bilsteins and an alignment.
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Old 01-12-2008, 02:27 PM   #30
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I picked up my 99 with 48K miles for just over 6k. That would leave me $7k in modifications. there isn't a stock MSM in the world that could hang with a $6k 99 with $7k in mods.

Don't get me wrong I like the MSM. I have MSM parts on my car.To me it doesn't have the bang for the buck at this point.
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Old 01-12-2008, 02:28 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MX5-4me View Post
I picked up my 99 with 48K miles for just over 6k. That would leave me $7k in modifications. there isn't a stock MSM in the world that could hang with a $6k 99 with $7k in mods.

Don't get me wrong I like the MSM. I have MSM parts on my car.To me it doesn't have the bang for the buck at this point.
This man speaks truth
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Old 01-12-2008, 03:49 PM   #32
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The only mazdaspeed I would buy is the 3!
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Old 01-12-2008, 04:41 PM   #33
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This man speaks truth
Thats why my first post said if you can find one at a decent price (which is hard). I have seen them for 8~9K before in excellent condition. I know I almost got one before I got my 99 sport.

Lately they MSM owners must be on crack because most people seem to want 17~18k and up for them. Hell dealers were letting them go for around 16k brand new at one point. No way I would pay more than 10k for one.
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Old 01-12-2008, 05:30 PM   #34
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I have a MSM and have had it for about 2 years. The stock turbo is propriatary as stated but there are a few compressor wheel upgrades availble on the aftermarket...price range 300-700 dollars. You can get 250 rwhp or more out of these cars fairly cheap. With nothing but an AEM intake and manual boost controller I put down 185rwhp on the dyno. The factor intake is very restrictive. Factory PSI is 7.5 You can run 10.5 before you hit the factory boost cut. A couple of $1 resistors and 5 minutes under the hood you can remove the boost cut. I usually run around 10-12 PSI. You can also buy a full turbo replacent from Begi or FM with your choice of turbos. With aftermarket engine managment, 460 injectors, CAI, FM or Begi DP, and exhaust you could easily see 220-240 rwhp. Get the turbo upgrade for around 400-500 and you'll be over 260 headed north towards 300rwhp. THe suspension is pretty dencent from the factory. FM springs, or a few other out there will improve it. I personnally found the factory suspesion to be plenty unless you plan it to be a track car. The cars can be had for less than 16K if you look around. Most of the parts I've mentioned are simple bolt on stuff.
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Old 01-12-2008, 05:36 PM   #35
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Oh, on the lag issue, it's not really that the car has bad turbo lag, it's an open/close loop issue with the ECU. The ECU sucks and you feel a surge of boost around 5000 RPM. That can be fixed with a FM O2 signial modifer.
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Old 01-14-2008, 02:01 AM   #36
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does anyone know if he MSM have different internals?
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Old 01-14-2008, 10:07 AM   #37
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I think the pistons are forged but that's about it. I'm not 100% sure on that either.
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