my xtd is a peice of shit *carnage added*
 

i hate this fucking thing what a fucking waste. first it has an issue with not disengauging fully. ran out of adjustment on the pedal so i was stuck with having my engagment point about 1/2 inch off the floor. that made me pissed. then throw out bearing started making noise. now on day 7 the throw out bearing is shot probly seized and that means my presure plate forks are probly fucked to hell now and the damn thing only has about 170 miles on it. never got it to even go in gear smooth cause the clutch never disengaged enough. i am running a brand new cmc and slave. looks like i gotta take the tranny BACK out and see wtf.

act ... i didnt want to, but it looks like i may have to let you rape my wallet.

Dam, that sucks. Any chance of a refund?

I had a new clutch disintigrate once but it was because my flywheel was warped. I hate to have to do something twice, especially when its not my fault.

act pedal position sits on the floor too.

exactly. ill see if its refund worthy when i get it out.

What's the name of the clutch you are running?

says on the thread name

Thats weird. I had one in a 220hp miata and it was fine. The engagment was actually high, about and inch or two from the top. As a matter of fact, I drove the hell out of that clutch everyday and never once had a problem.

Maybe one thing you pay more for is simply consistent quality. I was going to buy one when my clutch gives up. Hmm.

Gosh darn brother that sux. :vash:

B4 you go let ACT RAPE you try SPEC!

I have a spec stage II and it feels like stock! Also holds my sub-200hp set-up with no issues!

If you need more holding pwr just get a stage 3-4. Goodluck!

yeah I have an xtd and also think its pretty much crap. but my engagement point is also rather high

yea, mine sucks but i am sure there are guys that have good luck. i read enough good posts about them to give them a try looks like i may have a dud. but once again i wont know till i take it out. if i can still use my disk whats a good presure plate for 220 wtq holding capacity that wont cost much? i have a feeling that the xtd's got eaten up by the seized up throw out bearing.

yeah, spend almost as much on a spec and risk doing it all over again. get a fucking ACT XT and be done with it. I don't know why so many on this forum try to save a few bucks on one of the most important parts of the car and the biggest bitch to replace.

A good quality $330 277tq clutch is NOT expensive.

I am very hesitant to buy an ACT because the pedal position is so low, and I don't want to deal with pressing the pedal down into the carpet to get the clutch to disengage for first gear.

it isn't. i've driven cars that engage off the floor and i know that it sucks. my act doesn't.

My buddies car and the TDR car both sit on the floor. I'm going to take a risk either way, one might fail, one might be such a pain in the ass to drive that its not worth the additional $100.

well the position is so low it never disengages all the way. so when i put in first it goes clanggg. and then 2nd 3rd and 4th and 5th go crunch... just because of this i will not beable to compete at all. everything needs to work. no matter how cheap it is if i pay money for somthing it just has to work... sorry.

is the pressure plate what decides your pedal height? if so... what is one that can hold 220tq and 220 hp and has height that is normal with what ever pedal presure, i could care less.

My buddy has the same problem on his 1.8. The clutch adjuster is adjusted to the max level, and you have to smash the pedal into the carpet to get it disengaged. A guy at DXD clutches supposedly recognized this problem, and made some adjustments on their miata clutch.

i love my xtd clutch. if pedal height is the problem, you just need to adjust your clutch pedal

there is not enough adjustment for these shitty clutches.

thats with it adjusted :squint:

You can do other things to adjust the clutch action. I'm using a 626 flywheel, b2000 clutch fork, b2000 throwout and a Miata 1.8 clutch/pp/disc. I used the length of the of the slave rod to get the action I wanted. What I noticed with a lot of the Miatas is there is a lot of slack between the slave rod and the fork. So if you're out of pedal adjustment, simply extending the rod will initiate clutch disengagement sooner.

Another thing to check is the throwout bearing. The thickness of the bearing assembly dictates when disengagement initiates. I once had a pressure plate that had an extra large bore at the diaphragm springs so the inner part of the TO bearing actually fit in the space between and that left the outer part of the bearing to press on the springs- but not enough to disengage the pp.

- rob

are your guys clutch forks bent or something? i just had to barley adjust mine, pedal height and pressure feels stock.

i have to question their ability to make each clutch the same.

to what m2cupcar said. thats true but this clutch seems to be funny with that. it begins to re engage very low... the prob, BUT it also never grabs fully untill the pedal is very high. if i were to extend the length of the slave it would ride the throwout bearing because its only fully engaged way up at the top of the pedal movement.

would my having a brand new clutch master cylinder and slave cylinder be causing my issue you think?

So I guess when you do the clutch install, you can measure the height of the TOB on top of the pressure plate, then try different parts to get the pedal in the right spot?

I don't doubt that. For sure the first thing to go when products get cheap is QC and the customer support that backs up the product. That's the risk you take and go into knowing it might be a bad experience. I've had bad clutches from brainstorm and spec. But I've also had good clutches from brainstorm, and others from spec.

I don't recommend removing all the tolerance from the slave piston to slave rod to fork, just anything that's obviously excessive. I have fixed one "stock" Miata clutch by tacking a nut on the end of the slave rod because there was nothing else to be done at the time and the car need to go back together. That left about 1/16" of "slack" so the TO bearing wasn't riding on the pp springs.

All the stuff I suggest was merely work-arounds to try. There is a point where nothing will fix an improperly built clutch. If your slave hasn't fully "self bled", then yes, that can improve your situation. After I swapped mine it was hard to get in gear, but after 300 miles it's perfect.

I must say that I considered the cheap clutch route, but after having the spec fail on me (again) I opted to fork over the dough for a quality disc (clutchnet IMO) and it's been great so far.

I think at this point if you decide to pull the trans you should be able to figure out what the problem is and replace that part. Of course you'll be running the same risk with the other parts, but I'd say at this point that if they're within spec and have worked up to this point, they'll probably be ok. I've seen the xtd disc and it's construction looks to be on par with most other discs... except my clutchnet. ;)

so some throw out bearings are differne sizes from eachother?

also... can i get a clutchnet pressure plate and still use my xtd disk and fix my pedal height issue and still hold the 220 whp?

heres $120 act disk,its a 6 puck.i think its cheap because it is unsprung.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ACT-X...78088363QQrdZ1

Attachment 216881

good throw out bearing vs xtd throw out bearing... hummm

thought it sounded kinda funny :gay: when i hit the clutch pedal

took the tranny out and i heard those peices fall out...

pressure plate looks good but i dont want my engagement point so low, can i go to a different pressure plate to fix it?

I'd say that the from manufacturer to manufacturer the tolerances would be very close for each specific model- not enough to make a significant difference. On the flip side if the other stuff is far enough out of tolerance, the wrong TO bearing could make the difference- being thicker would cause it to disengage sooner. All these parts are fundamentally the same. Unfortunately it's the research that takes all the time. It's either digging thru factory specs, or finding the used parts and checking them. Another option is just going to the parts store with a set of calipers and getting the parts guy to bring a bunch of parts to the counter. Just depends on the guy. I've done it. When I was looking for hoses the guys at autozone just sent me behind the counter and let me do all the work. ;)

As far as your current situation, you need to figure out exactly where your problem lies before determining what's going to fix it. Hopefully it lies within one piece that's way out of spec. Then you'll what to buy... or fix.

IMO this is where one gets burned buying the cheap stuff - if it is bad, then you're left with nothing but time wasting activities trying to fix your problem. It just depends on what you have to spend - time or money.

IF it were me, I'd probably start looking for a TO bearing that had the same bore size as the Miata shaft sleeve and check thicknesses. All you'd need to do is head down to the parts store and ask for a few of them- like the Escort GT/protege LX, ~88 B2000, 82 rx7, 88rx7... Makes a $300 clutch kit look cheap - eh? ;) - rob

did you check your slave-rod-fork tolerance? You might be able to fix some of that there, by tightening that up (but not removing all of it, to preven any constant pressure to the crank). Measure the total thickness of the trashed TO bearning too- if you can. That might reveal the source of the late disegagement. At least I hoping that was the problem since it fell apart. It takes very little movement for the clutch to disengage, so a failed bearing could be that amount taken away from the movement.

i just cant understand how people just sit back after somthing like this happens. sorry but if i buy somthing... say a toaster and the element burns out, it goes back and i get a new one.. no matter the brand. this is bull shit that you would even consider "rigging" it with parts from other cars. it shoudl work the way it is. but it dosnt so this shit is getting sent back. its probly caused enough damage to my transmission as it is.

I really think it's a calculated loss by the companies selling these products. It's the reason they are so much cheaper than a product that actually involves heavy coordination between the contracted manufacture and the company the ultimately sells the product. In your case, it really depends on the retailer you purchased it from and how they back up the product. But as often the case with the "chinese" products, the retailer's overhead is also so low that they'd rather lose a repeat customer than work a refund or even exchange a product. I hope that's not your case. Try them first, if no luck, then figure out exactly what is out of spec and causing the problem and replace that part with a "reputable" one.

Odd position for a guy running MS to take. The clutch was a calculated risk, just like MS.

But I DO feel bad for ya, and wish you the best of luck getting it warrantied or replaced.

will do, contacted the seller.

people consider ms a risk? that is the best investment i have made... well other than my poly bushings.. god i love these things!!!

can i not get a good answer on this... if i use the pressure plate from a different company will that change my pedal? (assuming i am using a stock miata tob)

i wouldnt have a prob eating the cost of the clutch i guess as long as i can use the disk. i just want it to work and i dont want the pedal on the floor.

Yes IF the geometry is different, no if it's exactly the same as the XTD. There's a lot of peices to the clutch setup and each controls a portion of the action.

sounds to me like i need alot infront of me to compare, which i do not have the ability to do. looks like ill change the tob and hope it was defecting and hope my pedal height changes, or hope for a return and get another clutch. either way this will put my plans out about 1 month and i have already missed half the fucking year's events i wanted to go to and its still not even tuned.

coudl i accually fix the issue with not being able to disengage my clutch fully, by moving the clutch fork pivot ball over to the side of the case a little and making my own clutch fork?

Yes, but it would be easier to change the postioning of the TO bearing by adjusting the end of the fork. Did you trash all your old clutch parts?

I still think it would be worthwhile to find out exactly which part is caused the problem, and why the TO failed. That might keep this or part of it from happening again. One thing that will tear up the TO bearing is too large of a center bore on the diaphragm springs- if the TO gets cocked on pedal action it's toast.

well it looks like the part that the tob slides on (input shaft surround) has been ruined by the throwout bearing also. :vash: what is this part called (hoping it is a part)

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l1...o/DSCF0519.jpg

i would like to know what caused it also... but i cant tell. not really anyway for me to find out either. :(

I just install this clutch /xtd,stage 3/ ,and I cant shift any gear. Is it possible, that the problem is that I have got NB miata? /99, 1,6 81kW/

All the clutch assemblies are interchangeable. So if you're using the 1.6 clutch kit, you must use a 1.6 flywheel- and same for the 1.8 flywheel with the 1.8 clutch kit.

MXV- you can replace that part. It just unbolts and swaps out. My guess is your TO bearing failing (collapsed) and that removed the "spacing" you needed to disengage the clutch. The wear in the photo above is collateral damage. Did you trash the broken TO bearing yet? If not, check the contact ring in the bearing with the center bore on the pp springs.

new tranny is in already with new throwout bearing. that part btw.. is 75 dollars. so i just used the new tranny's and just replaced the gasket and seal for it. lets hope it works now. i think the slave cylinder was the culprit. fingers crossed for getting it tuned on sunday.

to intially start my car with this clutch it hard a hard time cuase it was engaged and took down the rpms, couldnt get it in gear at all so i had to start it in 1st and let it slip and try to wear on the disk to wear off any extra material. after that i could get it in 1st with some effort then it got easier and easier but still not satisfactory. i am hoping once i get to the 500 mile break in mark it will go in gear really easy and in the mean time ill just try to rev match as much as possible and try to save my syncro's. if its still not satisfactory at 1000 miles i am getting an act. but i am going to give it one more try.

when my clutch grenaded and locked up, I just cranked the car up in first- the starter got it rolling and I just drove off. I guess that's one advantage to a 4.10 and a 2.0 liter ;)

I wrote to aimcoclutch ,and the answer was - "check your slave and master cylinder or clutch cable" But I ve got all in good and working condition,also with old clutch parts. I dont know what to do,
....just cranked the car up in first gear... is so drastic for my car , I am afraid of doing this.

no no - that's only if you're stranded and need to get rolling, not for daily use. If you install a new clutch and everything else is within spec, then something's wrong with the clutch kit. Sounds like the same problem MXV is having- can't disengage the clutch. There's something that's created accessive tolerance and won't allow the pedal action to push the diaphragm springs far enough- most likely. The only wark-around (w/o pulling the trans) is to remove the slack in the slave rod and fork IF there is any. And that's no guarantee either. As you can see from the pic, if the TO bearing is fried, the trans needs to be pulled anyway.

i had to replace one of those transmission parts on my supra once. it was called a front bearing retainer. some transmission guys have them sitting around, assuming its one of our popular 5 speeds, i dont think it would be all that hard to find. if you find one used from a local guy, they'll probably sell you the part for like $20 or less.

i just put in the 1.8 tranny in my other car. mazda i think called it the rear clutch plate or somthing. i wanna say that the pivot point on the clutch fork isnt optimal for these clutches, if i could change that i would get a stiffer pedal but regain clutch movement. i would say move the tob closer the pressure plate or bring the pressure plate closer but all that will do is help it disenage but then it will have problems fully engages as it seems these clutch use the whoole pedal movement which is odd. the only real fix i can think of is the clutch fork pivot point. that would require me to cut off the tower the ball is on and weld it further away from the center of teh tranny and use a whole saw to cut the indentation on the clutch fork and moving it over also and welding it back in. really it should be a free fix for me but longevity and reliability might be compromised and id have to make sure i moved it just the right amount on both the clutch fork and ball mount or i will ruin my pedal feel. probly be a trial and error thing if anything else.

hey mxv, take a few more pics I'll see if my "spare" tranny has those parts, if you havent got them already. shit if you were in san diego you could just have it.

wait did you allready replace the tranny?

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l1...DSCF0519-1.jpg

yep, thanks though i would have taken you up on it if i didnt have the parts car. ill probly get my old one welded and machined and polished for super slick tob intercourse action and use that on my back up tranny wish i sure hope i wont need, alot with my back up clutch and diff and axles... god i love miatas

god my undercoat looks like shit on flash :(

xtd clutch 3- piece off shit
 

Problem with my xtd clutch kit is with pressure plate - specially its inlet diameter.
It is not possible for bearing /bearing which is include of xtd stage 3 kit is the same size as oem/ to push enough on pressure plate to disangage clutch plate from flywheel.
Solution is a bearing with bigger inlet size or pressure plate with smaller inlet size.
Inlet diameter of oem pressure plate is about 0,5 inch smaller.
Sorry of my english, I hope you understand me, photz included.

I dont know what to do ,bearing is atypical and it is no way to modify pressure plate. Maybe I will apply old oem pressure plate and 6 puck disc (:

This is exactly what happened to me with a brainstorm clutch. At the time (race) I had to swap it out for a JR and just sent it back to BS. I wouldn't be surprised if that's what happened to mxv too- and the spring ends eventually "grabbed" the TO bearing and the destruction began.

You need to try and get a refund - or fixed swap first. That's absurd, and application independent. Doesn't matter what car it's for, it won't work. Did you compare the TO bearing to your original TO bearing?

I ve got little bit problem with english shortcut JR- jackson racing? bs- brainstorm? TO bearing is bearing which is on my photo ,I hope.
I dont believe that is really posible to sell something like this anywhere in the world, nor in us fair, ... The answer from fucking aimco clutch will be- check your clutch cable again or adjust your slave clutch cylinder or something stupid like this. Yes the bearing is exactly the same like oem.

Yes, you're correct. Unfortunately this is the risk you run when you buy anything if quality control misses something. Seems the cheaper the product the greater the risk, and after the sale, the more difficult it is to get some justice.

Have you sent them a photo? They really don't have anything worthy of reply other than "Yes, it's wrong." But then again, if they don't care about customer service, they'll tell you tough. If that's the case, I have some ideas that might get the pp to work.

I must wait for answer, then we will see ,thanks, of course I send them those photoz

well i got it running again with the new tranny and the tob i used to have in it a year ago because i know that one worked. for some reason it disengages perfectly now and does it at about mid pedal feels like stock and i love it!!

my xtd rocks my world

elecktron you might check out some other brands of bearings to see if the spring mating ring has a different radius. I notice there's a difference between the two in your pic, so maybe there's others that have a flared surface that might span the gap enough to seat the springs properly.

So the moral of the story is to use an OEM throw out bearing with the XTD clutch and pressure plate?

i am not sure at all what did the trick. it could have been their throw out bearing or it could have somthign to do with draining and rebleeding my clutch hydrolics... not sure but both seemed to fix it and it feels just like stock now. ill find out tommarow if it can hold boost yet with it only at 250 miles of break in.

i really should have check the diameter of the tob and the pressure plate finger's first i just assumed they would have the correct bearing. looks like the other bearing fit inside of it and the fingers hit the plastic part on the bearing that keeps the grease in. probly worn on that enough to spray the grease out... there was alot in my bell housing going from unknown source since the seals are all good and it just got too hot and seized up and broke itself.


cliffnotes..... check your tob and your pressure plate and make sure they are both compatable sizes!

This is answer from aimco clutch
" hello.
you put bearing wrong side.
clip side face inside of pressure plate not that side.
Jim"
It s hard to say anything...

to iWeasel410: bearing which is included in xtd clutch kit ,is same sized like oem bearing