Street/track car...Turbo Miata vs. MR2 turbo - Page 2 - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

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View Poll Results: Which car to have as a street/track car?
Miata, with turbo 41 82.00%
MR2 Turbo, 91-95 4 8.00%
Leave Miata as is, and deal with being slow 5 10.00%
Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-04-2010, 03:12 PM   #21
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Mr. too
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Old 08-04-2010, 03:26 PM   #22
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Mr. too
Mr. Takes it in the 2
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Old 08-04-2010, 03:56 PM   #23
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Turbo MR2 Spyder, yes.
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Old 08-04-2010, 06:46 PM   #24
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Turbo MR2 Spyder, yes.
This seems like the better option to me as well. I'm no expert, but they weight in at 2,195 pounds, come with a great motor for boosting(celica gts motor), and look pretty good with minor mods/hardtop.
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Old 08-04-2010, 08:50 PM   #25
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I had a turbo MR2. Built motor running 340 whp @ 15 lbs. The engine bay area was so crammed though. I think it is way easier to do anything on a miata than on that MR2... at least if it is in the engine bay. Had decent suspension, though I must say... I would take the handling characteristics of my miata over it any day.

Though that MR2 was pretty darn fast. Way faster than both miata's. When that turbo spooled, it would put you back in your seat pretty hard.

Overall, I would take a turbo miata over a turbo MR2.
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Old 08-04-2010, 09:25 PM   #26
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The MR2 I was looking at wasn't as nice as I was hoping it'd be. I'm at the point where I'm still not sure what to do since I don't know if I'll be able to find exactly what I'm looking for unless I build the car myself. I should really just buy a turbo miata that has the options I want that isn't an R package and swap over anything from my current one and sell it. Too much freaking work.
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Old 08-04-2010, 10:50 PM   #27
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I've worked extensively on a few MR2's (full motor swaps, turbo upgrades, etc), and I would never buy one after having to work on it. Doing anything to the cars is a massive pain in the ***, and there really isn't that much support for them. You have to drop the whole rear of the car to get the motor out, and then you're also dealing with crappy intercooler placement, bad weight distribution, and a coolant routing nightmare.

I swapped my miata motor on the ground in a few hours. Everything is relatively easy to get to and easy to find. If you're into track you are also going to have to expect to do work like this. Make your life easy and don't buy an MR2. Almost any other car would be a better option in my mind.
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Old 08-05-2010, 03:13 AM   #28
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you're going to hear endless opinions from people here, some dont have experience and others do


mr2 is a good car, but its going to be more expensive in every way. from purchase to tuning, its a more expensive car.. new or used, they've always been more expensive.

with that said, you need to think about what you want. the cars are completely different in too many ways. mid-rear vs front-rear layout, convertible vs t-top, build quality, power... the weight says it all. people spoke truth above though, the motor is fantastic, working on it is not easy and typically involves removal, and cooling and piping are all issues.. ventilation is tough with that car. highly skilled drivers needed to properly control an MR-layout car too.

the miata, we all know.. cheaper in every way, lighter, and therefore handling is also improved. spend some money on better tires (better than azenis).. ide recommend some bridgestone re11 or advan ad08, much better compound. but besides that, proper turbo setup will take proper time, money and engineering. i think people underrate the amount of work a truly reliable and proper turbo conversion really costs.

the way i see it, you're probably better off saving your money and putting it towards an s2000.. better than both cars in absolutely every way.

only reason i dont own an s2000 is because i dont care much for the high rpm powerband, digital cluster, etc etc.. the car just doesnt do it for me. great cars tho.

ps: dont try to combine a street car with a track car, or a daily driver for that matter. buy one car for comfort and reliability, another for ****** around.
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Old 08-05-2010, 05:20 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fireindc View Post
This seems like the better option to me as well. I'm no expert, but they weight in at 2,195 pounds, come with a great motor for boosting(celica gts motor), and look pretty good with minor mods/hardtop.
I thought they came with the less powerful 1ZZ? You can swap in the 2ZZ from the Celica easily though. I'd love a turbo MR2 Sypder/MR-S with the 2ZZ-GE. MR-S is also apparently a monster in the handling department. A black MR-S with hardtop and a turbo 2ZZ would be a ton of fun.
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Old 08-05-2010, 07:29 AM   #30
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I thought they came with the less powerful 1ZZ? You can swap in the 2ZZ from the Celica easily though.
Most likely you are correct. Although if doing a swap I think a k20/k24 powered one would be amazing.
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Old 08-05-2010, 10:54 AM   #31
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Fawk that. I had a '91 MR-2 Turbo and I hated it. That's when I upgraded to my Roadster and boosted that (which is quicker, more agile and stops shorter). The MR-2 is heavy and you can feel it. The suspension geometry it NOT AT ALL a friendly thing. The wheelbase is too short and it creates a snappy chassis. Because of this and the MR setup, driver input for correcting oversteer at speed is very difficult and VERY dangerous. If you can get past the natural instinct to correct like in an FR car then you will increase your chances of walking away inscathed. Correct the same way in an MR-2 as in an FR and you will snap around before you know it, slide out of control and destroy your vehicle. If you are not an experienced driver or have no prior MR platform experience you will not benefit in any way from purchasing an MR-2. We've got a Class-leading racer at our Auto-X/Solo Sprint events with a purpose-built C6 and he's getting walked on by stock RX-8's in his modified MR-2 at the track.

In any case, they are a pain in the *** to work on. The sensors are all crap (which is why everyone swaps to standalone's and GM sensors), as was stated above the intercooler is in a bad spot and that stops you from running high boost, the car is a TANK for its size and it does not handle as well as a Miata/Roadster stock for stock, even slightly modified. Trying to work on anything in the engine bay will force you to swear, bleed and hate yourself for buying it.

This idea reeks of Bad News Bears. Please don't burden yourself by purchasing one.
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:29 AM   #32
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Have you looked into some of the threads of woe regarding turbo track miatas? In short, it can't be done for under $2000. I voted for slow stock miata track car.
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Old 08-05-2010, 02:04 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by E-NA6CE View Post
Fawk that. I had a '91 MR-2 Turbo and I hated it. That's when I upgraded to my Roadster and boosted that (which is quicker, more agile and stops shorter). The MR-2 is heavy and you can feel it. The suspension geometry it NOT AT ALL a friendly thing. The wheelbase is too short and it creates a snappy chassis. Because of this and the MR setup, driver input for correcting oversteer at speed is very difficult and VERY dangerous. If you can get past the natural instinct to correct like in an FR car then you will increase your chances of walking away inscathed. Correct the same way in an MR-2 as in an FR and you will snap around before you know it, slide out of control and destroy your vehicle. If you are not an experienced driver or have no prior MR platform experience you will not benefit in any way from purchasing an MR-2. We've got a Class-leading racer at our Auto-X/Solo Sprint events with a purpose-built C6 and he's getting walked on by stock RX-8's in his modified MR-2 at the track.

In any case, they are a pain in the *** to work on. The sensors are all crap (which is why everyone swaps to standalone's and GM sensors), as was stated above the intercooler is in a bad spot and that stops you from running high boost, the car is a TANK for its size and it does not handle as well as a Miata/Roadster stock for stock, even slightly modified. Trying to work on anything in the engine bay will force you to swear, bleed and hate yourself for buying it.

This idea reeks of Bad News Bears. Please don't burden yourself by purchasing one.
so... tell us, what else do you like about the mr2? :-)
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Old 08-05-2010, 02:08 PM   #34
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so... tell us, what else do you like about the mr2? :-)
They look nice in my rearview mirror!
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Old 08-05-2010, 05:44 PM   #35
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They look nice in my rearview mirror!
i dunno...

something about the motor being able to make 500rwhp without busting up sounds nice.

the sr20det is a good motor
the 3sgte is a very good motor
the bp.. well, its okay i guess

i dunno why people think the miata is such a great handling car. its okay, but i surely dont think its the greatest handling car ive ever ridden in. car flexes a lot and even with rollbar, swaybars and bracing.. a convertible will always be a convertible.
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Old 08-05-2010, 05:54 PM   #36
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I've no idea where the hell you're getting the 500whp on stock internals claim.
Like those idiots that keep saying a supra 2jz will easily handle 1000whp on stock internals.


A few dyno queens may have hit that number, but that doesn't mean ****.
A miata has hit 400whp on stock internals before: doesn't mean it can run that power for any significant length of time.

I'm not saying the BP is a good engine. Its mediocre. And a 3s is definitely superior. but Its not godly. Neither is the sr or the 2j for that matter.
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Old 08-05-2010, 06:01 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by old_s13 View Post
i dunno...

something about the motor being able to make 500rwhp without busting up sounds nice.

the sr20det is a good motor
the 3sgte is a very good motor
the bp.. well, its okay i guess

i dunno why people think the miata is such a great handling car. its okay, but i surely dont think its the greatest handling car ive ever ridden in. car flexes a lot and even with rollbar, swaybars and bracing.. a convertible will always be a convertible.
Who cares about making 500 RWHP? At that point it's completely useless on the street and you just break driveline components if you drag race. Unless you toss 300+ TW tyres on it and drift then it's wasted power.

There's a local guy that just showed up on the scene with a 1100+ RWHP Supra, gutted and caged. Sure, he smokes everyone at the strip, but last time I got to ride in it, WOT led to smoking the tyres and we were doing well over 220 clicks as it was.

The Miata is such a great handling car because of the suspension geometry. I mean, not many car manufacturers design a bumpstop to give you circuit-spec spring rates when you are driving aggressively. Also, how many other cars are unequal length A-arms on all four corners? Out of the box it is a very good handling car. When I got my Roadster (it was stock when I got it) I had faster times on our Auto-X course than in a friend's stock AP1. The only other car that is cheap that I was impressed with (stock for stock) almost the same as my Roadster at the track was an SE3P, which is why I'm on the hunt for one now. Then again, it's been a long time since I've my car has been stock... maybe I just like the sound of the rotary??? Ha ha... don't hate.

The 2JZ would be my engine of choice. If this build goes south I fully intent on forcing a 2JZ-GTE and a GETRAG into my toy car. It will be epic.
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Old 08-05-2010, 06:05 PM   #38
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I've no idea where the hell you're getting the 500whp on stock internals claim.
Like those idiots that keep saying a supra 2jz will easily handle 1000whp on stock internals.


A few dyno queens may have hit that number, but that doesn't mean ****.
A miata has hit 400whp on stock internals before: doesn't mean it can run that power for any significant length of time.

I'm not saying the BP is a good engine. Its mediocre. And a 3s is definitely superior. but Its not godly. Neither is the sr or the 2j for that matter.
That Miata was a 1.8, right? Wasn't that car featured in a magazine and paved the way for the NA-chassis performance scene? That was a long time ago...

Also, the 2JZ was engineered (thanks to the Germans) to withstand 600 hp without any modifications to the bottom end, which includes a very minor buffer zone for cylinder pressure spikes from detonation. The most power I've seen a 2JZ with stock internals make was somewhere shy of 800 BHP. I'll assume it broke because I haven't heard anything of it since then and that guy moved.
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Old 08-05-2010, 11:37 PM   #39
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I've no idea where the hell you're getting the 500whp on stock internals claim.
im getting it from the various customers of mine over the years who have built up their cars, thats all. im not saying the cars are concrete solid, but in comparison.. toyotas are stronger vehicles than nissans, and i think both are stronger than mazda. i think in terms of build quality, the mazda has to be my least favorite with much left to be desired. does that mean i should sell the car? no, i like the miata because all in all, its a cheap car and the least to worry about when things break. the thing that sucks, however, is that parts are fairly more expensive.


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Who cares about making 500 RWHP? At that point it's completely useless on the street and you just break driveline components if you drag race.
dont look at me, im not a peak HP lover.. all of the cars ive built have been geared toward good response over peak hp, balance being most important.

either way, i think its safe to say that we can all agree that the mr2, supra, miata, 240sx, etc etc.. they're all great cars and all have good capabilities. i'de say its more a matter of preference than anything.
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Old 08-06-2010, 12:24 AM   #40
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Your simplest reliable forced induction for track use for the miata will be a rotrex. But, I'm biased.
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