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Old 10-06-2010, 10:12 AM   #1
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Default Hydra and Deatschwerks compatible??

I am having problems trying to idle with a Hydra 2.5 and Deatschwerks 800cc's. Car idles fine until warmed up. Then when fans kick on, the engine dies. Seems like once warmed up it dies due to battery voltage compensation tables having inadequate range. AFR's are 14.7 at idle and it has been tuned down to 13.7, but it still dies when it warms up after 5-10minutes.

Is anyone running a Hydra 2.5 w/ Deatschwerks successfully?

Last edited by 05pearl; 10-06-2010 at 10:32 AM.
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:28 AM   #2
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Wirelessly posted

So are your alternator control tables set up properly? What happens if you are warming up and you turn on the lights and defrost?
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:34 AM   #3
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Seems fine with lights when warming up...
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Old 10-06-2010, 10:52 AM   #4
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Try turning everything on that sucks juice including radio and watch the voltage map in the hydra and the voltage readout. See if it's in range.
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Old 10-06-2010, 11:00 AM   #5
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^^ Will do, thx.
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Old 10-06-2010, 11:06 AM   #6
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What version are you running?
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Old 10-06-2010, 11:07 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 05pearl View Post
I am having problems trying to idle with a Hydra 2.5 and Deatschwerks 800cc's. Car idles fine until warmed up. Then when fans kick on, the engine dies. Seems like once warmed up it dies due to battery voltage compensation tables having inadequate range. AFR's are 14.7 at idle and it has been tuned down to 13.7, but it still dies when it warms up after 5-10minutes.

Is anyone running a Hydra 2.5 w/ Deatschwerks successfully?
Have you redone your injector voltage compensation table? Call or email Deatschwerks and ask them for the voltage response curve.

And secondly, have you tuned your idle cells perfectly so that when the load goes up 4 kPa, the mixture doesn't lean out?
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Old 10-06-2010, 11:23 AM   #8
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I'm running v2.5.

I'll also contact DW for the curves and check idle cells under load.

Thx guys.
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Old 10-06-2010, 11:44 AM   #9
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The problem at the moment with the Hydra doing anything over 660cc injectors is the latency curves of the DW 800cc are too high for the Hydra. I spoke with Jeremy at Flyin Miata about this and he informed me that the new Hydra 2.7 or whatever its gonna be called is going to be able to utilize higher latency scales then what the 2.5 and 6 can do now. Ive been able to get them to work in a drivable fashion but they wont be really properly used until the new Hydra comes out.
As far as Alternator control, im using an NA alternator as i got tired of dicking with the variable ecu controlled NB crap. That could be part of the reason why mine are working now.
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Old 10-06-2010, 12:25 PM   #10
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Ah I thought you had already adjusted your injector voltage tables.

I spoke with Jeremy about this as well regarding the ID1000s. There is some workaround. I'm not sure what that could be other than a trim map for the voltage table or something- if that's even possible.

Mr Leatherface, any issues with your NA alternator at all? If not, I might consider that down the road.
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Old 10-06-2010, 03:01 PM   #11
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No issues at all. Every NB with a standalone should do it.
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Old 10-06-2010, 05:56 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by leatherface24 View Post
No issues at all. Every NB with a standalone should do it.
What about the battery light?

To the OP, go into your ISC tab under settings and change the max duty cycle "Max PWM duty" To 100%. See if that helps out any.
You may also want to look over your coolant temp trims for fuel and spark.
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Old 10-06-2010, 09:55 PM   #13
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^^^ Thx for the info again.
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Old 10-07-2010, 01:23 PM   #14
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Hey David,

Thank you for calling us. Hopefully between DW, Hydra, and the M-T community we can get this sorted out for you and others with similar mods.
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Old 10-13-2010, 11:33 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by leatherface24 View Post
.... Ive been able to get them to work in a drivable fashion but they wont be really properly used until the new Hydra comes out....
Leather - You are correct, the Hydra does not have the proper range for the latency curve. I would like to do what you have done, for now, but we have not been able yet. Can you tell me specifically what you did in your tune to at least make the car driveable? Any help would be appreciated. Oh, I almost forgot - can it be made drivable without changing to an NA alternator?

Here is what I am working against - At 13v it needs 1.5ms and 15v 1.3ms. The hydra 2.5 maxes out at 1.275. So I am short about 0.025ms-0.225ms. But, again, we have tuned it rich and it still dies (even when AFR is below 14:1) when the fans kick on. Trying to figure out if it is something other than the latency range as well.

Last edited by 05pearl; 10-14-2010 at 03:59 PM.
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Old 10-21-2010, 12:24 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Deatschwerks View Post
Hey David,

Thank you for calling us. Hopefully between DW, Hydra, and the M-T community we can get this sorted out for you and others with similar mods.
Stalling when fans kicked on problem was solved. Had to adjust settings under the ISC tab of Hydra - proportional, derivative... and other crap I didn't know anything about.
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:09 PM   #17
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I talked to tech support at Hydra EMS today and they felt that they would have the upgrades to 2.7 ready in a couple of weeks which will fix the injector latency problem. It probably won't be cheap though as the 2.7 won't run on the processor from the 2.5 so it will need some upgraded hardware instead of just a flash. I think the 2.6 already uses the upgraded processor.
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:35 PM   #18
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hydra and their hardware upgrades... what's it cost?
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:54 PM   #19
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Heh i'm having the exact same issues but with adaptronic. I wonder what settings i can change lol. So far i've been playing with the latency settings to get it to keep running.
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Old 10-22-2010, 08:21 PM   #20
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I don't know anything about adaptronic specific software, sorry. But, we were able to solve my stalling problem by adjusting some parameters under the "ISC" tab in Hydra. The latency issue was not causing my problem, even though many sources were saying that was the cause. I just have to run a little rich due to being out of the latency range or upgrade to 2.7 later.

Last edited by 05pearl; 10-22-2010 at 08:43 PM.
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