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Old 08-18-2009, 02:55 PM   #1
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Default california residents, what would you pay for a carb approved ls1 swapped miata?

title says it all.

Last edited by frostyllama; 08-18-2009 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 08-18-2009, 03:13 PM   #2
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You can already get an LS1 swap approved by the ref.
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Old 08-18-2009, 03:15 PM   #3
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You can already get an LS1 swap approved by the ref.
Almost, but AFAIK the issue is the headers - there is no CARB-legal LS1 header that fits into a Miata.
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Old 08-18-2009, 03:16 PM   #4
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sorry, fucked up wording, title changed
savington- i found a set of carb approved shorty headers that i think might fit, made by jba
considering this forum is inhabited mostly by diyer's and people not residing in the state of california, i'll take what responses i can get.

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Old 08-18-2009, 09:00 PM   #5
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Almost, but AFAIK the issue is the headers - there is no CARB-legal LS1 header that fits into a Miata.
You think that the Cobra guys with their side-pipes are running CARB-approved headers?

The ref has the authority to approve non-EO'ed headers in situations like this, providing you've retained the cats in the (more or less) stock location, carried over whatever EGR / smog pump / etc sort of devices that the engine was originally fitted with, etc.
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Old 08-18-2009, 11:00 PM   #6
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that is very useful information. probably wouldn't hurt to buddy up a ref though, things would probably go smoother; i'm sure an ---- ref wouldn't even consider it.
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Old 08-18-2009, 11:06 PM   #7
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So, what exactly are you selling?
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Old 08-18-2009, 11:14 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Perez View Post
You think that the Cobra guys with their side-pipes are running CARB-approved headers?

The ref has the authority to approve non-EO'ed headers in situations like this, providing you've retained the cats in the (more or less) stock location, carried over whatever EGR / smog pump / etc sort of devices that the engine was originally fitted with, etc.
Cobra guys meaning kit cars? Depending on how they register and what engine they are using, they do NOT have to have carb-approved anything.
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Old 08-18-2009, 11:16 PM   #9
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it was just an idea for a side income kind of thing... i was planning on buying a miata, then a wrecked car with ls1/t5<EDIT>6</EDIT> drivetrain figure out how fabricate the necessary conversion parts myself, then outfit the car with other parts like exhaust, suspension, tires etc. getting it ref checked and certified in california seeing as there are few california legal ls1 swaps that i could find (none actually.) then selling the car (hopefully) for some kind of profit, and repeat the process. seemed like a good idea at the time of thought. :/
-edit- wheels, there is a difference, damnit.

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Old 08-19-2009, 01:00 AM   #10
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um its a t56 newb i nvr heard of a t54 seriusly even if you do get the **** done and prototyped, etc, i doubt you can sell enough units to make it a profitable venture.
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Old 08-19-2009, 01:19 AM   #11
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I'm pretty sure it would end up being pretty UNprofitable for the time spent, unless you are able to sell at a price over $15,000. Been doing research for awhile - they tend to be pretty big money pits. However, if you are able to build a solid subframe yourself, that would knock costs down a little bits.

If I were in the position to build a v8 miata, I would build for keeps, not other peeps.
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Old 08-19-2009, 02:19 AM   #12
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um its a t56 newb i nvr heard of a t54 seriusly even if you do get the **** done and prototyped, etc, i doubt you can sell enough units to make it a profitable venture.


I have a friend who builds and sells LSx swapped FD RX7s. They put about 10 - 15k into them, sell em for 25-30k. *I* wouldn't pay that much for them, however a lot of people will.
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Old 08-19-2009, 02:43 AM   #13
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um its a t56 newb i nvr heard of a t54 seriusly even if you do get the **** done and prototyped, etc, i doubt you can sell enough units to make it a profitable venture.
i maybe a newb, but honestly i only 'just' started researching it, literally two or three days ago and came up with the idea THIS MORNING. i think i deserve a little slack after going through hundreds of posts today, different sites for information, and then ******* up a single digit on a transmission model #... a-hole
+ its a learning experience and i think it might be fun even :shock:
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Old 08-19-2009, 02:44 AM   #14
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I have a friend who builds and sells LSx swapped FD RX7s. They put about 10 - 15k into them, sell em for 25-30k. *I* wouldn't pay that much for them, however a lot of people will.
see, this is useful information. thank you.
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Old 08-19-2009, 02:45 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frostyllama View Post
i maybe a newb, but honestly i only 'just' started researching it, literally two or three days ago and came up with the idea THIS MORNING. i think i deserve a little slack after going through hundreds of posts today, different sites for information, and then ******* up a single number on a transmission model #... a-hole
you keep that **** up and you will fit in well here GL man
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:51 AM   #16
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You can reasonably expect around 11-17k anything higher and your smoking something.

Used parts, a guy i have absolutely no knowledge of, and a homemade kit would all be factors making it very hard to sell your project after you finish it.

Although if you could make a case for yourself as something other than a backyard kid with a welder, assure a build quality of some reasonableness and build a kit that wont **** up and will pass ref i am sure you could probably end up with 1-2k on top of a detailed parts cost breakdown.

Don't expect FD or kit car markups your building a Used parts Miata their not the ******* same.
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:56 AM   #17
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see, this is useful information. thank you.
He had a build thread / sale thread on a local message board a few months back but their server crashed and its gone..

They've built and sold a total of 6 cars now in the last 22 months because they only do it on the side. The very last car they built was sold then bought back after a small wreck and my friend still drives it. After they build the cars they're typically dyno tuned for maximum performance with what they do, and this last car was actually the weakest one they've done. It put down ~ 278rwhp which is a hurt LS1 which came from a 1998 Formula Firebird. The cars typically weigh around 2400# when the full swap is completed, and with the Stock wheels and 245mm tires the car propelled itself to a [email protected] 1/4. The motor finally gave up after about 7 months of abuse. Strange enough you could actually roll into a full throttle 2nd gear pull with very minimal wheelspin. That car was a beast.

However, keep in mind we're talking about RX7s here and not a Miata. The FD RX7 specifically typically holds it resale a LOT higher than your average good condition miata likely because they're much fewer available. Don't expect to get 25-30k from a swapped miata and it might be much more a niche market than the RX7 swapped cars is, but I can't speak from experience. My only concern with that is you can drop your car off at FM and they'll build you a turn-key product if you've got the cash, and IIRC its not that expensive.

Anyway, Good luck in your venture and I hope all goes well.
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Old 08-19-2009, 07:33 AM   #18
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If CARB legal headers were that easy/available, don't you think FM/V8R would pick up a pair for their swaps to open themselves up to the Cali market?

Frank
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Old 08-19-2009, 09:28 AM   #19
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Cobra guys meaning kit cars? Depending on how they register and what engine they are using, they do NOT have to have carb-approved anything.
If they use a pre-1967 engine, or are one of the lucky few to score a Certificate of Sequence, they they can power the car with unrefined whale oil for all the state of CA cares. Everyone else must submit to the whim of the referee.

Honestly, I think those guys get an undeservedly bad rap. They've got a tough job to do, but the one ref who I've ever spoken with was actually pretty cool, and a classic car guy to boot. I got the feeling that he was the sort of fellow who, if you were doing something that he thought was deserving, would actually go out of his way to help you pass.


Fmowry, I think the cost estimates you've been getting are probably close to the mark. One thing you might want to do is contact Marty at Monster Miata. I've been out to his place in San Marcos, and while for him the V8 Miata thing is clearly a sideline (he builds custom plumbing fixtures, mostly) he has several cars on the road in CA using modern Ford 5 liter drivetrains.
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Old 08-19-2009, 10:01 AM   #20
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Joe,
You didn't mean to respond to me, did you? I couldn't care less about CARB cert for Cali (aside from responding in this thread).

Frank
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