contemplating the e85 switch
are the stock injectors enough?
do I need to worry about corrosion? financially, is it worth the switch yet? will the lc-1 will read from 6.0-11:1 afr's? |
you need like 7x the injector.
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No
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Originally Posted by Saml01
(Post 259573)
No
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Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 259577)
does that "no" also apply to the lc-1?
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Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 259577)
does that "no" also apply to the lc-1?
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Originally Posted by BenR
(Post 259579)
No, just to you.
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I am also kind of interested in this. Both because it might help me save some cash (you guys in US just think you have high gas prices.) and because it would be really cool to have a more environmentally friendly sports car.
What I found out so far is that (as you know) the E85 may cause corrosion to the rubber parts in our fuel system, which might be the biggest pain to fix. But the rest of the engine and exhaust will be OK. You need a significantly larger amount of fuel (do not know if the stock injectors are enough, but I doubt it) and the octant value is 104 RON (that’s RON now, not (R+N)/2. I have a ton of info collected that I need to study and I would share it with you… but I guess your Swedish isn’t that good? |
You know how many tanks of gas you will have to go through in order to break even on investment to perform this conversion?
Diesel conversion would probably be more worth it. |
My wife has a ghetto cruiser Impala for her company car, one of the new flex fuel ones. The mileage they quote for gasoline is (city/hwy) 18/29 and for E85 it's 14/21. In the ballpark of a 25% drop in miles per gallon, and that's in a car designed to run E85 from the factory. MS could (probably?) handle the timing and fuel with big enough injectors. Hell, somewhere on the net is a vid of a Cobra replicar putting down like 900 whp on E85. Granted it was a turbo'ed V8 but it should be possible to get decent power out of a 4-banger assuming you can give it enough fuel.
Yes, you would have to worry about corrosion because ethanol is very weakly acidic. If you replaced all the parts in the fuel delivery system with ones designed for long-term E85 exposure, you'd be okay. I suspect in a few years we'll know if GM got that part right or not. As for whether it's economical, that depends on the price of gas versus E85. Assuming at least a 25% mpg loss running E85, since gas is $4/gal, E85 would have to be under $3/gal just to break even on fuel, plus you'd spend more than a few $$$ on the conversion. I have no idea what E85 costs since the gas stations I go to don't have it. |
I'd have to buy another mspnp for the 95 since that's my daily, and it would take some time for that to pay off in the long-run.
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Like I said, there's a reason they stopped using ethanol after the Model T.
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ethanol's fer drinkin.
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Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 259570)
are the stock injectors enough?
Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 259570)
do I need to worry about corrosion?
Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 259570)
financially, is it worth the switch yet?
Originally Posted by hustler
(Post 259570)
will the lc-1 will read from 6.0-11:1 afr's?
As a reference lets assume that Max power on the rich side with e85 is around 7:1 AFR thats a lambda of ~ 0.72 Gasoline lambda of ~ 0.72 is 10.6:1 SO.. with e-85 and not changing your LC-1, you tune for an "Indicated AFR" of 10.6 As always YMMV and I claim no responsibility for anything bad that happens as a result of this information. |
Originally Posted by Torkel
(Post 259600)
I am also kind of interested in this. Both because it might help me save some cash (you guys in US just think you have high gas prices.) and because it would be really cool to have a more environmentally friendly sports car.
You really think so? Read-> http://i-r-squared.blogspot.com/2006...erors-new.html __________________ Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote |
Originally Posted by Torkel
(Post 259600)
I am also kind of interested in this. Both because it might help me save some cash (you guys in US just think you have high gas prices.) and because it would be really cool to have a more environmentally friendly sports car.
What I found out so far is that (as you know) the E85 may cause corrosion to the rubber parts in our fuel system, which might be the biggest pain to fix. But the rest of the engine and exhaust will be OK. You need a significantly larger amount of fuel (do not know if the stock injectors are enough, but I doubt it) and the octant value is 104 RON (that’s RON now, not (R+N)/2. I have a ton of info collected that I need to study and I would share it with you… but I guess your Swedish isn’t that good? I'm in the same boat as Torkel on this one. We have tons of sugar cane locally and I know it's just a matter of time before the government reaches some kind of agreement with some big corporation to start producing E85. Torkel, I suggest you start a thread on this subject. I know Ethanol (produced from corn) is a big political issue in the States and will not become the fuel of the future there but I see our situation developing towards something very similar to what goes on in Brazil already. It's my understanding that the big car producers only install a sensor to read whether the engine is using E85 or regular gasoline; Am I wrong? I need to find out what has to be done to be able to switch back an forth between both types of fuel. |
They have a fuel composition sensor (FCS) that senses the amount of ethanol in the mix.
Megasquirt and flex fuel |
Originally Posted by ScottFW
(Post 259634)
They have a fuel composition sensor (FCS) that senses the amount of ethanol in the mix.
Megasquirt and flex fuel |
Originally Posted by Rafa
(Post 259630)
Torkel, I suggest you start a thread on this subject. I know Ethanol (produced from corn) is a big political issue in the States and will not become the fuel of the future there but I see our situation developing towards something very similar to what goes on in Brazil already.
However, most experts agree that it is better then diesel and a lot better then regular gas. Naturally, it is important to get a closer source for the fuel and when that happends, it will be a vast improvment. Adding to that, the E85 is now getting close to half the price of gas, since gas is about $8/gallon here. I will not start a thread on this. I know too little at the time. I might come back when I had time to do some proper research. |
Originally Posted by Chris Swearingen
(Post 259615)
Who cares, 105 octane for less than pump prices is the reason to change not savings.
Originally Posted by torkel
I am also kind of interested in this. Both because it might help me save some cash (you guys in US just think you have high gas prices.) and because it would be really cool to have a more environmentally friendly sports car.
One thing I'll miss about my friends smoke screen pollution providing blown up miata... Driving next to the fags in their little gas-electric piece of shit.. Seriously, do those cheap fucking losers actually think they're saving the planet buying into this "green" gayness, then spending 40,000 fucking dollars on a "hybrid?" What a joke. :giggle: I like telling those people "Any portion of this planet you think you're saving, I'm destroying!" As I lay down a smoke screen from my exhaust. Global warming is bullshit. Made up by Al Gore and his band of hippie ------ losers. http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/pro...67/a967_bm.gif
Originally Posted by levnubhin
(Post 259618)
You really think so? Read-> http://i-r-squared.blogspot.com/2006...erors-new.html
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Originally Posted by elesjuan
(Post 260154)
DING DING DING DING! and so on and so on...
In other words: Agreeing or not agreeing with you, with Al Gore or with Satan himself will not really make a difference. I can not choose to not be part of it. If my car fails the sniff test at inspection, I can not drive it. If I do not sort my garbage and put it in the right coloured bag in the right bin, the garbage truck will not empty the bins. Gas is now so expensive here and the subway so cheap that my car pretty much only moves during the weekends. That is my reality. I can adjust, make the best of it, adapt to it and move on. Or I can fight it, which will ruin me and cause all kind of shit. |
Hustler, how about you contemplate the turbo switch before you contemplate the e85 switch :magna: |
Originally Posted by elesjuan
(Post 260154)
DING DING DING DING! Thats my ONLY interest in E85. POWER. Who gives a shit about fuel consumption? People cry about how much MORE fuel E85 uses.. Well DURR.... Thats like crying that your top fuel drag car uses more fuel than your station wagon.. Maybe thats because the drag car runs at a 1:1 AFR? :bowrofl:
Fuck the environment. Why should I let Some pussy ass seal or a ------y moose fucking bankrupt me in energy prices when I'm doing nothing more than trying to make a fucking living here??? I'd fly up there to Alaska and shoot those fuckers myself if it'd get the drills in there to get more oil. One thing I'll miss about my friends smoke screen pollution providing blown up miata... Driving next to the fags in their little gas-electric piece of shit.. Seriously, do those cheap fucking losers actually think they're saving the planet buying into this "green" gayness, then spending 40,000 fucking dollars on a "hybrid?" What a joke. :giggle: I like telling those people "Any portion of this planet you think you're saving, I'm destroying!" As I lay down a smoke screen from my exhaust. Global warming is bullshit. Made up by Al Gore and his band of hippie ------ losers. http://www.tshirthell.com/shirts/pro...67/a967_bm.gif You don't find that a little interesting the article was written by someone who works for a fucking major oil company?? Granted most of the research I've personally done on Ethanol as a fuel gives pretty close to the same negative findings. __________________ Best Car Insurance | Auto Protection Today | FREE Trade-In Quote |
omg environmental debate.
so Jesus will fix global warming or there is no global warming or there is global warming or it doesn't matter and you can just conserve energy anyway (to save money) or there is global warming and you disagree and the earth will be very different in 50 years and the "hippie ------s" will give you the finger or it's not just al gore but like 99.9% of scientists that agree humans have a serious effect on the climate (except not that ONE richard lindzen guy all the anti-global warming people quote because he's the only one who thinks it is a hoax) wear whatever tshirt you want and dump your used motor oil into babies mouths or whatever. |
Originally Posted by Savington
(Post 260166)
I actually own that shirt, no joke.
Hustler, how about you contemplate the turbo switch before you contemplate the e85 switch :magna: |
Who doesn't have a kiddie porn dungeon?
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