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Old 12-04-2013, 09:46 PM   #1
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Default More GTO Help. Rust issues. May sell.

hi gays.

Due to the overwhelming success on achieving advice and purchase recommendations in my GTO wheel thread, I have decided to seek more expert advice about my current GTO problem:

Rust.

When I bought the car it was raining and the only good look I got at it was in his garage... obviously the lighting there isn't good. I also got a case of the gotta have its and maybe didn't inspect it as closely as I should have.

What started out as a tiny little bit of what looked like paint imperfections at the top of the windshield has turned into this in the last 6 months:

Close up:


Further away, to show you the size in relation to the rest of the car:


There is a second little spot, also up at the leading edge of the roof at the top of the windshield:


That first spot that has opened up was less noticeable than this spot when I first bought the car.

Finally, the other serious spot on the rear fender:




The fender one sucks but isn't particularly "dangerous." My main concern is with the one on the roof. Obviously it's progressing extremely quickly.

I don't know how much something like this would cost to fix. I asked our body shop here at the dealership and they said you really can't tell without tearing into it because with rust you're only seeing a part of the problem.

I could try to fix it myself, but I really have no place to work on it, no tools, and frankly no skills -- I'd likely just make it much worse. I don't have extra cash right now to pay to fix it but could scrape something together if it's reasonable. Things have been off to something of a slow start with my job in Oregon and with paying for my wife's school stuff and having just bought the wheels and tires, money is tight.

So... what would you all do in my situation? I've discussed it with my wife, and she has basically given me the green light to sell it despite the 5 year commitment, since thus far this seems to fall into the category of something going seriously wrong with the car. I'm thinking to list it and just see what sort of offers I get.

Do you all consider this something seriously wrong?

Do you think it's worth fixing? Or should I sell it?

(for you Oregon folks, Curly, dunno who else) Do you have any body shop hookups to get this fixed, if it should be reasonable to fix?

Finally..... Am I totally overreacting?

The upside of selling: I'd likely be buying a Miata soon.
The downside: The Miata would only happen if things pick up at work. If not, I'd be driving whatever piece of crap trade-in I could buy for the least amount of money.

I look forward to your wise responses and sage wisdom
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Old 12-04-2013, 10:35 PM   #2
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Are you looking for an excuse to sell the GTO?
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Old 12-04-2013, 10:52 PM   #3
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Neighbor had that happen to his Saturn. Decided to let it go. It continued to bubble, and the pressure cracked the windshield. You gotta pop the WS out, remove all the trim and get it down to completely bare metal. Anything less is just delaying it a bit.

Even doing that, once rust starts, you will fight a losing battle over time. Unless you keep the car in an air conditioned garage, it will continue to rust.

If you're looking for an excuse, this is it. Remove the worst of it, touch it up as best you can and trade before it gets worse.
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:00 AM   #4
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it is known as cancer for automobiles for a reason. Treat it or move on. If you treat it and miss some.... it could come back ...
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:42 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by RedCarmel View Post
Are you looking for an excuse to sell the GTO?
Haha... I think deep down I am, but I am genuinely concerned about this. If this were not a problem, I would be keeping the GTO and continuing my plans of weight reduction, coilovers, and a little more power and I'd enjoy the heck out of it for the next 4.5 years. I knew the car wasn't cherry when I bought it but the rust is a surprise.

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Neighbor had that happen to his Saturn. Decided to let it go. It continued to bubble, and the pressure cracked the windshield. You gotta pop the WS out, remove all the trim and get it down to completely bare metal. Anything less is just delaying it a bit.

Even doing that, once rust starts, you will fight a losing battle over time. Unless you keep the car in an air conditioned garage, it will continue to rust.

If you're looking for an excuse, this is it. Remove the worst of it, touch it up as best you can and trade before it gets worse.
Like I say, if I sell the GTO I'm going to be consigned to a beater for a while. Much as I want to buy Chilicharger's car it just wouldn't be a wise financial decision right now, never mind the distance (though that's not a huge deal for the right Miata). Also, an MSM would probably be perfect for me since stock Miatas are too darned slow and I don't have the time/place/TIME to install a turbo anytime soon. Yeah it's not as good as a properly built turbo Miata. I know that. But it's a perfect daily and it will be fun for the one or two track days I could make it to. Which is fine.


After writing that paragraph as it flowed, I guess I am kindof looking for an excuse. But even if I weren't looking for an excuse, it really does seem like the smartest choice.

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it is known as cancer for automobiles for a reason. Treat it or move on. If you treat it and miss some.... it could come back ...
This is a fear. Also, it's still small enough that it's not going to immediately scare off a buyer, whereas in a year it definitely will be too huge.


OK. So sell it.


Next question: rleete, you said to remove the worst of it, touch it up, and sell it. How do you suggest doing this? I'm kindof asking for spoon feeding, I know. But how would you personally go about doing it? Do you have experience with this?

My only experience with rust was on my first car, a 1989 Saab 900 Turbo that had lived in Park City, Utah. That did not end well. My sortof-repair did not end well...... But I was 18, and much more of an idiot back then.
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Old 12-05-2013, 01:21 AM   #6
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I'd sell that asap personally.
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Old 12-05-2013, 01:59 AM   #7
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dude

the fact that you mentioned selling it in the title, and 1st post before you even got anyone's advice about it tells me you're ready to let it go, found a really good reason to, and want us to reassure you to do it.

so do it then lol
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Old 12-05-2013, 02:32 AM   #8
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You're right.

My main purpose in this post was confirming that this is, in fact, a really good reason to sell the car. I want to make sure I'm being honest with myself and with my wife before making that decision. If It's not a legitimate reason, I want to stick with my 5-year commitment. But if it's a legit reason, then I want to let it go with a good conscience.

I'm gonna be sad. Other than the fuel economy this car is essentially the perfect DD. Super comfortable, incredible torque, decent sound system, not too attention-grabbing...

But Rust? No. Can't have that.

Hopefully I don't lose too much money selling it.
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Old 12-05-2013, 03:06 AM   #9
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No connections to a body shop, otherwise I'd fix the crack in the miata.

Only good news is no one here knows what rust is, so you might not have a hard time selling it. Although it's not a Subaru, and Pontiac no long exists, two points against it for a NW seller.
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:00 AM   #10
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Quote:
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Next question: rleete, you said to remove the worst of it, touch it up, and sell it. How do you suggest doing this? I'm kindof asking for spoon feeding, I know. But how would you personally go about doing it? Do you have experience with this?
Far too much experience. 90% of my bodywork knowledge is from having to repair rust. They don't call this area the rust belt for nothin'.

So, in your case, you want a quick fix. That means not tearing into it. No glass removal, no taking off the trim. Just slow it down, cover it up. You're not really fixing it so much as hiding it.

You want to remove the worst of the flaking. A razor blade, small chisel, etc should do it. Go slow, and remove as little of the surrounding paint as possible. Prime immediately. Use a good name brand primer and a small brush like you'd find at a hobby store. Let it dry at least overnight.

If the surface is really bad, you can try to build it up a little with sanding primer. Several coats may be needed, but each one has to dry completely before the next.

If it doesn't require multiple coats, just get a good touchup paint and cover it. Put it on as thin as possible; don't goop it on. Light buffing after a day will help it to blend in. It's still going to be visible, but hopefully you make it look more like a stone chip or scrape than rusting.

Even a well done job like this is not going to last long, so time is your enemy.
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Old 12-05-2013, 09:09 AM   #11
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Rust... lol

Until the engine and trans falls out the bottom. It's not that rusty.
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Old 12-05-2013, 09:49 AM   #12
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I wouldn't do anything to repair it. I'd put it up for sale as is and see how it goes. Those spots look small enough that the average person isn't going to notice. If people are noticing the rust and avoiding the car because of it, then I'd look into repairing it. One thing is certain though, as it gets worse it's definitely going to kill resale value.

Also, you keep saying you'll have to get a beater if you get rid of the GTO, but there really isn't much "better" than a miata (unless you need the extra seats). I've seen decent looking, higher mileage, early NB's selling really cheap lately. Not really sure what your goals for the car are, but as a daily driver that's a great option. Going from a GTO to a civic/corolla is going to suck really bad, at least a stock miata is still fun to toss around. If you really want a miata, don't write off getting one simply because you've convinced yourself that you need a "beater".
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:06 AM   #13
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Ed,

Drive down here and buy one of my brothers NB's haha
2 of them are 04/05 MSM's the rest are 01+ SE's

For like 5k, you can have yourself a clean CA NB2 that you'll love. MSM's are about 9+ and for what, like 20hp more over 1500 rpm? They truly suck in stock form. So much so that I had the opportunity to own one over a handful of times for a steal and still chose an SE.
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Old 12-05-2013, 10:24 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by pdexta View Post
I wouldn't do anything to repair it. I'd put it up for sale as is and see how it goes. Those spots look small enough that the average person isn't going to notice. If people are noticing the rust and avoiding the car because of it, then I'd look into repairing it.
Personally if I were in your shoes I would do this. I'm terrible at body work and I think it's pretty easy to make stuff look way worse if you don't know what you're doing, and it doesn't like like you have much experience either. There's no harm in putting it up for sale as-is and then if the rust appears to be a road block you could think about fixing it. But sooner or later, someone will probably come along with the "gotta have its" and be willing to overlook it for one reason or another.
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Old 12-05-2013, 04:28 PM   #15
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OK here goes. Many responses. Thanks for the input guys.

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Originally Posted by rleete View Post
Far too much experience. 90% of my bodywork knowledge is from having to repair rust. They don't call this area the rust belt for nothin'.

*exactly the kind of advice I need for fixing it myself, filed away for future use if the strategies outlined below don't pan out*
Thanks for the really helpful post.

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Rust... lol

Until the engine and trans falls out the bottom. It's not that rusty.
I'm not in Michigan anymore sweetie!! Seriously though... I miss that place almost all the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pdexta View Post
I wouldn't do anything to repair it. I'd put it up for sale as is and see how it goes. Those spots look small enough that the average person isn't going to notice. If people are noticing the rust and avoiding the car because of it, then I'd look into repairing it.
I feel kindof like a douche but this is what I'm hoping for. The way I see it, it's not up to me to talk them out of buying my car. Might not be a big deal for someone else. Whatever.


Quote:
Originally Posted by pdexta View Post
Also, you keep saying you'll have to get a beater if you get rid of the GTO, but there really isn't much "better" than a miata (unless you need the extra seats). I've seen decent looking, higher mileage, early NB's selling really cheap lately. Not really sure what your goals for the car are, but as a daily driver that's a great option. Going from a GTO to a civic/corolla is going to suck really bad, at least a stock miata is still fun to toss around. If you really want a miata, don't write off getting one simply because you've convinced yourself that you need a "beater".
When I say beater, I mean BEATER. Like, I'm spending $500 for a crappy trade-in from work. These cars would sell for 1500-2500 on the private used-car market, so it is cheap enough that I can pay cash for it, and worth enough that I won't lose money and will likely make money that I can later put towards something else. If I were looking to spend $1500-$2k I would buy a little NA Miata and DD that but I'm not wanting to spend that much since it's a car I plan to keep for a VERY short time. I know I won't be happy with a basic Miata for long, so I'm better off to get something that costs nothing and that I don't give a crap about as an interim solution.

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Ed,

Drive down here and buy one of my brothers NB's haha
2 of them are 04/05 MSM's the rest are 01+ SE's

For like 5k, you can have yourself a clean CA NB2 that you'll love. MSM's are about 9+ and for what, like 20hp more over 1500 rpm? They truly suck in stock form. So much so that I had the opportunity to own one over a handful of times for a steal and still chose an SE.
The difference between you and me, though, is that you have cash to put towards mods and skills (not to mention a GARAGE) with which to turbo. I drove a stock '03 Sport and really didn't like it, it was just too slow. A stock MSM is too slow as well, but much less so. An MSM like Chilicharger's with the full intake and exhaust would be enough to keep me from getting too bored. Just like you said when I was feeling down about buying your white car: an MSM fits me well because I want comfort, good looks, clean body, and decent power. The MSM has all that, and it's factory stuff.

HOWEVER... I'm definitely interested in your Bro's cars, and I'd enjoy the trip down there to meet you and check out your car. Would probably try to time it around Miatas at MRLS. Maybe. Once I get some money, I'll revisit this. Perhaps we can PM about this a bit. I'll send you one later.

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Personally if I were in your shoes I would do this. I'm terrible at body work and I think it's pretty easy to make stuff look way worse if you don't know what you're doing, and it doesn't like like you have much experience either. There's no harm in putting it up for sale as-is and then if the rust appears to be a road block you could think about fixing it. But sooner or later, someone will probably come along with the "gotta have its" and be willing to overlook it for one reason or another.
This is EXACTLY how I feel, you nailed it. That LS2 does a REALLY nice job of inflicting the gotta-have-its.

Here's my CL ad. It would be good to get some interior photos and stuff but we'll see how this goes. 2005 Pontiac GTO Blackw/red leather 6-speed manual
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Old 12-05-2013, 04:57 PM   #16
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From your CL ad:

"This car is basically a 4-door Corvette and is an incredible car for the money."

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Old 12-05-2013, 06:36 PM   #17
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From your CL ad:

"This car is basically a 4-door Corvette and is an incredible car for the money."

lol nice catch. Meant 4-seat. fixed.
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:02 PM   #18
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Depending on mileage, price and all that jazz i would buy this off you.
Oh, and if you weren't across the country.

edit
Herpderp read the craigslist add dummy.

Edit again* so wait a minute, the wife is going to let you trade this for a Miata?
Ohhh you sneaky pete you...
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Old 12-05-2013, 07:09 PM   #19
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Depending on mileage, price and all that jazz i would buy this off you.
Oh, and if you weren't across the country.

edit
Herpderp read the craigslist add dummy.

Edit again* so wait a minute, the wife is going to let you trade this for a Miata?
Ohhh you sneaky pete you...
Haha no, she's not going to let me trade it for a Miata. She's going to let me sell my beloved GTO and drive a beater for a while. However, I'm loose of the 5-year commitment and she knows I'm going to buy a Miata once it's financially viable to do so.

I'm sending you a PM.
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Old 12-05-2013, 08:49 PM   #20
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Sell that POS, and yes I owned a 06 with the LS2.
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