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Old 02-13-2009, 02:56 PM   #21
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Sorry guys, but I gotta dis-agree with a lot of your comments about why not to live in NY.

The only two I can possibly agree with is the expensive rent and homes. Every other reason screams "I am still a little kid so I need room to play and I dont like to be inconvenienced".
A few more reasons that I would say no to NY.

Yankees
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Old 02-13-2009, 03:03 PM   #22
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Sorry guys, but I gotta dis-agree with a lot of your comments about why not to live in NY.

The only two I can possibly agree with is the expensive rent and homes. Every other reason screams "I am still a little kid so I need room to play and I dont like to be inconvenienced".


Congrats to you for wearing bigboy pants.

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Old 02-13-2009, 03:59 PM   #23
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Cost of living: Compare prices in two cities - CNNMoney.com

I know these cost of living calulators aren't all that accurate, but it at least gives you some measure of things.

$80,000 in NYC manhattan is the equivalent of $35,575 in Fort Myers, FL which is the closest city I could find to you according to that calculator.

I have many friends (and two sister-in-laws) that live/work in NYC and it certainly is not cheap. But if it's a career stepping stone, it might be worth it.

Be prepared though to deal with the fact that most native New York City residents see the world like this:
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Old 02-13-2009, 04:50 PM   #24
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Needs more traffic congestion to be realistic.
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Old 02-13-2009, 04:52 PM   #25
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Joe what happened to law school, if you don't mind me asking? I thought you were pretty gun ho about getting accepted.
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Old 02-13-2009, 04:55 PM   #26
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Joe what happened to law school, if you don't mind me asking? I thought you were pretty gun ho about getting accepted.
My guess is he found out that you have to work 80 hour weeks doing corporate law in order to pay back the loan in anything under 20 years or to make enough money that would have justified the law school commitment. Or maybe that he can command\make more now then out of law school working the same amount of hours.
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Old 02-13-2009, 09:32 PM   #27
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How about some facts from a poor boy who was born and raised in NYC and the surrounding suburbs. Currently I make 43k a year and my GF makes 39k. We live in a smallish UPW apartment which costs us 2100 per month. We don't live extravagantly at all but we don't starve or lack for entertainment either. Everything is easily accessible and we're close to some of the best food (lots of good bars too) and entertainment anywhere.

I grew up in Westchester county which is the suburb directly north of NYC. I just moved 3 weeks ago from an apartment there that cost me 1300 per month for over 700 square feet. I could get from there to midtown Manhattan within 30-40 minutes by car if there is minimal to moderate traffic and less than 40 minutes by the metro north train which runs through most towns in Westchester county. As far as driving for pleasure there are fun roads within 30 minutes of the city. ALL the roads in the metro area are ******* terrible condition wise though. Westchester has the highest property tax in the nation I believe so I wouldn't buy a house there if I were you. It is pretty idyllic in some ways but also filled with housewives with Lexus SUVs...

I hear Queens is pretty nice. It seems like it's getting harder to get anything in Brooklyn for a decent price that's not a straight up ghetto.

I don't plan on staying in NYC forever because it is expensive compared to the rest of the country but it is a great great city. I've traveled a lot in my life and it's still probably my favorite place. It has a lot to offer. It is extremely diverse. I don't think that cartoon represents new york. It probably represents the upper west and east side but there are many many people here that were not born here and people from all different financial and political persuasions. I say it's worth it to stay here for a little while just to experience it but don't plan on settling down here, I don't.
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Old 02-13-2009, 10:05 PM   #28
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joe -

i think the pay isn't so much as an issue as it may be where you would be happiest.

10 years is a long time, NYC is the top market for many industries. Aim high on the salary. comparing your other salaries, i wouldn't take any less than $125k.
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Old 02-13-2009, 10:18 PM   #29
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if you live a little further south in jersey and don't mind an hour drive you can get a nice house with a 2car garage and own it and still have some extra
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Old 02-13-2009, 10:52 PM   #30
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My family is from NY. I used to go there for 1 month per year to visit them. Each time I went, I'd promise myself I'd never go back.

NYC is an ok place to visit in extreme moderation. The hayden planetarium and american museum of natural history are absolutely amazing.

NYC is a horrible place to live. Crowded. Dirty. Loud. Rude. Quality of life is low. Residences are small and expensive. Taxes are insane. Prices on basic necessities are rediculous. Government is brutal. People are disgustingly socialist-minded.
Odds are you won't be able to have a car, let alone drive it.

Last time I was up there, we went to a typical NYC delicatesin for lunch. I paid. $75 for 3 sandwiches, 2 diet cokes, 1 water, and 1 potato salad. At another place we had breakfast, I thanked the waitress for refilling my coffee. She was so astounded that she was thanked, she kind of stared at me blankly with her mouth partially opened.

Living outside the city isn't too much better, it's a bit less expensive, but you then also have a really shitty commute.

No matter where you go, you're always going to be in the flight path of 3 major international airports. Then you might also get the privelage of living near a commuter railroad.

$80K wouldn't be near enough to persuade me to live there.
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Old 02-13-2009, 11:09 PM   #31
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joe,

it all depends on how far you want to commute and if you plan on staying long enough top buy a property.

$80k will be pretty tough to survive on if you looking for a short commute and/or looking to buy. you could probably live comfortably in a rental over in north jersey and take the train in. BTW, there is some great driving up here (yes, jersey has mountain roads).

like i mentioned in another thread: the economy hasn't been significantly effected up here and homes are still outrageously priced.
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Old 02-13-2009, 11:45 PM   #32
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but the punani is exquisite!

and I have never had such tender gnudi
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Old 02-14-2009, 12:06 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Ben View Post
My family is from NY. I used to go there for 1 month per year to visit them. Each time I went, I'd promise myself I'd never go back.

NYC is an ok place to visit in extreme moderation. The hayden planetarium and american museum of natural history are absolutely amazing.

NYC is a horrible place to live. Crowded. Dirty. Loud. Rude. Quality of life is low. Residences are small and expensive. Taxes are insane. Prices on basic necessities are rediculous. Government is brutal. People are disgustingly socialist-minded.
Odds are you won't be able to have a car, let alone drive it.

Last time I was up there, we went to a typical NYC delicatesin for lunch. I paid. $75 for 3 sandwiches, 2 diet cokes, 1 water, and 1 potato salad. At another place we had breakfast, I thanked the waitress for refilling my coffee. She was so astounded that she was thanked, she kind of stared at me blankly with her mouth partially opened.

Living outside the city isn't too much better, it's a bit less expensive, but you then also have a really shitty commute.

No matter where you go, you're always going to be in the flight path of 3 major international airports. Then you might also get the privelage of living near a commuter railroad.

$80K wouldn't be near enough to persuade me to live there.
No...This is such a caricature of nyc and new yorkers its not even funny. I think NYC is a horrible place to visit but a nice place to live. There are (unfortunately) plenty of Republicans here. I have a car, park it, and drive it daily. If you payed $75 for that you got taken. I've never heard of something like that.
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Old 02-14-2009, 01:57 AM   #34
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people say similar stuff about DC. I had a garage a mile from the capitol. other than being far from my job, it was a great place to live.
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Old 02-14-2009, 03:15 AM   #35
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**** I'm glad I'm Canadian and live where I do.
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Old 02-14-2009, 09:51 AM   #36
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Joe, I just moved BACK to NY from Miami, FL.
I'll give you my opinion, which will differ from the majority here. Reason being it seems most people are going off of heresey and not actuality.
Let's clear a couple things up...

MANHATTAN--it's a place to work, it's a place to go for entertainment, otherwise you want to get in/out as fast as possible. Dont bother wasting a ton of money tryin to live there to shorten your commute.
Everyone commutes to the city via MASS TRANSIT. May be different where you are, but in Miami, there was no such thing. Here you have trains, subways, ferry, bus's, and express bus's. Not ONE of each, but many many many different one's at different times, going to all sorts of places. You can drive to the city, but its pointless. The roads are ****, traffic can get rough, and the worst is parking. **** living in the city.

OUTSIDE Manhattan--it's a whole different animal. Some areas are more city like, some are straight suburbs. Cost of housing is a fraction of what it is in Manhattan, you have everything you want (hardware stores, restaurants, movies, **** shops, pancake house, shops, malls, etc etc etc)
Alot of good rentals out there too. You can get yourself a basement apartment which will prob be a good 700+ sq ft for about 1k, maybe less depending on your taste. This would mean your own entrance, and most likely use of driveway, backyard, etc... (yes those thigns DO exist).

Price of real estate--yes its expensive. Again no use in fighting it, they do have a great tax abatement, and insurance here is dogshit compared to what I was paying in Miami.

Taxes are a bitch, no 2 ways about it. Fed, state, city, local (this is as of 2000--haven't worked since my return) all come out of income. Tolls are fairly expensive too.
Otherwise its the same old ****. Ben says he paid $75 for a couple sandwiches, I say either a gross exaggeration or alltogether BS.

Economy/housing market---it's just not really bad here. some people are hurting, but its the exception rather than the rule. Home prices have dropped, but no where near as dramatic.

Weather, I been here since early December. It's snowed like 4-5x's, but about 2" each time. Which is crap. Streets are clear immediately, etc.



You've probably done it already, but start checking craigslist for places. STart comparing things like supermarkets, and whatnot.

Anythign I can do to help let me know.
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Old 02-14-2009, 10:07 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Saml01 View Post
My guess is he found out that you have to work 80 hour weeks doing corporate law in order to pay back the loan in anything under 20 years or to make enough money that would have justified the law school commitment.
That's actually pretty close to spot on. I had dinner two nights ago with an old friend from high school who is now working for Sidley Austin, and doing pretty much exactly that.

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I have a car, park it, and drive it daily.
I've been curious about this- you're paying how much, and parking where? (and this is the Miata, yes?)



This is just something that was dropped on me yesterday. Obviously, for $80k I'm not moving to New York. I can make that doing freelance work living in FL, where my cost of living (quite literally) is nearly zero.

And I'm not starry-eyed about the big city. I've seen pretty much everything. I've built radio stations in LA, DC, Chicago, Boston, Denver, Seattle, DFW, Houston, Atlanta, Miami, Birmingham, New Orleans, Phoenix, etc... This is my fourth NYC build.

I enjoy the San Diego lifestyle. warm climate, nice roads. Of course, there's a reason I left, well, two reasons. Too expensive, and the company I worked for out there seems like it's circling the bowl.

I don't particularly enjoy the snow and cold, but then I survived 5 years in Cincinnati.


Quality of life issues:

1: Must have a private garage. This eliminates everything on Manhattan, as well as all multi-story apartment building. I don't need a big house, but I do need some space to work. Well, I'll add a proviso here. If I could afford something decent on the island, with maybe a spare bedroom to tinker in, I'd probably give up the car. It's time to sell this one and move on anyway.

2: Commuting. Ugh. Every place I've ever lived, I've managed to avoid horrid commutes. I've always factored that into my choice of residence. No freeway travel, usually no more than 10-15 minutes on good roads. Obviously that wouldn't be the case here. 90 minute commutes are out. 60 minute commutes would be pushing it. I can deal with mass transit if it's efficient (and Penn Station anyway, seems to run pretty well), though when the weather's nice, I'd probably buy a 250 to ride in on.

3: The burbs. Truth be told, I'm pretty comfortable living in nice, quiet suburban neighborhoods with boring tract homes populated by families with 2.5 children and a dog named "spot." Being able to purchase crack without walking more than 2 or 3 blocks would not qualify as an amenity in my book. I do not need to be entertained by the neighborhood spray-can art expo either.

So, are these goals entirely incompatible? What number would I need to talk them up to in order to live comfortably under this regime? 100? 120? 150?
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Old 02-14-2009, 11:01 AM   #38
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I park on the street. If my car had not been hit while parked in the burbs and had the bumper fucked up I'd probably cringe every time I walked away from parking it. It hasn't been hit yet somehow. Paying for a spot is out of my cashflow range. I may sell my car once I no longer work in the burbs because you don't need one in the city. I'm doing a reverse commute right now, which is great because I never have traffic. Sounds like the burbs would be good for you. Like I said and tvalenziano said mass transit is very good. You can live outside the city and have a train in your town that will get you there in twenty minutes or more depending on how far out you live.
On the other hand if you can make the same money and live in Florida or elsewhere for next to nothing I wouldn't move here unless you really loved NYC.
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Old 02-14-2009, 11:11 AM   #39
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I love to visit NYC from time to time to skate and ****, but I doubt I could ever handle living there. Too many people all over all the time for my liking.

Vash-
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Old 02-14-2009, 11:27 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by johndoe View Post
You can live outside the city and have a train in your town that will get you there in twenty minutes or more depending on how far out you live.
And that's the question- where specifically should I be looking that will put me in a decent place with a garage and yet still get me into to town quickly? Could be a regular house, a townhome / apartment (with garage, mind you), etc.

Quote:
On the other hand if you can make the same money and live in Florida or elsewhere for next to nothing I wouldn't move here unless you really loved NYC.
Well, I consider my current situation transitory. I hate the living dogshit out of Florida, and I need to leave. I'd also like to settle back into something resembling a normal job, because while I'm doing quite well now when I am working, work is somewhat sporadic at best.

My plan has been to attend the NAB convention in April, and hit up a couple of former competitors. Ex-Harris (and more specifically, ex-PR&E) people are somewhat valuable from a bragging rights standpoint. Axia even touts in it's print ads about "Mike Dosch and his team of ex-PR&E renegades". Problem is that Axia is in Cleveland, and Cleveland can eat a dick for all I care. Wheatstone is in Newbern NC, which wouldn't be too bad, although their president is kind of an ***.


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I love to visit NYC from time to time to skate and ****, but I doubt I could ever handle living there. Too many people all over all the time for my liking.
The weird thing, being a country boy at heart, is that it doesn't bother me one bit. I've never lived here full-time, but I've done month-long stretches in the city for work before. However I've always stayed in a hotel on the island, so the commute has been nothing more than one or two subway rides at the most.

The subway system I've got down pretty good. What I know virtually nothing about is the inter-city trains: PATH, all the **** that goes to Penn Station, etc. I've used PABT to get into Jersey exactly once, and I don't really consider that a viable commute option.

(On the plus side, I am told that WTC station is back up.)
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