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Old 03-02-2010, 12:59 AM   #21
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schuylkill county huh? I say you do it because I beed to get a ride in one of these v8 beasts.
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Old 03-02-2010, 01:04 AM   #22
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Do it please.
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Old 03-02-2010, 01:15 AM   #23
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As I matter of fact I here by challenge you to have a V8 miata in time for the tristatetuner sonic meet. haha.
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Old 03-02-2010, 01:52 AM   #24
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I'll never make that challenge, that's too much time and money involved to meet that goal in less than 2 months. I'm still not sure if I'm even doing this swap for sure. Everybody knows how much I love swapping ms's out every few months! So a clutch and ebc and I'll make about 240 hp now. Or I put in a stock 5.3 and make more power than my 1.8 does at 14psi, and I run 87 octane. I know the decision sounds easy, but my car got so far on the turbo setup, it'd be like starting from scratch all over again. I'm still buyin that motor and trans though. Maybe when they're in my garage and I'm trippin over em, then I'll make a decision.
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Old 03-02-2010, 01:59 AM   #25
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Honestly with 240WHP I think your car would be about as fast with the current setup as with a stockish 5.3. The 5.3 is usualy making something like mid-high 200s WHP (most were rated at about 300HP from the factory) and it will add a couple hundred pounds. The neccesity for custom exhuast will wake up the 5.3 in a big way though over the manifolds they use from the factory, so who knows.

Actually it would be pretty awesome to get some accel data now and then some from a stock 5.3 and T56 later.
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Old 03-02-2010, 02:02 AM   #26
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Ok i think i can add some input to this thread since I have spent the last few weeks researching endlessly about what I want my next future project car to be.

Ok, as sportage4x4 mentions and nobody seems to notice is that you can get truck motors made of aluminum. There is the L33 5.3 motor from 4x4 extended cabs or something like that. Also im pretty sure after 07 all of the 5.3 blocks went to aluminum. There is a problem though ... The oilpan dips down really low, so you need to buy a camaro or corvette pan. Additionally, the intake setup makes the motor somewhat tall, requiring a cowl hood (yuck) or (you guessed it) a camaro/corvette intake. That said, it can still be done for less since the silverado motors arent rediculously overpriced like the LS car motors. The next thing to consider is the price of the t56 transmission. You will likely have to drop more bones on the transmission alone than the whole motor. Transmissions seem to run a lot cheaper when bought in a bundle with the motor. My guess is that for around 2.5k you can setup a 5.3 aluminum truck motor + T56 with low miles on the engine, or an LS1 + t56 with higher miles but less headaches.

After all my reading, I have kind of decided that LS motors are overpriced and have began considering a LT1 + T56 swap, of which I recently saw a combo on craigslist for $1000, which is a hell of a lot cheaper ... Iron block sucks though.

FYI, LS1 vs LT1 fully dressed have about 150 - 200lbs weight difference.
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Old 03-02-2010, 02:18 AM   #27
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I wouldn't do an lt1, totally different engine design.
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Old 03-02-2010, 02:37 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akaryrye View Post
Ok i think i can add some input to this thread since I have spent the last few weeks researching endlessly about what I want my next future project car to be.

Ok, as sportage4x4 mentions and nobody seems to notice is that you can get truck motors made of aluminum. There is the L33 5.3 motor from 4x4 extended cabs or something like that. Also im pretty sure after 07 all of the 5.3 blocks went to aluminum.
Wow I'm a sacrider big time of the Gen III and IV SBC motors, and I didn't even realize they actually did this!!

The LC9 Vortec 5300 is the Flex-Fuel version of the LH6, and is found in 4WD models. SUV applications are rated at 310 hp (231 kW) and 335 ftlbf (454 Nm) of torque.
LC9 applications:
I've found several for under $1000.00 on car-part.com..

RUNS PERFECT, 21,463 MILES $975.00!

god I need to ditch this turbo 4 crap and just do et...
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Old 03-02-2010, 03:04 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
I wouldn't do an lt1, totally different engine design.
Definitely, i wouldnt try to say that they are because they are not. OTOH, for a budget build if an iron block isnt out of the question, I think the LT1 offers an awesome bang for the buck. Yes, they are older and have their flaws, but i can overlook that when saving nearly $2000 for a swap that offers similar performance. For a miata though, I would have a hard time being ok with all the additional weight to the front end. I have been looking real hard at swapping into a datsun 2X0 z car or an FC rx7, so that changes the game a little bit but the weight is still of concern. In the Rx7, dropping the AC and PS, relocating the battery to the trunk, adding a fire extinguisher and a 10" sub to the back, and swapping to an aluminum hood should do enough to make the car balanced close to 50/50. The rest can be tuned with sways, camber, tire offset, and alignment at that point.

My main point in all of this is that I would never consider an iron block LS series motor in light of the prices of the LT unless cost wasn't a concern, which it always is. Therefore if you are hell bent on the LS, I say get the aluminum block or dont get an LS.

I am not saying you need to go LT1, because I know the LS1 is way better, but rather that the money saved on a cheaper motor swap like tha can be used to reconcile the chasis. Dont forget the toyota UZ1 V8 at, i think, 4.8L and 280hp. It is all aluminum and probably the best match for a miata. It is another motor I have given some thought to and need to research more.

Whatever you do, make it yours and always keep your goals in mind because you do not want to do something that comprimises what you like about the car. If you like handling, put the weight distribution first, but if you like acceleration, have at it with whatever you think will achieve that.
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Old 03-02-2010, 03:08 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan View Post
Wow I'm a sacrider big time of the Gen III and IV SBC motors, and I didn't even realize they actually did this!!

The LC9 Vortec 5300 is the Flex-Fuel version of the LH6, and is found in 4WD models. SUV applications are rated at 310 hp (231 kW) and 335 ftlbf (454 Nm) of torque.
LC9 applications:
I've found several for under $1000.00 on car-part.com..

RUNS PERFECT, 21,463 MILES $975.00!

god I need to ditch this turbo 4 crap and just do et...
Pretty amazing huh? those 07 and up truck motors are the bargain of the century! Gotta change out the pan and probably the intake manifold, but they are low mileage and get amazing gas mileage for the powah.
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Old 03-02-2010, 10:08 AM   #31
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So I just got back from looking at the 5.3. As I said before, complete means intake to oil pan, and the guy said it was missing the coils. The coils were gone, but everything else except the spark plugs, starter, and alternator, was there. I turned it over fairly easy by hand. The fuel rails with the injectors were there, the throttle body was there, water pump, balancer, clutch fan, pulleys, valve covers, all there. $200, pickin it up Friday. As for my 6 speed buddy, he may as well not own a cell phone, cause unless I see him in person, I won't get a hold of him. So Friday I'll bring the motor home and bolt it on my engine stand. I think what I'm going to do is start stock piling parts for a swap. I.e. engine, trans, clutch, engine stuff like starter, alternator, flywheel, LS6 intake, T/A or Camaro oil pan, etc...whatever is necessary to fit this engine in my car. As for goals, I don't have any idea where to start yet...what HP do I want? What gears should I run? What clutch should I buy? I have no idea about any of this yet.
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Old 03-02-2010, 10:14 AM   #32
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Goals to start on. I want to drive it to work everyday in the summer and get 25 mpg. I want to drive to the dragstrip on street tires, and run a 12.9 sec 1/4 mile "being gentle".
So who has engine config suggestions / gear ideas?
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Old 03-02-2010, 10:59 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akaryrye View Post
My main point in all of this is that I would never consider an iron block LS series motor in light of the prices of the LT unless cost wasn't a concern, which it always is. Therefore if you are hell bent on the LS, I say get the aluminum block or dont get an LS.
Unlike the LT1, you can go to an AL block if you do the 5.3 LS engine in iron. Its a mater of changing the shortblock. If you go LT1, you are

1) Stuck with iron forever.
2) Stuck with an inferior head design.
3) Stuck with an engine that as less aftermerket support, especiall in terms of tuning. LS1Edit FTW.
4) Have to do more resarch on things like mounts etc. The 5.3 will bolt up with the same mount fab that all the other LS swaps do, meaning that he doesnt have to reinvent the wheel.

The 5.3 is a much better way to go.

I am shocked that nobody has mentioned this yet:

Chevy | Camaro | Firebird Reviews, Performance Parts, Modifications - LS1Tech.com

I have been on that site off and on for years. Best info out there regarding these engines.
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:06 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgen View Post
Goals to start on. I want to drive it to work everyday in the summer and get 25 mpg. I want to drive to the dragstrip on street tires, and run a 12.9 sec 1/4 mile "being gentle".
So who has engine config suggestions / gear ideas?
If you get a T56, you have pretty conservative gearing in it 9 times out of 10. And in a car this light with its limited wheel sizing, you dont want or need an aggressive rear gear either. I would go with 3.47 in the back, not 3.73 or 4.10. Honestly the 3.23 or even the 2.73 ratio you see in some OEM LS powered cars would probably be fine. And you dont have to shift much in an AutoX much that way


Mileage will be a cinch. M6 Fbodies regularly get 25+ MPG even with 3.73 gears, and they are over 1000 LBs heavier.

They also run low 13s box stock with a good driver in good air (aka sea level 70 degrees). So your 1320 goal is pretty conservative IF you get it to hook OK. Tire/wheel choice will be important, as will the pinion angle. Getting the rear geometry right is huge in making the car hook and go straight.
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:23 AM   #35
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My main problem with doing an Ls truck motor swap is in getting the car street legal, because i need to use a car motor and not a truck motor, which is completely retarded but whatever ...
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Old 03-02-2010, 11:31 AM   #36
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if you dont do the 5.3 swap, look into the vh45de. very healthy stock power numbers. they stick them into 240's (dubbed the 450sx) and boats.

- Forged steel crankshaft.
- Forged steel connecting rods.
- 6 Bolt main bearing caps with studs.
- Full-length main bearing girdle.
- Lightweight, floating pistons with molybdenum coating.
- Sodium-filled exhaust valves.
- Cross-flow cooling system.
- Hydraulic lash adjusters.
- Single-row silent timing chain.
- Coil-on-plug ignition system.
- Redline of 6900 rpm, Or 7400 RPM's with a modified ECU.
- Compression ratio of 10.2 to 1.
- Bore of 93 mm and stroke of 82.7 mm.

280hp/300ft/lb in na form.

the Lexus v8 (1uzfe) that 18psi was talking about has around the same compression, less hp (253) same torque, (300) but it does have vvti.
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Old 03-02-2010, 01:20 PM   #37
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i dont get the whole has to be a car engine thing. so tell them its an LS1 from an F-body. once you put an f-body pan and intake on it, how will they know?

personally, i'm building a high revving LS engine. 83mm crank from the 4.8 with the 5.7's 99mm pistons. gives 5.1L. arp rod bolts, and a good damper and the bottom end should hold together for 7500rpm. i'm trying to score a set of Z06 243 heads simply because of the lighter valves. i have a set of 799 heads if all else fails. a cam in the mid 220's to low 230's duration, and all associated valvetrain parts shoud make the engine breathe up that rev limit.

i'm getting sick and tired of trying to find a non abused T56 in the sub $2000 range (canuck here, eh). seriously considering other trans options. as for a rear gear, the standard 8.8 T-bird 3.27 gear should be just about perfect.
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Old 03-02-2010, 06:45 PM   #38
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Thats what I am wondering. Do they check a serial number or require documentation of the engine of some type?

And I hear you on the T56. That is the most hyped trans by far. Take a look at a TKO500 or something like that. You can get them new from Summit for about 1300 (not counting the shipping of course). A Miata has 0 use for a 6 speed with that engine. 4th will go faster than the aero can handle safely and then 5th can be a super low rpm overdrive since the engine will have such an easy time moving such a lightweight car.
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Old 03-02-2010, 06:45 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -Banks- View Post
if you dont do the 5.3 swap, look into the vh45de. very healthy stock power numbers. they stick them into 240's (dubbed the 450sx) and boats.

- Forged steel crankshaft.
- Forged steel connecting rods.
- 6 Bolt main bearing caps with studs.
- Full-length main bearing girdle.
- Lightweight, floating pistons with molybdenum coating.
- Sodium-filled exhaust valves.
- Cross-flow cooling system.
- Hydraulic lash adjusters.
- Single-row silent timing chain.
- Coil-on-plug ignition system.
- Redline of 6900 rpm, Or 7400 RPM's with a modified ECU.
- Compression ratio of 10.2 to 1.
- Bore of 93 mm and stroke of 82.7 mm.

280hp/300ft/lb in na form.

the Lexus v8 (1uzfe) that 18psi was talking about has around the same compression, less hp (253) same torque, (300) but it does have vvti.
Good call there, IIRC there is a shop in Australia that specializes in the 1ZFUE. Sounds pretty sweet.
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Old 03-02-2010, 09:30 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akaryrye View Post
Pretty amazing huh? those 07 and up truck motors are the bargain of the century! Gotta change out the pan and probably the intake manifold, but they are low mileage and get amazing gas mileage for the powah.
Several years ago I had my hands on a 1990 240sx SE with basically no engine/trans inside it for $150.00 with a mostly straight body. The basic plan was the GM LQ9 & T-56 which was about the most bang for the buck that could be found.. Much as I LOVE the LS1 engine, I'm just NOT going to pay $4000.00+ for one.

Only problem was, at the time there weren't many vehicles around the LQ9 could be readily found inside, so I was pricing out 100k mile motors for $2500 and up. Naturally now the car is gone the motors can be had with lower mileage for under $1k.. Lost the place I was keeping the car and had to sell it, sadly.

The intake an oil pan are non-issues honestly. You won't have quite the torque using the lsx intake vs the truck manifold but quality aftermarket units can be had pretty cheap, and plenty of LSx car owners are upgrading and would probably sell off the stockers.
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