Want or do not want? Subaru BRZ STI
 

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"The aggressive front end, slightly protruding front fenders, and low-slung look all combine to taunt us with its likely driving dynamics, which should be sporty and fun if not outright powerful; the 2.0-liter boxer engine under the hood will generate something in the neighborhood of 200 horsepower. That's plenty of oomph for fun in its roughly 2,700-pound frame, but not so much as to be intimidating."

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1...eles-auto-show

With some aftermarket goodies to make more power, I'm thinking WANT!

Do want.

Just read about in new Motor Trend. I really like what they're trying to do here.

Want

Should be cool depending on fitment of existing boxer aftermarket parts like turbo kits. The block will likely be open deck and have glass pistons like other subies so it probably won't take to lots of boost but if a 2.5L fits and the transmission isn't glass it has a lot of potential

When are they going to learn that we need 10lb/hp? Seriously, come on.


I bet that car will rape you in your mouth.

I have a glass slipper.

+1.

What will the toyota version have power/weight wise? It seems like they are going to be the same cars practically....with the subie having the option of dropping an STI engine into it.

This might be my next DD.

Looks like a GTR, but I like.

Id rock it. Unfortunately I doubt I will ever be able to justify spending that much money on a car. It kills me every time I think about getting a newer STI and realize that they go for 30k +

Price will probably make or break these cars. I hate the fact that toyota will sell them as scion, since I absolutely hate that name/logo.

I'm thinking the same thing.

I wonder- are the Subaru forums inundated by people posting about Miatas?


Also:

http://images.thecarconnection.com/m...00370682_m.jpg

Nagare disease is apparently spreading.

Is this thing all or rear wheel drive? Guessing rear from the quoted curb weight.

Oh, and maybe want. Have to see it in person first.

These are back wheel drive.

I'm not sold on it, but I like it except for the wing. I'd like to know the price.

?

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Even if you could it wouldn't be worth your time. Some higher up dude at Fuji Heavy Industries (Subaru's parent company) said the trans sits so far back that you can't get front axles in there. That sounds like too much work for 100 extra hp, especially with the headache of putting an older motor in a newer car.

Plus STI engines are more overpriced than a couple of SR20's overnighted from japan the week before race wars.

+1 for want. But how long until an STI type version hits? I want, but not until I know that the week after I get one a new bad ass one won't hit I could have gone home in. Like ordering a Jeep with bigger axles and then the Rubicon gets released the next month. Or buying a BMW k1200 and 6 months later the new k1300's get released. Not like it happened or anything.

That was also addressed. One of the lead engineers said if you want a high power car, buy an sti. This car is apparently all about driving dynamics. Plus, if they sold a version with 60 extra hp for $32k (the price gap from an impreza to wrx is about $5k and they're estimating it to sell for $27k right?) would that cut into wrx and sti sales? Or would it sell period? After Subaru undermined sti sales by making the newish wrx faster straight line than the sti, I'm sure the bean counters will make sure there is a clear distinction between the two models.

DO NOT WANT. It's really ugly and overpriced. New shit has way too many bells and whistles, next thing they'll be giving us colonoscopys. Give me a bare bones car with a good sounding radio and a fun power to weight ratio and I'm good. AC is nice too.

^This makes me feel way under informed but better now. Might be the new car for the wife in a year or 2. Or whenever they actually hits showrooms. Now to look up release dates. Need another toy like I need an STD tho

Ugly.

I hate this design shit (on a lot of new cars) with 48" tall doors with 6" of window. The ratio is all wrong and it makes it look like a fucking billboard.
I'm also past sick of this design cue of the "hidden" bumper look...you know, painting a large piece of it black to blen in with the front opening. It's terrible.

It looks like an RX-8 raped a 350Z in the shower.

When Your Powers Combine:

http://www.autocarcentre.com/wp-cont...issan-370z.jpg

http://www.lincah.com/wp-content/upl...-Side-View.jpg

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WANT

Haters gon hate, I think it looks great and to have a somewhat lightweight (compared to the rest of the lineup that is) rwd option in the subaru lineup is going to be pretty nice.

Also this competition with hyundai, nissan, etc over rwd "somewhat affordable sports cars" has the potential to end up with epicness for us. Hyundai is already uppping the power output of both their genesis models for next revision.

Last I heard Scion version was 197hp, 2877lbs which sounds a bit heavy to me.

I believe the Toyota and Subaru versions are basically identical outside of sheetmetal and bumpers, so I doubt the Subaru version would be 170lbs lighter.

Overall I think DO WANT, but the base Subaru version, not the faux STI version shown above. Sounds like the STI version for this car will be like the Mugen Si, all fluff no performance increase...

If the regular version looks identical I completely agree. No turbo no care, gimme the regular version.

I do believe the STI motor is drop in for the Toyota model also...

Same mounts all around.

I am a little disappointed that subaru and toyota didnt put more effort into differentiating between the two cars. Atleast make the subie turbo'd or something...its like rebadge engineering all over again, with different color options and a big spoiler on the back.

Aww, a baby GTR, how cute.

I'm not saying I don't want it. But it'll definitely need a tiny turbo for me to want one over a turbo genesis with the track pack. I think it's a good step in the right direction. People may actually start to realize that a good chassis and less power is better than a fwd car that has a million hp, shitty brakes, and no business in a corner.

I honestly think the Forte Koupe looks better...too bad it's FWFail.

http://speedworks57.files.wordpress....pg?w=600&h=400

which fwd car are you talking about? because the ms3 and the newer-ish cobalt ss had a million hp, really good brakes, and plenty of business in corners.

I'll take the scion with a boxer motor, plz. Not this confused mess of lines.

What everyone's feeling on the Abarth? Wrong wheel drive and all but, small, tossable, boosted, hatch. I know I'm not the only one that doesn't want or need a 4 door wagon. I like the Mazdaspeed 3 and so does the wife. If it was a 2 door I'd have one.

The Abarths we call sneezing meatballs here. The tip over quite easily when using the curbs a little...
Too tall and too small for my liking (even the lowered race versions). Mazda2 feels huge in comparison (that's a better hatch IMHO).

Don't get me wrong- the overall concept is refreshing. I just find it specifically annoying that this Joker-smile front grille design is becoming more and more common among what would otherwise be described as beautiful cars.

It'd be like giving Grace Park a Joan Rivers-style facelift.

Some people were suggesting that I wait and get one of these after a deer killed my wrx. They're pretty cool, and I could see myself driving one, but I ended up choosing a Miata because it made more sense for what I'll be doing with it.

On Nasioc, owning a Miata is almost a prerequisite for being a moderator.

Not sure about nazicock, but every other forester owner on sf.org has a miata lulz
gay roadster+lesbian wagon= thuper all around

I think the front end looks more like the LFA(unsurprising as toyota did the styling I think?) The rear with the quad tailpipes does look more GTR ish than STI.

I hope it kicks the ass of the shitty genesis coupe

Not talking about sports cars. I'm talking about the cars that are the bread and butter for car manufacturers. The ones that general public buys because if it feels quick in a straight light, it's a sports car. For example, that commuter Hyundai with two hundred something hp. I like that some car companies are starting to focus more on driving dynamics rather than power output. And I agree however: the last gen ms3 was fantastic. The new one- not so much. The cobalt was killed (unfortunately) and I still haven't heard anything about the fuckus ST. So even the fwd mighty mites don't have much to offer currently.

doesn't look like that's going to happen any time soon since the next genesis is getting a healthy power increase in both powertrains to go along with its redesign while these assholes aren't even mentioning intentions of forced induction.....yet

unless they stop pussyfooting around and slap a damn churbo on there the genesis is going to bitchslap the brz in a straight line

I cant remeber the exaxt details but I got my motortrend on this thing and from what I can remember its way underpowered stock? or did I accident?

The Genesis Coupe you mean? Somebody dyno'd or drag raced that thing and found it to be underpowered/slow.

I would argue that a lot of that involves design-via-regulatory framework (i.e. side and pedestrian impact).

Do you know anything about these cars? Tell me about the "bells and whistles" and in what way it is overpriced.

Heres a "preview" of the Toyota 86 by Speedhunters. Idk how partial it will be, but there are at least good pictures.
http://speedhunters.com/archive/2011...e-preview.aspx

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I think it looks good. Want or Do Not Want depends on the price and what the reviews end up saying about it. Do not want spoiler though.

I cant get over how "ugly" new cars look.

I think this is the worst one yet. Even worse than that subaru mess.


This is the only 86 worth a shit.


http://www.thedetroitbureau.com/wp-c...RS-86-side.jpg

It's missing the motherfucking turbo

holy narrow tires batman

215s just look silly on this car

I don't think it looks that terrible, and at least they're making a car like this.

I may actually considering buying a BRZ sometime in the future. I'll probably have to wait a bit for a used one, I don't think I could bring myself to buy a new one.

I'm really curious to see how this car does. I think this could end poorly in terms of sales because it seems to have been built for the vocal minority of car enthusiasts.

The problems are:

• They make up a small portion of the buying public.
• I would expect a significant portion of those enthusiastic about buying this car probably can't.
• I would think another portion of the target market will have unrealistic expectations and will be disappointed (e.g. expecting 300 whp, 2800 lbs and $23k purchase price)
• More people will cross-shop on looks and MPG versus actual handling and chassis balance (e.g. Kia Forte Koup vs FR-S)

Basically, I would think of this thing as a competitor to the MX-5 and a fit for those people that like the idea of the MX-5 but want a little more utility and no convertible (or current stigma).

All else being equal, would narrow tires be more fuel efficient than wider? I've seen the Toyota people mention that the car is built for the enthusiast and expect wheel and tire swaps, specifically having the rear seats fold flat to allow four wheels and tires to fit in the back/trunk.

Want

Focus ST is looking more promising.

AWD? FWD = No want, maybe used eventually but not new.

247hp>200hp after 1st gear

Yes, in general narrower tires = better fuel economy.

The Toyota guys keep talking about how they wanted the car to be goodz for the driftz. I wonder if the narrow tires make the car a bit more tossable? If I were to get a BRZ you could bet your sweet ass there will be some 245s or 255s on some wide wheels on it, and I'm sure that's the case with any enthusiast who would buy one.

Don't think this has been posted yet, but to give you an idea of it's overall size. Personally I like the front end and the tail lights on the BRZ better than Toyotas version. With a little snail on the stock boxer motor it would be a pretty fun DD and throw an STI or EJ20 motor in it and it would be one badass track car.

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Someone needs to take one of the stock photos, lower it and put some CE28N's on it or something like that. Some guys did that with the AE86 version and it looks pretty hot.

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263 HP > 247 HP after 1st gear? (Mazdaspeed3 for a turbo, FWD hatchback)

Right; so 215s allow for better fuel economy and marginally lower operating costs for the person looking for a "sporty car" (aka Celica buyers) and better ability to initiate more mad driftz for the sidewayz crew (considering the seemingly paltry ~150 torques).

Meanwhile, they have hopefully left plenty of fender space (and trunk pass-through opening) for the guys that want to go with 225s or larger for more grip. My understanding is that one of the base models proposed for Japan comes with very basic 16" wheels. I am personally not a fan of "bigger is better" when it comes to wheels and would actually look to downsize the factory 17s to some wider 16s.


I love the idea of this car but I think it will be a sales failure.

LOL. I hate the 350Z and the Chrysler 300 for starting that stupid trend. I can't believe the trend is still going after a decade.