Hi All!
 

Well hello guys! New to MT.net, but not Miatas. Share the same love as many of you, even learned to drive a manual in a Miata! Grew up dreaming of "Mad-tyte-JDM-style-yo", and as I matured, learned to respect the Miata as the unparalleled roadster that it is. Now, with that said, (I believe I am commiting blasphemy here...) my Miata is N/A at the moment :eek3: . I know right? Do not worry though, it will be soon enough, I just have another goal in mind first. Does it involve speed, hp, and fun? Yes, but without a turbo. I would like to see just how much power I can squeeze out of my engine before I really crank up the grin factor. I believe I am headed in the right direction, currently producing around 145 whp (per DJ) without ever opening the engine. I have a short-term N/A goal of 160 whp (DJ as well), and a modest long-term FI goal of 225 wph. The closer I can get to that before-hand, the easier it will be with the turbo, right? I will post pics later, as I cannot find my SD-card adapter right now, but I still wanted to go ahead and say "Hey!"

ummmm, I got nothin.....

Just saying hello and giving a few details about my Miata-related goals. Finally found my SD card.
http://[IMG]http://i56.tinypic.com/2vxg9zc.jpg[/IMG]
http://[IMG]http://i53.tinypic.com/2zns9ac.jpg[/IMG]
http://[IMG]http://i51.tinypic.com/dm8b4m.jpg[/IMG]

http://i56.tinypic.com/2vxg9zc.jpg
http://i53.tinypic.com/2zns9ac.jpg
http://i51.tinypic.com/dm8b4m.jpg

welcome what is on there to make the 145whp currently?

Most of the big stuff is is my Signature. The header/high-flow exhaust really opened it up though. I put in a set of Pulse-plugs and actually picked enough several hp and 4 mpg! Let me explain the 145 though. I registered 136 whp (on a DJ) with: Compression problems due to block + motor honey in oil. To be exact, before the oil additive, my PSI in the cylinders was 150,120,90,89. I've heard stories of how bulletproof these engines are... but GEEZ! I've never seen any engine at those levels move at all, and I drove around for 6 months+ just waiting on it to fail so I could replace it (It never did, so I just started the rebuild anyway). Since then, I have replaced the block with one from an 01, not only restoring the compression, but with a 10:1 CR as well. I assumed 9 hp was not too much of a stretch to have been restored since I upped the CR(I will not say added, as it was just being robbed from the beginning). It sure feels like it anyway! But I guess without a dyno chart reading the big 1-4-5, I cant concretely say that just yet. The most recent chart I do have is a MustangDyne reading 121 from a local dyno-day I went too with the bad engine. My friends stock + MSPNP registered a 104 right before mine.

Cool story bro.
You're full of shit. You make nowhere near 145whp
That kind of ricer math will get you flamed real quick here. I doubt you even make 121whp actually.

Those gay mods do diddly dick for our cars.

*edit-
PS: do you like being blinded by assholes with bright hid's in non hid reflector headlights?

Some guy put, on his car:
Aggressive N/A HKS cams (Don't remember the specs, unfortunately)
I/H/E
MS

And ended up with a little under 120hp at the wheels.

AKA: You're full of shit.

The flywheel weighs 10.4 lbs. Let me get my scanner going and I can prove I am higher than him on a Mustang, if that is what he used as well, then he should get it put on a Dynojet. I believe the difference is 12-13%? Thats how it worked out on mine. Besides the plugs, wires, trifecta, flywheel, and increased CR, yes the internals are stock.

:bowrofl::bowrofl::bowrofl:

omg what a fucking ricer

:facepalm:

Sorry bro, flywheel weight wont do shit for your horsepower.

A heavier flywheel will make your car read lower HP in low gears. If you pulled in 4th gear or 5th gear, it wont make a difference.

Building a high HP n/a car will leave you desiring A LOT if you want to go to a turbo car. High HP N/A cars have high CRs, while High HP turbo cars have low CRs.

For the money you will spend on headwork to gain 2 or 3 hp, you can spend just as much on turbo supporting modification to gain 50 or 60 hp...and your thousands to get your 2 or 3 hp wont improve your 50-60 turbo HP.

I'm still laughing my ass off that he thinks a rebuilt stock bp with intake and exhaust puts down 145whp LMAO

I dont understand how a flywheel automatically turns me into a ricer? My exhaust note is nowhere near ricey... nor do I have lambo doors, a body kit, spoiler, or rev up at every toyota corrola that rides by. It frees up hp, and that is what I was looking for.
http://i56.tinypic.com/142ua76.jpg

I'm not doing any work to the engine that won't cross-over to turbo. The amount of boost that most miatas push is not enough to require the low compression that many people are putting in their engines. You can solve those issues with tuning, not just throwing in another part. I am only shooting for around 225 hp with a turbo, so the 10:1 wont hurt my results. If I were to be aiming higher, yes, I completely agree that the CR is too high.

That's engine horsepower you're reading :facepalm:

They come 140bhp stock... I highly doubt I dropped 20 hp by adding parts.

140 AT THE FLYWHEEL

You think you have 100% driveline effeciency?

Those mods probably added 5hp, so youre at 125, at the MOST

OP do you know what drivetrain loss means?

What is the common standard? 26 hp loss?

There is no set number, but 15-20% about right.

Now just to be clear, dyno's are just a tool to see how much one has gained and not the end all be all power measurement. trap speed is the real power indicator. But lets get real here, there is no way in hell an intake/exhaust nb is putting down 145whp. Or 130 even.

I posted earlier that it was put on a dynojet and registered 136 hp. That was with compression loss and 9.5:1 pistons. I am now running full compression and 10:1. I stated in the same post that "I am assuming around 145 hp, but without a dyno chart to prove it, I cannot concretely say that, but it feels like it picked up some". I am sorry if it came across that I was bound and determined to have 145 hp, as I cannot prove it. This post was not meant like that. I will be going back to the dyno soon to see how the new block performs, at that time I will post my new charts.

so you're saying with a shot block you put down more power than any other miata with those mods EVER in the history of miatas?

Better call the guiness books of records asap

And yes, I completely agree with you on trap speed over dyno. I can't find my time slips though

And I wouldn't say "EVER" either. There was a build thread on here at one point of an N/A that produced 170 hp, and he did not have too much more than I. (Cams, more tuning)

OP sounds legit. Everyone knows a k&N is good for 50whp.

:facepalm:
You can't be serious.

1st of all cams and tuning is a whole helluvalot more than just intake and exhaust.
2nd even with "just" cams/ecu/intake/exhaust there is no way in hell an otherwise stock bp will make 170whp. You are dreaming.

I'm not wasting any more time on this retarded conversation. You will realize soon enough how ridiculous/retarded your claims/beliefs are.

haha, I'd be happy if you could get 3. Heat soak is so bad with the filter basically on top of the header. How could I prevent that? Oh yea... a turbo : )

So the amount of drive line loss is variable? If I make 500bhp I'm only getting about 425-400whp? I'm thinking no. The amount of loss is constant (in relation to engine HP). 25hp is a pretty commonly thrown around number.

Carry on.

Lurk more.

Thank you Jayc, and i'm not too sure how to respond to the "lurk more" comment. But how much power are you making with that setup?

Out of curiosity....Am I missing something? Why is the crossover point on your dyno graph NOT 5252rpm?

Also, are torque and HP on a different scale? It must be because those numbers don't add up at all. Either way, that dyno sheet looks like a pile of horse shit.

dyno #s don't mean shit anyway, but they at least tend to mathematically add up. Your sheet.....doesnt. :/

Yes, the scales are different. My torque at 3k (where the graph begins) is 101, and peaks at 116. My hp, on the other hand, is only at 58 at 3k, and rises to 120 over the course of the graph. Left (torque) side reads from 95->116. Right reads from at 58->120. The shop looked very low-quality, but is one of the only ones around that offers dyno-days.

Me and a friend (stock miata + MSpNp), only went to compare mine to what a stock one would read. To my understanding, even if a dyno differs from other dynos, it is still reliable to an extent as long as you stick to that dyno. Dyno1 1st results vs. Dyno1 2cd results = comparable. Not Dyno1 vs. Dyno2

Dyno days are an easy sell when you have an optimistic dyno :)

Stock miata registered 104 hp. Seems consistent with Mazda specs. 140bhp - 25 (drivetrain losses) = 115. Remember this was a mustang dyno, so add 12% to = dynojet standard. = 116 hp. +/- 1 hp doesnt seem too optimistic

Lurk more. Every time you mash you fist against your keyboard and produce some barely intelligible crap you look like a moron. Lurk more and look less like an idiot.

I don't know what numbers I'm getting on my setup. I press the go pedal and it makes me feel happy.

How much horsepower does it take to make the drivetrain actually turn then? 25hp? 26hp?

Have you ever put a wrench on your crank bolt and turned the engine over? Here's a hint - YOU are a man and not a horse, YOU produce FAR LESS than 1 horsepower.

It's a fact - you will lose a percentage of torque via "drivetrain loss" - if it was a set number, people wouldn't be worrying about transmission fluid temps on track.

Hell - NASCAR uses a rear differential cooler and pump - there is only one reason they would need to cool the fluid in their differentials - heat buildup from friction in the differential, that friction robs power as a percentage. If it were a set number, our family sedans would have differential fluid pumps and coolers.

Awesome fuckin' post, mang.

Not variable on power level but variable on drivetrain and its moving parts.

Saying "25hp" is just stupid.
Read up on drivetrain loss.
CORRECT. Worded it better than I could have. Thank you

OP, study more and post less. You have much to learn before making a single assertion. Remember, not one person here knew how little you understood before you made your first post. You reveal more with every post so please stop, for your sake. The next time you have an idea, just let it go. We don't need to know about it.

All of you are fucking retards. I was at 180whp with a MS/intake/ and Honda decals. I would've probably put 190 with an exhaust and 200 with headers.

probably with about 5 headers

ftfy

its vtak. get it right

No that 200 withOUT vtakkkkk... when vtakkkkk kicks in Im at about 250hp. Holla at yo boy!!

250hp?? You mus got naws up in dat bitch! Don't be frontin'.

I have. And conventional wisdom is that a Miata with stock drive train will loose about 25hp at PEAK HP. This is backed up with dyno testing. This is true at either stockish HP or 250whp. Obviously I'm not talking about any driveline in any car, just a Miata.

So what is the 15-20% of?

You just changed your argument.

Post up results of a 250rwhp dyno at the rear wheels.

Then take that engine out of the car, remove the transmission, and post up the results of the same 250rwhp car at the crank.

Do the same thing with a stock car, and post up those results too.

When the drop from car A to car B is a constant at peak HP, then you can tell us how wrong we are.

Professional motorsports still begs to differ.

Nah nigga I have a 120 shot so that puts me at about 370hp you know we be doin it and shit.

We are saying the same thing but you are trying to be a fucking smart ass when in reality you're just an ass.

Its a variable percentage because all miatas are not exactly the same and all don't have EXACTLY the same drive train loss. different transmissions, different rear ends, different rotational mass etc etc etc differences in the drivetrain will dictate how much percentage of the peak engine output the car will lose.


if you dyno two miatas with same engine power output but different drivetrains then swap the two engines they will NOT put down EXACTLY the same power.

That is called drivetrain loss.

now fuck off


And again you worded it better than me. Thank you:)

I didn't change my tune, I clarified my statement.

I have not personally done it, but am relying on what has been posted by Randy Stocker and others. 25-26hp was what they found independent of the power the engine makes at peak HP. Not a % of what power the engine makes.

Wanna hug?

Damn nigga! I ain't racen u fo sho now. Dat shiz foreal yo! Props!

fify

Tell yo boy Spilner wat up yo!

Easy there, Toretto, we all know Corona is a shitty beer.

:giggle:

Sure, just don't get hard or Hustler will get jealous.

Too late, already hard.