'03 COP Settings - DIYPNP - Car Is Barely Drivable
 

My car runs like crap and I think it's ignition related. I have another similar thread with more detail, but it's not specific so it gets no love.

I recently swapped in a '03 motor after my '00 motor died. I transferred over the intake manifold/TB, cam angle sensor, along with the crank angle sensor and 4 tooth trigger wheel from the '00 motor.

Attached is a screenshot of my current Ignition Options, however after looking at Hustlers commuter MSQ for comparison, I noticed a few options that may explain my issues:

Spark mode (mine vs Hustlers)
4G63 vs Miata 99-00

Ignition Input Capture (mine - Hustlers)
Falling Edge vs Rising Edge

Normally, I'd just try them out but I don't want to FUBAR anything here by selecting the wrong settings when it comes to ignition.

The '99 and later ones need to use Miata '99-'00 spark mode.

Thanks for the confirmation Matt! Figured out I should be using the falling edge setting based on my crank trigger wheel.

Unfortunately, the can does not start. Cranks well. Getting fuel pressure. I'll have to do some logging later to see what's up and confirm sync etc.

So the car does not start at all using the Miata 99-00 Spark Mode, but it does start very roughly when 4G63 is selected as Spark Mode.

WTF is going on with this POS?

Attached is my log of complete failure.

Could you post a composite log?

WTF, car started this time but it's very rough.

Attached composite log and normal log.

The posted composite log is not a 99 trigger pattern. What settings did you use when you were recording it?

Not sure which settings you are referring to exactly but I assume it's Spark Mode? If so, it was set at Miata 99-00.

Attached are the associated settings.

I have a '99 and some settings are different. Most importantly I have the input capture as *Rising Edge* you have Falling Edge.
Also my trigger angle offset is 6.0* and I'm using 4.5ms Dwell.

Since mine runs rather well, I'd wager that my settings are OK. Change to Rising Edge and see what happens.

Already did try, but I did again to be sure. Attached is composite log.

Now the car wont start at all with attached settings.

Your ignition signal:
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1405397594
My Ignition Signal:
https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1405397594

Looks like something's off with your hardware. Since I'm using the MS3X, I don't know the DIYPNP at all. But maybe you have to use pull-ups, or jumper something differently, change some pot settings....

your cam signal doesn't look correct for a miata.

NBs are oddly spaced 4/1/2 wheels. yours looks like a straight up 4/2.

Top composite log is a NA CAS
Bottom composite log is NB cam/crank

Thank you for the replies gentlemen.

It looks like I'll have to track down the NB2 crank wheel, crank sensor, and cam angle sensor. I thought the '00 sensors were transferred over, but I was obviously wrong.

I appreciate the help. At least I'm on the right track now to getting this thing running well again. Thanks again everyone.

I thought all 99+ were the same 4/2/1.

For everyone 4 teeth of the crank, there's a single tooth, then double tooth of the cam.

your pattern is 4/2, which looks very similar to a regular 90-97 signal; which probably explains why it ran in that mode on the MS.

Yeah, I realized that the CAS, crank sensor, and crank wheel must be from my original '96 motor.

Since the car runs like garbage with the same sensors/settings that worked well for the '00 motor, I will source the related '03 parts I am missing and wire according to Sav's VVT swap directions.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1405449201

You will need the NB triggers to get VVT working. However there is no reason that your engine shouldn't run well off the NA CAS. It will be down on midrange power, but it should still idle and drive well enough. I would work on getting the engine running correctly NOW and before making further changes. It's just going to make troubleshooting more complicated if other stuff goes wrong.

I'm not sure what the problem is or where to look next. Any recommendations on where to diagnose further?

I'll have to refer to a 96 base map to get an idea of the setting differences. I've changed so many settings already trying to figure this out.

Turn it back to the settings it ran with. Then figure out, why it's running shitty.
Are you running on all four cylinders?
If it's runniong crappy, my experience is that it's almost always spark related. Timing wrong, or no spark.
Tunerstudio has an option where you can turn off individual injectors, assuming you're running sequential fuel. This allows you to turn off cylinders.
Or you could go old school and just unplug spark plugs to see which cylinders are contributing.

My main concern is that the car ran well on the OEM ECU, aside from high 13.x AFR's at WOT. I put in the MS and all goes to shit and the car barley starts with settings that worked well before. Could this be a firmware related issue?

It doesn't add up and that's why I'm so confused as to where to look next.

Why doesn't it add up?
You built a hybrid engine and are trying to run it with hybrid settings. But the settings have not been configured for your type hybrid.

Your firmware is fine the problem seems to be a classic case of PEBCAK

Exactly my point. I built a hybrid engine with the same sensors from the old engine, used the same settings that worked previously from old engine, and the car hardly ran. There's no way to simplify it further.

The only variable left is the move to the OEM '03 COPs, hence the title of the thread.

If you want to try to help me productively troubleshoot this, I would appreciate it. If not, don't waste any more of our time by posting petty insults.

I discovered that my rear coolant temp sensor was broken so I replaced it.

I got new BKR6EIX spark plugs and left the gap as-is at .040. The plugs that came out have me worried. See attached (#1 on left, #4 on right). #2 is the obvious stand-out and it's the same cylinder that failed on my last engine so now I'm paranoid as fuck. I checked through my injector sub-harness wiring and connectors, but I cannot see any problem areas without cutting into the outer sleeve.

I am not a mechanic and I don't pretend to be one. I have not tried to start the car again yet - I'd like to spend more time looking through the wiring. I'm stuck on where to go next, so if this makes sense to anyone I'd appreciate any help I can get.

Haven't read through much of this, but did you check your injectors recently? As in sent them out for flow testing?

I was running FIC 650's when the last motor died. I put in the NB2 265's to try to test that same theory.

I sent out the FIC's to be checked and just got them back. Total overkill since I'll likely be staying N/A, but at least I will know they aren't the problem. I'll put them in tomorrow.

Anything else to check while I'm in there?

Put in the tested 650cc injectors and new plugs, switched req fuel to 4.7, adjusted deadtime and voltage correction to values provided with injectors and surprise surprise, this fucking piece of shit wont start. Catches barely after cranking about 5-7 times, then dies.

Verified coil wiring. It's correct. Verified timing. It's correct.

Attached composite log of no throttle start attempt and my current tune. I am using the '96 TPS, CAS, crank wheel, crank trigger, and all the old settings that ran great on my previous '00 motor.

Pulled the plugs to see what's going on since they were brand new:

1 & 4 are black
2 looks brand new still
3 has a little discoloration

Note the bronzing of the top of the plugs.

What is going on? I just re-wired the COP's with heat-shrink crimps to make sure the wiring is solid since it was soldered before, but no change.