96 w/ megasquirt
 

Plan:
MSnS-E, MS I v. 3.0
Parallel install (including FP operation)
Stock ECU for A/C and AIC, blah, blah, blah...
OBDII return codes (required in my state) [Thought about trying maf will be electrically connected and zip tied in the engine compartment, but out of the intake tract)

There is a ton of info on the msefi board and it is overwhelming to try and sort through what is needed for a paticular vehicle. There has been so many 'updates' that you can read for hours on a 'fix' only to discover its been 'fixed' in the software....There is also hardware, software and firmware, and then versions of each....

Luckily the miata trail has all ready been blazed @ least 90-95 non OBD II ones...

I started with the MS I 3.0 complete kit ~$190.00.
Discovered 'complete kit' doesn't include a $5.00 cable (took a second order)

There is also two GM sensors required CLT and AIT, both can be purchased together for ~40.00 on line. Since I have some time I'm going to try and use the factory CLT as Al did, just need to calculate the bias resistance @ 27 C. I will need the AIT because its in the MAF and the goal is to eliminate that POS

Not sure if I'll need the stimulator or not, I'll probably just check for V and resistance...

The assembly instructions are very procedural and methodical. They are that way for a reason, but next time I'm going to just to solder the resistors first, diodes , caps, and then the chips--basically start w/ the low lying pieces first, MS starts with the high stuff first. If you've ever done any assembly work you'll know what I mean. (but I need to build one 1st to see what is needed and not needed)

Because of time restraints(Kids) I'm only up to step 25. Each step has to be followed, so you can modify the board for your application.

Cool, another one joins the fray. Have fun building it! I imagine it would be more satisfying that way, but I hate delicate work like soldering. And I'm lazy.

oh yeah and you may want to keep these instructions in mind when you are building.

http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_arti...alon_laser.htm

Thanks, I have it bookmarked ;)

Can't drive the car for a few more months anyway....

Note to self:
R4 - AIT Sensor
R7 - Coolant Sensor

For 96-97 only! Pinouts Stock ECU to MS, may be changes in the works.

Project on hold until I get my WBO2 fixed...RRRRRRRRRRRR

I’m doing the install on my ’96 Miata tomorrow.
MS1 V3 with MS’n’Spark.
I’ll let you know how everything goes.

Your pin schema was usefull. But I modified it a bit to make it easier to connect.

Thanks

I have installed my MS in mine. But it's controlling nothing at the moment.

I have yet to install the GM coolant sensor has I had no luck in using the stock Miata one. Even using Easytherm and the data found on msefi.com for the Mazda coolant sensor.

As soon as the sensor is installed, I'll take control of the injector and see how well this ECU is behaving.

But as far as the rest of the reading goes.. everything seems fine: rpm. o2. tps (I have a 96 so TPS is a 0-5v one, unlike 1.6L) IAT (using GM sensor wrapped to air filter), MAP.. etc.

^ So start your own thread. Join the club.:)

Yo jefe have you hooked yers up yet? Because your pinout has some typos... o2 and outer cas both say pin 24. o2 goes to pin 23. and the inner cas goes to pin 25 if you are using the IAC1A like the DSM instructions say.

Al,
Thanks!!! I updated it to reflect, I kinda feel bad about starting it but then it ended up complete, just sitting on the work bench. (Damn WBO2)

Good news, while away on vacation my WBO2 returned all fixed, N/C and it was past the warrantee period! Thanks ZT-2!!!

I'll attempt to wire it in this week or next, I'm kind of waiting for the snow to leave...

Miatamath-
"Your pin schema was usefull. But I modified it a bit to make it easier to connect."

What else needs to changed?

What was wrong with it???

Hello Jefe,

Since you have an 96.. I'm pretty sure you could use my doc.

Here it is.

Take note that the actual V3 external wiring diagram is only for a guide and the pinout are not representative to miata Mod.

Funny thing, one day it just stopped giving a reading on the lap top (I plugged it in to double check my boost) no reading- So I went through all the basics checked grounds, 12V.
I emailed Zeitronix and thay had me check a few pin readings w/ my DVM. still didn't see anything wrong. I pulled the entire harness and checked every wire for continouity(sp) everything was OK. I reported my finds via email and admitted to opening up the case of the ZT-2 (this is where I got the ESD lecture--anywho I explained I have a ground strap @ my work bench and ESD shoes) They wouldn'nt send me a schematic but asked for me to send everything to them. I sent it as requested. They returned it to me, w/o a letter of explaination or anything, I plugged it in and it worked(the harness connector I kept installed the car). I think they replaced the card, I should have marked my old one(as the case, o2 sensor and o2 harness were the same)
I think the 5V regulator went bad (7805) it is not heat sunk in the case, I have a bunch here and was tempted to just replace it but I was more curious how ZT-2 would handle the situation... Now that I think of it I may add a heat sink to this ZT-2 (I doubt they would re-extend a warrantee anyway).
(Also the 7805 they use may not be rated for -30 below)

I had already fine tuned my EM maps to +-5% for my Autotune (really I think it was just to compensate for temp at that point)

Squirted:bigtu: :bigtu: :bigtu:

Gratz!!! We want details :cool: :cool:

Right know stocK CLT (w/ 2.2K ohm resistor @ R7) and GM AIT.
I was planning on spark today, ---to leave or remove the transistors Q6 & Q8???

The software setup that supports this isn't ideal. None of my screens look like yours or Aussies...I'd post a pic but I'm outa time for today....These versions are driving my crazy!!!

Use MegaTune 2.25 and I'm using the Extra code 29J. Seems to give me good result. http://megasquirt.sourceforge.net/extra/files/alpha/

Do you have it running? What version of the code you run? It can be interesting to setup at first. But once you do a couple of firmware update, it flow smoothly.

Watch out taking control of the stock ignition. Here is a thread you might find interesting. http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread...97#post1734897

About removing the Q6 and Q8.
Here is another thread you might want to read.

http://msefi.com/viewtopic.php?t=16990

Tell us how everything goes please.

I'm still having a 'liitle' trouble with the firmware update portion.
I won't be the last person to have this problem either.. Look at all the people that had trouble updating their EM Blue.

When your software and Firmware don't match, the car runs, but the settings don't stay--MS thinks my engine is 350CID :) :)

Here's where I'm having trouble:

Now, you need to copy the msns-extra.ini that was in the Extra zip into
C:\Program Files\Megasquirt\Megatune2.25bXXX\MtCfg
The easiest way to do this is to run the copyini.bat provided in the Extra zip.
Go back to where you extracted it, e.g. c:\efi\024s9 and double-click on copyini.bat - this will update Megatune with the right ini file (this tells it what menus to display etc.)
This only works for the specified Megatune version If you installed a different version you will have to copy the file by hand.

Now run Megatune.
Select a project e.g. car1
If it comes up with messages about signatures not matching STOP! - re-read the intructions on this page and make sure you did everything and got the right versions. You must NOT continue until the signatures match ok or you will have problems.

Codebase specific instructions

What versions of MegaTune and MSnSe are you trying to use?

If you go straight for MSnSE 029 and MT2.25 you will be able to do the copying and flashing without any problems. I had some problems with the older versions of both programs but that was fixed when I went to MSnSE 029h and MT 2.25.

You will also need to edit the settings file to allow it to see MSnSE. If you haven't done this you will have a multitude of problems as well.

Steve

I'm using version MT 2.25 and MSnSE 029K. I was able to flash the MS, but the MT is now missing all the folders including the code variant files??? so I can't set/unset settings...

I'll have to try uninstalling and reinstalling MT... X999

The car did run using the basic MT, but the settings wouldn't save to the CPU. and w/o spark control I can't be in this catch 22 for too long...

I can see my future sig:

96 Miata, 12 psi, T25, JRPC for fuel, Bipes for Timing, Mesaquirt for O2 clamp and cool E gauges... hahahahaha
Oh and a WBO2 to see that I'm lean but can't do anything about it....haha

Try removing MT from your laptop with the add/remove programs thingy in the control panel. Then go into 'my computer', then program files and then delete the Megasquirt folder. (Save your msq someplace else first though)

Reinstall MT 2.25
Then open MSnSE029k from wherever you unzipped it to, click on the edit-settings file and change the default from whatever it is to MSnSE. While you are there change the settings to your O2 sensor further down the list and then go to file and then save.

Then run the copyini file to transfer the MSnSE file into MT and you should be able to open MT with MSnSE 029k on your laptop.

You will need to connect the laptop to the MS and do the jumper bit to run the download-firmware and after that is finished you should be good to go.

Hope that this helps
Steve

Probably would help to have a screen by screen install guide it looks like. Does msefi have any write ups? I dont want to be stuck trying to figure out the software end. :eek4:

MSEFI has tons of writeups, but it's usually written by someone w/ 700 posts and its looks greek...

I have found not understanding their language has been the biggest barrier in asking questions or being able to communicate what is wrong....

Having dyslexi and slooow doesn't help either...

Luckily we have folks such as Al, Aussie, Miatamath, that are willing to contribute to this forum--Thanks guys!

When you load MS'n'Extra for the first time.. you have to use the boot jumper.

But afterward you don't need to and it make the whole firmware update so much easier.. (Don't have to take the case apart everytime.)

Where are you stuck at now?

I'm stuck @ Work....

I didn't need to use pin 26 on the MS(TPS 5V source).

You are right. Now that you mention it, I did not use it either.
I only spliced on the TPS signal

BTW.

Are you taking control of spark yet?
I started with fuel only and only connected one of the 2 CAS signal.

It did not want to start with the 2 signal plug in.. would crank, sputter, bearly start then stall. Since I was not taking control of the spark.. I guess the stock ECU was getting confused and not sparking up properly.

I'm not sure why your injector port type is light grey... have you copied the constant page of Aussie screenshot?


Does it hold an idle before stalling out?? On mine.. I had to really crank up the required fuel to get it started because my Idle VE were not high enough..

Are you taking control of spark yet?

NO, fuel 1st,

I started with fuel only and only connected one of the 2 CAS signal.
Yup, IIRC AL suggested that and that's what I did

It did not want to start with the 2 signal plug in.. would crank, sputter, bearly start then stall. Since I was not taking control of the spark.. I guess the stock ECU was getting confused and not sparking up properly.

I'm not sure why your injector port type is light grey... have you copied the constant page of Aussie screenshot?

It's exact, when it was just the basic version I could change value to 4, very odd...


Does it hold an idle before stalling out??

no, I wish it di I could play w/ it after that

On mine.. I had to really crank up the required fuel to get it started because my Idle VE were not high enough..

I went as high as 16 on the VE...NFG...

So the rest of my settings are good then?
WHEN i REVIEWED MY SETTINGS, THERES LIKE 47 SCREENS W/ 48 VARIABLES A PIECE..Opps caps stuck....
Good thing I have a case of Molson and I'm home alone....:)
Wish it were Molson Dry though, love that stuff...

Miatamath, Aussie, and Al

Thanks for your help, I'm all set!!

CYA in the left lane....Zoom Zoom...

Good to hear!!!

What was the problem?

More notes to self:
when building the V 3 board MS I for fueling assemble entire thing
Caps are not used leave blank c12 & c30
D1 is a jumper wire in place of Diode
D2 is a jumper wire in place of Diode
Q16 not used for fuel (VB921)
R43 goes w/ Q16 not required for fuel
Under the board add the DSM pull up resistors and the Hall sensor jumpers(there are 3) outlined in the assembly instructions

There-- next time I build a board I can start w/ all the resistors, then diodes, caps..etc...

Jeff you can piggy back off the oem computer for your CAS signals. You just
need to make sure the spark settings are the same as in these pictures even
if you aren't using spark. Once these are set you car should run correctly with
the OEM computer running spark.

Then just pull our the transistors Q6 & Q8 on version 3 PCB. Run you coils and it
should be running fuel and spark!

I am tapping off the oem now. I would like to see if the car runs w/ Q6 & Q8 installed??? Did you try this?

I'll run wires off R27&R29, did you run them through the DB37?

The good news is my 450 injector's came today...:)

The bad news is my WBO2 is still in the P5 and I was asked to arrive into work early tomorrow( that's when I was going to install it into the Miata...):mad:

The ugly news is we just got 6" of snow today and the car will stay inside a little longer..:td:

The 1.6L coils will not run properly with Q6 & Q8 installed I tried everyway I could think of and the spark was erratic with them installed. I wired the resistors
directly to the DB-37. You need to have the resistors between the CPU and the coils to protect the CPU from damage.

Added the 450 dsm's and spark :)

What are you guys running for dwell settings?
I'm @ 4.5 isn't quite smooth yet.

I should re-phase since I know dwell isn't used for idle...:eek4:

Nice!!!

What did you use to control spark, your stock coil? Or the 1.6L coil with VB921?

I'm not sure you should use my dwell since you're a 1.8....

Stock coils. I wrote down what I had to change, its in the garage and I'm too intox to remember...

Well a dwell of 4.5 is too long,:td: it blows up coils...

Ouch..

That kind of sucks... :crx:

Well... time for you to get some more VB921.

I ordered 4 more(w/ resistors), digikey was out... DIYautotune has them listed on the site, hopefully in stock...

I'm going COP, I never really had the interest, selective learning ya know...but for under 100 what the heck...

really the 1.8 coils quit with 4.5ms of dwell. I knew they weren't the most robust
but the 1.6l coils handle that no problem. I'm also heading down the path of COP plug will probably still run waste spark.

Yeah, one bank, then the other--almost made it out of the garage :)...the coils were hot as a MOFO after.

I was also running 4ms of running dwell(& 4.5 of dwell), next time I'm starting w/ 2 ms.
Do you have any particular COP plans?
I'm still waiting for my VB921's to arrive, if your planning the same then order yours ASAP so your not waiting on $20.00 parts...

THey will still blow up... LOL, ok ok I know it's not funny.

Mark

I've got a set of R-1 coils and an AEM C2DI for sale if you are interested. The R1 coils are used, the C2DI is new.

Mark

Thanks for the offer, My CBR coils finally arrived and Fit... just waiting on the VB921's, I want to try and blow up some more stuff first:)

Funny: Driving across the garage on two cylinders, giving it more throttle and thinking some how the other ignitor will reincarnate...Good thing the other ignitor blew before I actually made it out of the garage...It was alot easier to push back into its corner...

CBR coils didn't work out...

So I spent another $125.00 some GM coils, same results..
car doesn't fire until you stop cranking... tried 6 or so different configs and couldn't figure it out.

Ordered a new stock coil pack today, didn't ask how much, really don't want to know...

1.8 coils or 1.6 coils?

I ordered 1.8 coils, I gotta get this car running, I'll run MS and Bipes for this year...Or go back to my PC and Bipes, I called FM for a link, 3 weeks out--she won't wait that long...

Jefe, try getting some DSM coils and run those. They have great spark. You could also set dwell to 2ms and keep checking the coil temp. If it gets hot shut it down and try using the pull up. I'm ordering a v3 kit for my 99 I'll let you know how it goes.

I just bought some Neon coils (same as used in the Eclipses) for 10$ and I'm going to use the setup on the MSnS page with 2 VB921s. This sounds like the cheapest alternative to me, especially with the success of these coils on the MSEFI forums.

so, if you could do it again... would you stick with the MS?

Other 'projects' keep coming up so I don't have the time...

P.S. MS has been sold.