Ms Newbie ?'s , What Do I Need To Make It Work?? - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


MEGAsquirt A place to collectively sort out this megasquirt gizmo

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-01-2006, 10:24 PM   #1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,167
Total Cats: -1
Default Ms Newbie ?'s , What Do I Need To Make It Work??

Has anyone had any expirience with this unit and on a scale of 1-10 how hard would it be to put one of these things together for a miata and how much would the overall cost be ....? MS strikes me with overwhelming curiosity, I have plenty of spare time to throw at building one of these units, and there is alot of info on miataturbo.net! what do you guys think.

I have a 94 M with 136k miles , what do i need to do the build for my 1.8
RicanmiataRacer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2006, 01:58 AM   #2
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Down Under
Posts: 252
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RicanmiataRacer
Has anyone had any expirience with this unit and on a scale of 1-10 how hard would it be to put one of these things together for a miata and how much would the overall cost be ....?
Most of the people here have had some experience with the MS. How hard it is to assemble/install really depends on the individual. If you have good soldering skills and can easily interpret written instructions then you shouldn't have too many troubles going with a MS. For prices check out www.diyautotune.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by RicanmiataRacer
MS strikes me with overwhelming curiosity, I have plenty of spare time to throw at building one of these units, and there is alot of info on miataturbo.net! what do you guys think.
I think that if you reckon that you have a chance of succeeding, then run with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RicanmiataRacer
I have a 94 M with 136k miles , what do i need to do the build for my 1.8
Check out some of the install pages here and they should give you a good idea as to what is involved in getting MS working well for your Miata.
Aussie Driver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2006, 09:02 AM   #3
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 103
Total Cats: 0
Default

I've done some wild things with cars over the years, and very few of them have been as rewarding as being able to say that I built my fuel injection computer from a bag of electronic components, tuned the system myself, and understand it so that if I add aftermarket components, I don't have to pay someone to modify the tune. Definitely buy a wide band though, otherwise you're kind of flying blind. Good luck and welcome!
Fulltilt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2006, 12:06 PM   #4
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Here’s a page with info on my recommendations for a complete system: http://www.diyautotune.com/faq/megas..._do_I_need.htm


Here’s a quote for a pretty complete system with the ECU/Stim un-assembled:

MS130-K $189
MSStim21-K $50
MSHarness $68
IATwPiggy $21 IAT Sensor
38NPT-Bung_S $8 Bung for mounting IAT sensor (steel weld on, or JB-Weld on)
TuneCable $6.50
USB-2920 $22 (Only needed if you laptop doesn’t have a true DB9 port)
Subtotal without wideband-- $364.50


And here’s a quote for a pretty complete system with the ECU/Stim assembled:

MS130-C $330
MSStim21-C $85
MSHarness $68
IATwPiggy $21 IAT Sensor
38NPT-Bung_S $8 Bung for mounting IAT sensor (steel weld on, or JB-Weld on)
TuneCable $6.50
USB-2920 $22 (Only needed if you laptop doesn’t have a true DB9 port)
Subtotal without wideband-- $540.50


Wideband Options—

LC-1 without gauge $199 (you can still view real-time AFR and datalog AFR through your laptop)
LC-1 with analog gauge $258
LC-1 with XD-16 digital gauge $399
LM-1 with built-in LCD Readout $349 (good for tuning multiple cars, temp installation)


I think this will give you a pretty good start in the right direction. If there is anything else I can assist with please just let me know. I'll subsccribe to this thread so I'll see any replies here....

http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_arti...alon_laser.htm
Also-- check out this page, I believe all of the Miata guys are finding that my DSM writeup works perfectly for the Miata ignition system control as well. I'd like to confirm this and if there are any minor changes needed I can make a page dedicated to MS'ing the Miata.
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2006, 06:03 PM   #5
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Down Under
Posts: 252
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FoundSoul
Also-- check out this page, I believe all of the Miata guys are finding that my DSM writeup works perfectly for the Miata ignition system control as well. I'd like to confirm this and if there are any minor changes needed I can make a page dedicated to MS'ing the Miata.
Oh yeah mate, without your DSM writeup we'd be having a lot more problems trying to do the spark. Your DSM instructions are also Miata instructions!!
Aussie Driver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2006, 06:19 PM   #6
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aussie Driver
Oh yeah mate, without your DSM writeup we'd be having a lot more problems trying to do the spark. Your DSM instructions are also Miata instructions!!
So there are no changes needed at all for the Miata? If so I'll duplicate the page and create one that's Miata specific. What years are covered?
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2006, 08:06 PM   #7
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (10)
 
Reverant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 5,440
Total Cats: 198
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FoundSoul
So there are no changes needed at all for the Miata? If so I'll duplicate the page and create one that's Miata specific. What years are covered?
90-97.

98-05 Miatas need a CAS sensor from a 90-97. Basically, on the Megasquirt side it's all the same.
Reverant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2006, 09:00 PM   #8
Senior Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: VT
Posts: 939
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FoundSoul
So there are no changes needed at all for the Miata? If so I'll duplicate the page and create one that's Miata specific. What years are covered?
Jerry,

The DSM instructions worked on my 96, however the Coils are very sensitive to Dwell time, mine fried @ 4.5 ms, others have had success @ ~2.2ms.
Jefe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 06:25 AM   #9
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Down Under
Posts: 252
Total Cats: 0
Default

The 1.6 coils are a lot more robust.
I'm using 6.5 ms for cranking and 5.0 ms for running with my 1.6 coils (and have been for the last 7 months without any problems at all).
Aussie Driver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 09:59 AM   #10
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Thanks for the info-- I'll put together a Miata focused page soon.

Question-- are you guys using the stock ignitors or the internal VB921's?

Once I get the page together if there's anything else you see that will help to improve it please let me know. I'll post here with a link....


Anyone got a slick pic or two of a sweet looking MS'd Miata they want to see on that page?
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 12:07 PM   #11
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Also-- if you could email me your .msq file to websales AT diyautotune DOT com I'll pull some of the important ignition related details from it for this article. If you feel good about the file I can post it for download, of course with the warning that it's for use as a base map ONLY and that vehicle specific tuning will be required. Just something to get people close....
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 04:44 PM   #12
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 103
Total Cats: 0
Default

I have a '90 using a V2.2 board. Don't know if anyone new will be using a V2.2 board for a new start-up again. I'm about to buy a 3.0 or two from you to run a Hayabusa powered car and a Jag V-12. What I would have found the most helpful would have been to see that the white CAS wire goes to pin 24 on the DB37, and the blue/yellow CAS wire goes to pin 25. The primary/secondary terminology threw me off. Also that when the transistors are removed, the wire to X12 and X13 gets soldered to the side of resistor R25 and R28 (V2.2 again) that used to go to the transistors. Maybe that is common sense to everyone else and I'm an idiot, so be it. Wouldn't hurt to be clear. It's great that you're doing this.

BTW, does my car classify as sweet looking? : )

http://www.teamverploegen.com/Miata.htm
Fulltilt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 06:03 PM   #13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Down Under
Posts: 252
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by FoundSoul
Question-- are you guys using the stock ignitors or the internal VB921's?
The 1.8 miatas have the ignitors built into the coils so the VB291's aren't needed for them. The 1.6's could run from the VB291's and bypass the OEM ignirots.
Aussie Driver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-09-2006, 09:50 PM   #14
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,167
Total Cats: -1
Default

so this is what I need for my ms build, What version of the ms , the 3.0 of the ms, is the any place I can get the build up for my 94 miata?
Quote:
Originally Posted by FoundSoul
Here’s a page with info on my recommendations for a complete system: http://www.diyautotune.com/faq/megas..._do_I_need.htm


Here’s a quote for a pretty complete system with the ECU/Stim un-assembled:

MS130-K $189
MSStim21-K $50
MSHarness $68
IATwPiggy $21 IAT Sensor
38NPT-Bung_S $8 Bung for mounting IAT sensor (steel weld on, or JB-Weld on)
TuneCable $6.50
USB-2920 $22 (Only needed if you laptop doesn’t have a true DB9 port)
Subtotal without wideband-- $364.50


And here’s a quote for a pretty complete system with the ECU/Stim assembled:

MS130-C $330
MSStim21-C $85
MSHarness $68
IATwPiggy $21 IAT Sensor
38NPT-Bung_S $8 Bung for mounting IAT sensor (steel weld on, or JB-Weld on)
TuneCable $6.50
USB-2920 $22 (Only needed if you laptop doesn’t have a true DB9 port)
Subtotal without wideband-- $540.50


Wideband Options—

LC-1 without gauge $199 (you can still view real-time AFR and datalog AFR through your laptop)
LC-1 with analog gauge $258
LC-1 with XD-16 digital gauge $399
LM-1 with built-in LCD Readout $349 (good for tuning multiple cars, temp installation)


I think this will give you a pretty good start in the right direction. If there is anything else I can assist with please just let me know. I'll subsccribe to this thread so I'll see any replies here....

http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_arti...alon_laser.htm
Also-- check out this page, I believe all of the Miata guys are finding that my DSM writeup works perfectly for the Miata ignition system control as well. I'd like to confirm this and if there are any minor changes needed I can make a page dedicated to MS'ing the Miata.
RicanmiataRacer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2006, 11:17 AM   #15
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulltilt
I have a '90 using a V2.2 board. Don't know if anyone new will be using a V2.2 board for a new start-up again. I'm about to buy a 3.0 or two from you to run a Hayabusa powered car and a Jag V-12. What I would have found the most helpful would have been to see that the white CAS wire goes to pin 24 on the DB37, and the blue/yellow CAS wire goes to pin 25. The primary/secondary terminology threw me off. Also that when the transistors are removed, the wire to X12 and X13 gets soldered to the side of resistor R25 and R28 (V2.2 again) that used to go to the transistors. Maybe that is common sense to everyone else and I'm an idiot, so be it. Wouldn't hurt to be clear. It's great that you're doing this.

BTW, does my car classify as sweet looking? : )

http://www.teamverploegen.com/Miata.htm
I updated my Miata doc with the wire colors--- is this the same for ALL 90-97 Miata CAS's?

On the transistor removal-- are you finding this to be a requirement? Should it be a part of my doc? Details?

Your car does look good... got any other pics?
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2006, 11:18 AM   #16
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aussie Driver
The 1.8 miatas have the ignitors built into the coils so the VB291's aren't needed for them. The 1.6's could run from the VB291's and bypass the OEM ignirots.

Sounds like most of you are using the stock ignitors though right? I know on the DSM's if you use VB921's you have to work out using the stock TACH as it's wired to the stock ignitors for it's signal....
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2006, 11:20 AM   #17
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (5)
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Duluth, GA 30097
Posts: 798
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RicanmiataRacer
so this is what I need for my ms build, What version of the ms , the 3.0 of the ms, is the any place I can get the build up for my 94 miata?

That looks like a good list to me minus the few resistors needed for the input/output mods. Here's the Miata writeup 'in process'. I'm still waiting to get all of the ignition config info together, that's still the DSM stuff at the moment.

http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_arti...azda_miata.htm
FoundSoul is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2006, 11:21 AM   #18
Supporting Vendor
iTrader: (10)
 
Reverant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 5,440
Total Cats: 198
Default

Jerry,

you might find these pics up to the task:

(LM-1 connected to incar-pc and Megasquirt piggyback on the stock ECU on a 2002 Miata)



Reverant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2006, 11:58 AM   #19
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 103
Total Cats: 0
Default

I am using the stock ignitors with no problem. Someone with a later year will have to answer about the CAS wires. Don't know about the transistors. I read remove them, so I removed them.
Fulltilt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2006, 12:26 PM   #20
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 103
Total Cats: 0
Default

From your page:

"The Primary tach input (CKP) (Reported to be White on Miatas) is connected to pin 24 on the MegaSquirt's DB37

The Secondary tach input (CMP) (Reported to be Yellow on Miatas) is connected to pin 25 on the MegaSquirt's DB37"

The secondary is blue/yellow, correct?
Fulltilt is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
15x10 - 15x11 6UL @ 949 Racing emilio700 Wheels and Tires 151 06-02-2017 03:36 PM
Need help - Stock Balancer and Fastforward overlay pulleys Frank_and_Beans Supercharger Discussion 13 09-12-2016 09:17 PM
Another Alternator thread ihiryu General Miata Chat 9 09-28-2015 11:22 AM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:35 AM.