My MSPNP 90-93 Thread
 

well i decided instead of posting thread and thread after thread that i would juts make one for all of my ?'s.

can some one look at my current MAP that i created with MegaLogVeiwer

this is basically the only way my car will run ok, kinda......

but around 3,500 - 4,000 it struggles....

http://www.mediafire.com/?4byjnjufyjm

Zip your MSQ up and post it as an attachment here. I don't want to go through some spam-filled 3rd party host. :P Also, tell us more about how it's running shitty. Won't idle, bucks under load, falls flat on its face above X rpm or X boost, etc.

it runs fine till about 3 or 4 grand, then it seems to bogg and buck,

also the wideband sits and 10.1 at idle and the narrow band sits at 20.00 ...... thinking because there is to much fuel on the narrowband and it cant read.......... but i went through megalogveiwer about 5 times and this is what i got, i think my timing may be off, i checked it last night and it was fine and on the dot but i cant see the timing now (its to bright outside and my timing light wont show)

any ideas?

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

ok timed the car......... 10 degree's but when its timed the car will not rev up it just tries and boggs...... but the only way i can get the car to rev is if i advance the timing, mmmmmmmm about 20 degree's!!!!! WTF ? :vash:

is it possible that MegaSquirt did something wrong? its a PNP......

i know there is no way the CAS is 180 degree's off, like what could happen to a DSM, the CAS only goes on one way on a 90-93 miata........

Well if you got your timing belt changed. Check it like Savington did.

timing belt was put on by Flyin Miata when the engine was built...........

its good.

can anyone help me?

i tried changing the CAS and still no luck.

i just find it strange that the car works fine if the timing is advanced 20 degree's, but i dont like the idea and i dont beleive thats safe.........

did you get the mapdaddy or vtps mod done? All stock motor for now? stock injectors? I had the vtps and mapdaddy mod done to mine and didnt change something in megatune which led to similar issues.

Did you set your trigger angle?

i have VTPS done..... (yes i calibrated the TPS)

have 450cc injectors, yes i did change the REQ. fuel
deleted AFM
turbocharged.

yes

What impedance are the injectors? Are they DSM 450s? Aren't those low-imps? The MSPNP won't run low-imp injectors without additional grounding or a flyover board (or something).

have a resistor pack.......

and it does the same thing with the stock injectors, tried swapping.

hello? can anyone help me jesus,

i'll go over this again.

I have spark
I have fuel
I have all the adjustment's correct
I've tried to change the CAS
I have timed the car
When the car is timed at 10 degree's it wont rev up past 1,500 RPM, basically it ascts way out of time...... When trying to rev the car you can hear the pressure comming back through the turbo because it has no where to go, once again like the timing is incorrect.
The only way the car is driveable at all is if the timing is advanced 20-25 degree's, when it is advanced the car drives like a normal car other than a bucking or bogging issue between 3,000 and 4,000 RPM.
I dont drive the car due to the fact that 25 degree's of timing advance from the correct timing doesn't sounds safe to me.

Does anyone know what my problem may be?
Is something incorrect in the MSPNP for it to do this?

Thank you.

Joey.

You're not obnoxious or anything. Did you read the manual and set the timing in exactly the manner described therein?

Why on earth are you running a WB and NB simultaneously with a MS? Makes me further believe that you didn't bother to read the manual.

yes i read the manual
yes i did it correctly and im not running both, i only connected the NB for a moment to see if my wideband was even reading correclty do to the fact it hasnt moved from 10.1........

You certainly sound over fueled, whats your fuel pressure? Is it possible the fuel regulator is dumping fuel through the vacuum port? Can you get us a vacuum reading at idle and at 3000 rpm no load? Whats the WB say at 3000 rpm no load?

I suppose FM just cant do a timing belt incorrectly, they are infallible! ;) Id be checking that!

Does the timing advance when you rev the motor?

Is it possible to have something blocking the exhaust? A quick check would be to run it with the WB out of the hole, or even put a pressure guage on the bung to see if you have abnormal packpressure.

IIRC there are 2 marks on the crank pulley, are you sure you are on the right one?

If all this doesnt help, lets hear a compression reading.

Ron

Did you read my post at all ?

It's a 91 = means 1 timing mark
There is no fuel leaking through the vaccum line
The car wont rev past 1,5000 rpm when its timed but if the timing is advanced 25 degrees ( the base timing ) it will rev through all RPM's
It's a built engine with less that 2,000 miles on it im sure its fine.....
The exhaust isnt clogged.

Glad I was able to help.

My questions all have merit, the answers would help me to help you.

Your welcome

Also checked to see if it may be a Cali car, It's not.

Your trigger angle seems to be at the base PNP settings.

Did you go through this procedure:

Go to the Spark Settings menu and set Fixed Angle to +10.
Adjust the Trigger Angle until you read 10 degrees with a timing light.
If the trigger angle needs to be less than 50 degrees to get your base timing right then set trigger angle to 55 and instead adjust the cam angle sensor to set your base timing, just like adjusting timing on a stock Miata.
Then set Fixed Angle back to -10 to enable spark advance.

1. You can't "hear" backpressure

2. Are you even setting the baseline back to -10, from 10? If you leave it at 10 the car will run like shit.

Zip your entire MSQ and post it.

yes i followed the procedures, also used a timing light, and yes i put it back to -10

ill post it up.

Here it is,

umm i downloaded someone elses MSQ. to examine it and i saw they had the Trigger Angle Addition at 0, well mine is at +22.5....

Which one is correct ?

i think +22.5 is PNP specific, but when I set my trigger angle I used that setting. Go by what your timing light tells you when setting the trigger angle.

well the car is timed and when its timed it wont rev pass 1,500 RPM, when i changed it to 0 on the Trigger Angle Addition it ran like stock........ Hmmmm ?

what yall think ?

Then verify that its correct by changing the fixed angle to +10 and hooking up a timing light again.

well i gotta wait till dark to do so, my timing light isnt bright enough to do during the day nor in the shade.

but i timed the car last night the correct way and left it that way, but tonight i will do it againt to make sure, it could have changed when changing the setting's.......

anyone got any opinions on why it works when the Trigger Angle Addition is ajusted to 0 ?

Other thing I noticed in your msq is EGO Control is not setup right, you said you have a wideband. Have you changed the settings in configurator as well? Change authority to zero while tuning VE map, unless you're using MLV.

yeah i set it up in the configurator, and yes im using MLV, what do i need to do to the EGO control ?

ok i see what i didnt do.

Go to exhaust gas settings, Change to wideband and the switchpoint voltage to whatever your wideband puts out at stoich. which wideband is it?

Innovative LC-1

well i timed the car with the Trigger Angle Adjustment at 0, and it just does the same thing so i put it back to 22.5, hell it was worth a try so anyone else got any ideas ?

Switching point is 2.352v so long as it's set up correctly (0-5v is 10-20:1 AFR).

What map are you trying to use? Is it just Jerry's basemap?

the MSPNP base MAP, but i still havent figured out my problem =[

Check your timing again. If you are running Jerry's basemap and the car will not rev, but it revs if you advance everything 10 degrees, something's wrong with the timing on the car itself. Check the orientation of the timing belt, ensure that your TDC marks are *actually* TDC marks (pull the plugs, spin the motor to TDC, compare marks), and ensure the timing belt is set correctly.

ok, ill check the belt but i dont think it skipped a tooth because the car ran fine on the stock ecu and Emanage Ultimate.
And i timed it before the MSPNP and it was fine.

Your timing is fucked, and it's probably not the MSPNP settings. Un-fuck it.

how is this possible when he says the trigger angle was cross-checked with the timing marks and a timing light?

1. Jerry's basemaps are correct
2. He dicks with his timing and the car runs better
3. He sets his timing up as it should be, and the car doesnt run

Logic tells me that if the basemaps are correct (which they are, 99% sure), then something with his car isn't correct. If your timing marks are off, or you are using the wrong mark, then you aren't going to be able to time the car right. Dollars to donuts, he's got the timing fucked up.

Common on older engines for the harmonic balancer to get sloppy, hence incorrect timing values would be observed compared to actual. Would be odd for a new engine to have that problem, but if you've followed the timing set up in the manual correctly, then the timing problem is mechanical and not electrical. Are you positive you set the trigger angle correctly? If so, it's probably time to do the TDC dipstick test to see how you need to proceed.

i did it correctly and well i guess it is time to check some of the mechanics, dont know if this may matter but my harmonic balancer does have a wobble to it..... =\

Are you fucking joking?

Like the others have said, your timing is off. If your harmonic balancer shows visible signs of wobbling, replace it ASAP. It is quite likely that the timing marks on the balancer have slipped far enough that they're giving you the wrong reading.

yepp, it does wobble...... didnt think much of it at first.... its not bad but its noticable.... im going to call FM today, that would explain why the car works when the timing is advanced 20 degree's?

but its works fine with the stock ECU ?

or was i still just way off and the stock ECU didnt really give a shit ?

ok well, i called FM and yepp the wobble aint good and my timing mark skipped on the balancer about mmmmm 10 degree's ?..... so well i guess im going to change it out and give it another try...... ahhhh!

ok well pulled it off and layed it next to the other one i had and put the alignment holes in the same place and then looked and the timing marks and its off about 2 and a half inches...... Bad ? ....... well i found my problem then.

FIX!!!!!! woohoo, now my car is just running rich but its drivable, time for some tuning!

I had the same problem. My timing was only of by 16 degrees. I did not find out until the pulley came apart at 7,000 RPM. that was fun.

Glad you fixed it. How new is that FM motor?

umm no more than 1,200 miles on it......

and thank you everyone for your help!

Tell us more about that harmonic balancer. What brand? OEM, ATI, etc? Seeing a failure like that on a 1200 mile part is worrying.

its from FM but its a OEM, it was just cleaned and painted..... they gave me a bad one........

I'd be a bit pissed.

i am but i have two spare motors so what ever lol.