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Old 05-30-2016, 11:27 PM   #1
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Default Need help tuning MS1

Hey everyone,

I need some help/guidance while tuning my VE table. My set up is a 91 1.6 running on a gen 1 mspnp, rx7 460cc, innovate lc-1, 14b turbo, diy log manifold and intercooler set up, walbro 190 pump. No vtps and still batch fire for now. I can get it to idle good, but afr's everywhere else on my VE dont seem to be in line with my targets. In boost it seems they initially go richer then my targets but then back off to around 13 and then fluctuate between 11.5-13. I did have IAT heat soak issues, i played with the coolant related air density so gammae stays at 100, but in boost it still seems to remove around 3-4%. I also moved the IAT to intercooler end tank, reads alot closer to ambient now, but when i restart the car after it sits for a bit it still idles lean until i start moving. But IAT's are not higher.

I have been doing logs and autotuning, just confused with how it is changing my VE table. In some areas it adds fuel but then in cells beside it pulls fuel.

I know i need to keep tuning. Just want to see if someone who actually knows what they are doing can check my tune and a log and tell me what to do next. I have controller authority at 0 and overrun fuel cut off while logging and autotuning so they dont interfere.

Any help is appreciated, thanks in advance!
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File Type: msq CurrentTune.msq (41.4 KB, 56 views)
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Old 05-30-2016, 11:51 PM   #2
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From my experience, don't use auto tune for boost. Auto tune up to 100 , the tune boost yourself using logs and or a friend driving while you tune.
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Old 05-31-2016, 01:23 PM   #3
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Thanks for the reply ryan, i have been using mainly logs for my tuning. Looking at the log i posted it looks like when i am in boost my map signal goes a bit erratic. Line goes up and gown constantly, and the afr's do the same.

Anybody able to check the log and tell me what they think?

I will also add that i am running toyota cops with ngk bkr7e plugs gapped at 32.
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Old 05-31-2016, 01:27 PM   #4
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Don't need to look. You need to tune more. Drive around, not in boost. Let auto tune do it thing. When it gets smooth, move to boost and do what I said. Sit passenger, find a hill, stay in a steady low boost. .with the fuel and afr windows open, adjust the fuel until it matches the afr-guage to target.
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Old 06-01-2016, 02:29 PM   #5
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I always tune idle by hand and auto tune everything else, especially in boost.
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Old 06-01-2016, 02:57 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixshooter View Post
I always tune idle by hand and auto tune everything else, especially in boost.
Yes, I should have been more clear. Tune boost by hand, idle as well. Auto tune everything else.
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Old 06-01-2016, 03:06 PM   #7
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I honestly just make sure I am overly rich in boost when I start then just let autotune do its thing there.
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Old 06-01-2016, 03:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
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I honestly just make sure I am overly rich in boost when I start then just let autotune do its thing there.
Mine went nuts when I did that. Started pulling and adding tons of fuel, on what seamed lIke randome cells. Made no sense. Maybe if I had been using AFR safety. ....
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Old 06-01-2016, 03:21 PM   #9
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Mine went nuts when I did that. Started pulling and adding tons of fuel, on what seamed lIke randome cells. Made no sense. Maybe if I had been using AFR safety. ....
I have never seen that happen. I have been using the built in autotuning with TS since it came out with out any problems. Before then I would take logs and let MegaLog Viewer do the tuning on the logs.
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Old 06-01-2016, 03:21 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryansmoneypit View Post
From my experience, don't use auto tune for boost. Auto tune up to 100 , the tune boost yourself using logs and or a friend driving while you tune.
Best advice yet. Autotune on the MS1 is tragic Make sure your closed loop AFR correction is Off when making adjustments to VE, or it'll fight itself.
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Old 06-01-2016, 04:33 PM   #11
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Again, I've never had any problems autotuning in boost with a ms1. The ve curves made a nice gentle slope with the torque curve mimicking it later when it was on a dyno. Unless your targets are wildly varied from cell to cell the ve table should autotune into nice gradual slopes.
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Old 06-04-2016, 10:29 AM   #12
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Yes i tune my idle cells manually, i don't let autotune do that. However autotune still changes my values in those cells when it is on, i have ego control set to above 1500 and idle around 900-1000, anything else i need to do?

I have controller authority at 0 anytime i am tuning so it does not affect the numbers. I am trying to get the fuel table dialed in then i will add authority later and it can make minor corrections.

I restarted with the basemap fuel map, made some adjustments so it wasn't pig rich up top. I disconnected the waste gate actuator so i could dial in up to 100kpa first. Went well with a combination of data logging, autotuning and just looking at my afr's as i drove. Above 100kpa is better, afr's do not bounce around as much.

After a bit more reading it seems to me that before my ve was too lean up top so it would want to be around 13 afr in boost, bu my accel enrichments were too high so they would try and put the afr in the 11's and then it would just go between 11-13. Does that make sense?

I can see now in my logs that afr's come down to around 11.8-12 in boost but accel enrichment kicks in and they go down to low 11. This is after reducing my accel enrich values.

Another issue i am seeing is my accel enrichment seems to get activated by my tps but i have it set to mapdot. I am running the stock 90-93 tps, in my logs the TP value is almost always at 49 but it does go to 48 and when that change happens TP AE turns on. But i never see the MP AE on. Should i disconnect the tps?

Also i still get lean restarts. I moved my IAT to IC endtank so its not IAT heatsoak, IAT's dont change and stay close to ambient. Ive read about fuel heat soak but i have a return fuel system. Any suggestions?

Sorry for the long response, thanks for all the reply's so far!
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Old 06-04-2016, 11:04 AM   #13
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In autotune, select advanced settings, then set parameters for the auto tune; above 1500 rpm, above 45 kpa. Etc.

If you boost in 13 afr, your car will die a quick death. Shoot for 11.5
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Old 06-04-2016, 01:54 PM   #14
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Or you can highlight the cells and block them. Autotuning in boost simply requires time in each cell. Best done on hills, if available.
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Old 06-05-2016, 10:42 AM   #15
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Makes sense about the autotune settings, not sure why i thought it was ego control lol. Thanks for that.

Anybody have any input about my accel enrichment or the lean restart?

I have mapdot selected, but i only see TP AE and TP DE go active in my logs, also MAP DE does go active sometimes, not sure why.

Last edited by cruisin; 06-05-2016 at 10:59 AM.
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Old 06-05-2016, 11:30 AM   #16
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https://www.miataturbo.net/megasquir...eae-ms3-83753/

Not sure how different MS1 is from MS3
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Old 06-05-2016, 05:57 PM   #17
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MS1 does not have EAE.

Is it ok to turn off accel enrichment while tuning? Just set the values to zero?
Thats what seems to be giving me problems right now.

What else do you have off during tuning? I have controller authority off, overrun cut off, coolant related air density set to normal correction(not sure if it matters).
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Old 06-05-2016, 11:59 PM   #18
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It doesn't adjust the tune while AE is active.
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Old 06-06-2016, 12:41 AM   #19
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So AE on or off while tuning?

How does AE work on MS1 with mapdot selected, i dont see MP AE or MP DE active in my logs. MP DE is sometimes on. TP AE and DE is what i see active during accel and decel.
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Old 06-06-2016, 08:39 AM   #20
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You can leave it on because it does not change the cells in a bad way when it is active. Block out the idle cells so they are not changed and drive the car normally in varying conditions and varying gears and varying speeds for a couple of hours and the tune will be pretty darn close. Set it to "very easy."
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