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Old 06-01-2009, 11:59 PM   #1
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Default Just how much timeing can you add with WI?

Ive went from around 11 at full boost to almost 21 degrees with no knock... but it doesent really seem to be much faster.. of course this is right before I discovered my messed up turbo bearing but is this normal?
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Old 06-02-2009, 01:04 AM   #2
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i run 29 or so btdc at 18 psi. Did you adjust your AFR's, are your spark plugs good? WI systems like to run alot leaner than the **** you guys tune on fmic's aim for low to mid 12-1 and you will be better. Is there a turbo leak or is the bearing damage so bad you cant reach full impeller velocity? Thus increasing backpressure and the cfm influx in one fell swoop.
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Old 06-02-2009, 01:47 AM   #3
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This is what i'm running.

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Old 06-02-2009, 02:07 AM   #4
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damn i figured that would screw your idle up that much timming lol.
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:20 AM   #5
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thanks guys, I was a little afraid to experiment with that much timing, but now I will! I already have it around 12.2 to 1 in boost, so im good there. Still not sure what caused my bearing to fail, but I had a boost leak too... the car is getting a total makeover this week so by next week I should be back on the road with a 3 inch exhaust, rebuilt turbo, depower rack, and proper WI tuning. Cant wait!
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:52 AM   #6
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just to be sure we run so much cause we have WI i dont want you be mad cause it blows up and all you have is a FMIC. Still be cautious and probing man it can be done GL
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Old 06-02-2009, 04:44 AM   #7
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How do you expect to effectively dial in a timing map without a dyno?
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Old 06-02-2009, 10:12 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by wes65 View Post
This is what i'm running.

What gas are you running to be a able to run that kind of timing in your 183 kpa row? I just had my car tuned on a dyno and could only get ~ 18*. The idea of water/ methanol injection is a new area for me. Seems like it would provide a significant power increase.
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Old 06-02-2009, 10:18 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djp0623 View Post
What gas are you running to be a able to run that kind of timing in your 183 kpa row? I just had my car tuned on a dyno and could only get ~ 18*. The idea of water/ methanol injection is a new area for me. Seems like it would provide a significant power increase.


You are aware this thread is about water injection right?
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Old 06-02-2009, 10:27 AM   #10
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Actually I failed to realize that after the first part of my post. So to save face I added a second part asking about the setup. I was going to delete the post, but thought I might be able to learn something about water injection.

Thanks for calling me out
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:37 AM   #11
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Quote:
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Thanks for calling me out



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Old 06-02-2009, 11:54 AM   #12
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How do you expect to effectively dial in a timing map without a dyno?
Effectively dial it in, no; Make more power, yes.
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:00 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Savington View Post
How do you expect to effectively dial in a timing map without a dyno?
umm i get on the raod and hit it as hard as it will go and then observe how it does if no knock is pressent and it still pulls strong i edge the timming up and do another pull. If knock becomes present etc or i dont make anymore power then i will back of a hair. It is not that frigging hard man you just need someone to drive your car who has the ***** to push the **** down and some raods like mine where you will be left fairly alone.
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:24 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
umm i get on the raod and hit it as hard as it will go and then observe how it does if no knock is pressent and it still pulls strong i edge the timming up and do another pull. If knock becomes present etc or i dont make anymore power then i will back of a hair. It is not that frigging hard man you just need someone to drive your car who has the ***** to push the **** down and some raods like mine where you will be left fairly alone.
So how do you tell when it's not making any more power without a dyno?
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:40 PM   #15
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You seriusly cant feel power diferences in your car? Yes a dyno is alot more precise but i can tell what is faster and i can back it up with my performance over measured distance etc. Its not rocket science but it does requre alot of feel and attention.
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:43 PM   #16
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So how do you tell when it's not making any more power without a dyno?
When the car stops. Plus all the ring lands break in every cylinders, and white oil smoke covers all lanes of traffic.
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Old 06-02-2009, 02:55 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashnscar View Post
So how do you tell when it's not making any more power without a dyno?


stopwatch.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:00 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnamx-5 View Post
umm i get on the raod and hit it as hard as it will go and then observe how it does if no knock is pressent and it still pulls strong i edge the timming up and do another pull. If knock becomes present etc or i dont make anymore power then i will back of a hair. It is not that frigging hard man you just need someone to drive your car who has the ***** to push the **** down and some raods like mine where you will be left fairly alone.
Magna, how do you check for knock?
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Old 06-03-2009, 01:03 AM   #19
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Well i listen and i have my oil pressure gauge. Also i have the knowledge that i have dynoed my **** and not had any knock either. I didnt say it was the faint of heart or the epeleptic drunk in everyone but it does work.
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Old 06-03-2009, 02:10 AM   #20
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Well heres how I figure it. You cant get the timing map dialed in without a dyno, and that is really true for your timing at cruise. But under power atleast you can usually feel differences.

I also think we are lucky because when advancing timing at the top end, a turbo car will run into knock before you can advance timing too much and loose power. So I feel just advancing your timing until you get knock then backing out a little will give you most power. This is unlike N/A engines, where too much timing is bad.

So when I get some tuning done, ill post my map up!
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