Car doesn't start unless Idle Control is set to "None"
#23
Retired Mech Design Engr
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I was combing through my tune and noticed the Injector Dead Time settings. It was set to 1.300 ms in the base tune.
I checked with BEGI's website and they listed a dead time of 0.630 @ 13.2 volts (EV14 550cc). Could this be causing issues? I'll change it and try again tomorrow.
I checked with BEGI's website and they listed a dead time of 0.630 @ 13.2 volts (EV14 550cc). Could this be causing issues? I'll change it and try again tomorrow.
Regarding starts. it is tricky. Mostly controlled by Priming and Starting pulse (%); ASE, ASE taper and WUE. Note that WUE and ASE are additive.
If, when you crank, it fires and then struggles, you likely need to adjust ASE. On ASE Taper, there is a setting for Cycles or Seconds. I like Cycles. It's in a strange place, so I'll let you know where. If you change it, then you will have to adjust your ASE Tapers to keep similar time at idle. Cycles is better because sometimes you start and just idle, sometimes you may rev. Cycles includes that variable in the warm-up.
Synopsis: Get a reasonable dead time set early and then do not change it. Changing dead times to fix this issue, then that issue, is not the right way.
#24
You need to find out what injectors, exactly, you have. Then search for the correct value for those injectors, and put that in before you spend time tuning idle or any other low flow areas (those most affected by dead times).
Regarding starts. it is tricky. Mostly controlled by Priming and Starting pulse (%); ASE, ASE taper and WUE. Note that WUE and ASE are additive.
If, when you crank, it fires and then struggles, you likely need to adjust ASE. On ASE Taper, there is a setting for Cycles or Seconds. I like Cycles. It's in a strange place, so I'll let you know where. If you change it, then you will have to adjust your ASE Tapers to keep similar time at idle. Cycles is better because sometimes you start and just idle, sometimes you may rev. Cycles includes that variable in the warm-up.
Synopsis: Get a reasonable dead time set early and then do not change it. Changing dead times to fix this issue, then that issue, is not the right way.
Regarding starts. it is tricky. Mostly controlled by Priming and Starting pulse (%); ASE, ASE taper and WUE. Note that WUE and ASE are additive.
If, when you crank, it fires and then struggles, you likely need to adjust ASE. On ASE Taper, there is a setting for Cycles or Seconds. I like Cycles. It's in a strange place, so I'll let you know where. If you change it, then you will have to adjust your ASE Tapers to keep similar time at idle. Cycles is better because sometimes you start and just idle, sometimes you may rev. Cycles includes that variable in the warm-up.
Synopsis: Get a reasonable dead time set early and then do not change it. Changing dead times to fix this issue, then that issue, is not the right way.
The previous owner said they were 550cc and since he bought the turbo kit from Begi I checked their website and the EV14 550s they sell look identical to the ones in the car.
Do you have any suggestions for values in the ASE Taper? The dialogue box has values for Cycles in it already.
Also you said ASE and WUE are additive, so should I be using one or the other, or both?
#25
Retired Mech Design Engr
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Re: Open Loop Idle. You should indeed use it to get the values that then become your targets. However, you can also get that from logs (once oscillation is fixed by PID tuning or less aggressive timing adjustment... again, look at logs).
Re: Baro. You are set up to use the new method, so the table should be all "100"%, not all "0".
Re: General Sensor Settings in General Settings, I think MAP should be more like 90. You should not need lots of filtering on MAP. Compare against Brain's msg for those values.
Do you have a catalytic converter? If so, you do not want to use spark cut Rev Limit.
You are still running batch injection, which I think is not correct. This you missed when you compared your tune to Brains. Along with the Baro Correction. It is not working for me to have to address the same issues multiple times.
I could not find the cycle vs seconds choice. Look it up in the TS Manual (search) and then you can check it.
Re: Baro. You are set up to use the new method, so the table should be all "100"%, not all "0".
Re: General Sensor Settings in General Settings, I think MAP should be more like 90. You should not need lots of filtering on MAP. Compare against Brain's msg for those values.
Do you have a catalytic converter? If so, you do not want to use spark cut Rev Limit.
You are still running batch injection, which I think is not correct. This you missed when you compared your tune to Brains. Along with the Baro Correction. It is not working for me to have to address the same issues multiple times.
I could not find the cycle vs seconds choice. Look it up in the TS Manual (search) and then you can check it.
#26
Retired Mech Design Engr
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Re: ASE and WUE. Both. Just realize that if, as one CLT temp, things are great, and you take 10% out of WUE for some reason; to keep that start to run transition great, then you would have to add 10% to the ASE at that temp. That is what I mean by additive.
#27
Re: Open Loop Idle. You should indeed use it to get the values that then become your targets. However, you can also get that from logs (once oscillation is fixed by PID tuning or less aggressive timing adjustment... again, look at logs).
Re: Baro. You are set up to use the new method, so the table should be all "100"%, not all "0".
Re: General Sensor Settings in General Settings, I think MAP should be more like 90. You should not need lots of filtering on MAP. Compare against Brain's msg for those values.
Do you have a catalytic converter? If so, you do not want to use spark cut Rev Limit.
You are still running batch injection, which I think is not correct. This you missed when you compared your tune to Brains. Along with the Baro Correction. It is not working for me to have to address the same issues multiple times.
I could not find the cycle vs seconds choice. Look it up in the TS Manual (search) and then you can check it.
Re: Baro. You are set up to use the new method, so the table should be all "100"%, not all "0".
Re: General Sensor Settings in General Settings, I think MAP should be more like 90. You should not need lots of filtering on MAP. Compare against Brain's msg for those values.
Do you have a catalytic converter? If so, you do not want to use spark cut Rev Limit.
You are still running batch injection, which I think is not correct. This you missed when you compared your tune to Brains. Along with the Baro Correction. It is not working for me to have to address the same issues multiple times.
I could not find the cycle vs seconds choice. Look it up in the TS Manual (search) and then you can check it.
The car does not start at all using Sequential Injection. It starts and idles well in open loop idle mode using Untimed Injection.
#28
Retired Mech Design Engr
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Maybe you could PM Joe Perez for guidance here. He goes back to MS1 days. Others that would know for sure what would be preferred are Y8S and Braineack.
Yes, you can get idle to work with fixed settings, but you will hate what it does when fans kick on, you turn on lights, etc. Especially A/C, if you have it. And you will likely have to idle at higher RPM.
Still, you seem to be heading in the right direction. Just be careful of your engine as you move from tuning idle to tuning the entire VE table. Take your time.
David