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Diff and trans coolers

 
Old 07-12-2018, 01:26 PM
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Default Diff and trans coolers

I thought it might be helpful to start a thread with pics of diff and trans cooler installations. Share ideas and what not. I'll start with Vegas.

Feb 2019 update:
We ended up with Aeroquip -8 hose, Genesis pumps https://www.hrpworld.com/GEN-GC1111-...1111.html.html
Trans I/O are neutral switch port and drain. John felt the fill plug was too close to the exhaust. With the ducting from the fender through the license plate area, we have enough airflow to have never needed the fans.
http://www.setrabusa.com/products/fanpacks/index.html
Overkill for S1. If we ever ran an enduro in hot weather we might actually turn the fans on. So I think one can implement either good ductiong/airflow or fans, but you probably don't need both. Much easier to skip the ducting, just stuff the core under the car somewhere
and run a fan. I think the highest temps we have seen were with the Quaife (sequential) at maybe 180°. The AZ6 runs much cooler, barely hitting 140° even with no fans. That makes me happy.

William also has no OEM fuel filter assembly on his S1 so that area ahead of the RR wheel is vacant. He plans to put his exchanger/fan there with just a shroud to keep rocks and dirt out, but otherwise unducted.





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Old 07-12-2018, 01:29 PM
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Saw these on MX5 Mania's fb page (Australia). I know nothing about this car so ask them if you have any questions.
https://www.facebook.com/mx5mania/





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Old 07-12-2018, 01:54 PM
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Good subject. I will add that anyone following this thread beginning to wonder "should I consider adding trans and/or diff coolers?" should as a first step be installing temperature gauges in their trans and diff. Deciding to add the weight and complexity of such a system should only be done after acquiring data. If you don't know what temp your parts are operating at, you aren't prepared to make the decision.

Pics below show the sensor positions I chose for my trans and diff. If you don't have a logger dash or similar, standard oil temp gauges work just fine. Make sure the sensor location is below the fill hole so the sensor is submerged. Thanks to these sensors I happily discovered I don't need to add the cost/complexity/weight of coolers, but obviously my results don't apply to the Miata drivetrain.



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Old 07-12-2018, 02:28 PM
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Does one have to worry about pump life with the source being below the pump? Sorry if silly question, but wouldn't the pump run dry for a bit before it got any oil through it?
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Old 07-12-2018, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Joseph Conley View Post
Does one have to worry about pump life with the source being below the pump? Sorry if silly question, but wouldn't the pump run dry for a bit before it got any oil through it?
Depends on the pump. Some like Tilton are self priming and will pull fluid uphill several feet if need be. Others may need to be gravity fed.
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Old 07-12-2018, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Supe View Post
Depends on the pump. Some like Tilton are self priming and will pull fluid uphill several feet if need be. Others may need to be gravity fed.
Ah thanks. I should have googled first.

Cooler Pumps - Tilton Engineering

"Cooler pumps feature an internal bypass valve and are self-priming up to eight feet above the source from which it draws."
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Old 07-12-2018, 03:45 PM
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Generally they a little more stable than engine oil too, so you can use one sensor in the trans, record some data at a warm race, then move it to the diff and get data there. Keeps the wiring cleaner and costs down. I know Aim sensors for our car are ~$50
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Old 07-12-2018, 06:02 PM
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Who can find me an adapter to fit a 3/8"NPT GM sensor in the stock diff and 6 speed drain plugs?
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Old 07-13-2018, 11:00 AM
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I see all of the work that went into the cooler done by MX5 Mania and then read what Ryan said, which is to check it first before adding the complexity. I can't help but think that all of that plumbing and expense was done without first shielding that exhaust from heating up the differential. And the CV joint, for that matter. Hopefully some shielding was added after that picture was taken. The exhaust is probably adding a lot more heat than the cooler is capable of removing.
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Old 07-13-2018, 07:57 PM
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That's interesting about the AZ6 having aluminum shift forks and having shifting issues when hot.

I've intermittently had the issue going into gear (mainly 5th). It would always be during an afternoon session on a hot mid summer day. I replaced the clutch slave / master / rubber line and the frequency reduced, but it's never been completely solved.

This still happens even after installing the Blackbird competition engine mounts and poly diff mounts.
I've often thought maybe I'm just getting fatigued, but I can go entire weekends where there are no issues at all.

I haven't measured trans temp, yet, as this jalopy is still near stock output and I never thought 120-something whp could overheat the drivetrain.

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Old 07-13-2018, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by engineered2win View Post
I haven't measured trans temp, yet, as this jalopy is still near stock output and I never thought 120-something whp could overheat the drivetrain.
As mentioned in the oil cooler thread (IIRC), oil temps are created primarily through (high) revs. I suspect it's the same with transmissions.

For instance, the 5-speed is weaker than the 6-speed and many posit that the case is less stiff, which allows the gears to improperly mesh with the expected catastrophic result. As a data point, my Quaife gear set (installed in the 5-speed casing) will live indefinitely on the street but I've blown it up twice on the track (the second time it was a cold, rainy day). So, while a Spec Miata experiences the same case flex, 100-ish lb-ft is not enough to strip a gear, while 300+ lb-ft certainly is (no matter how robust the gearset).
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Old 07-17-2018, 05:08 AM
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Originally Posted by DeerHunter View Post
So, while a Spec Miata experiences the same case flex, 100-ish lb-ft is not enough to strip a gear, while 300+ lb-ft certainly is (no matter how robust the gearset).
And yet we still manage to regularly grenade 3rd gear :P
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Old 07-17-2018, 01:12 PM
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You're obviously a bunch of animals. However, I stand corrected.
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Old 07-30-2018, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by shuiend View Post
Who can find me an adapter to fit a 3/8"NPT GM sensor in the stock diff and 6 speed drain plugs?
DiscountHydraulicHose.com
Part #9235-18-06 | M18x1.5 Metric Male x 3/8" NPTF Female

I have confirmed it fits in the 6 speed oil drain plug. I will be confirming it fits in a diff hopefully tonight.

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Old 07-30-2018, 07:28 PM
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Diff and trans plugs are interchangeable so it should
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Old 07-30-2018, 07:55 PM
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Originally Posted by HarryB View Post
Diff and trans plugs are interchangeable so it should
Yep, but wanted to verify.



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Old 07-31-2018, 11:41 AM
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Well that makes it easy
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Old 07-31-2018, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by shuiend
Yep, but wanted to verify.


What gauge are you going to run the sensors to?
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Old 07-31-2018, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by stevos555 View Post
What gauge are you going to run the sensors to?
i would presume wire to Log in megasquirt
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Old 08-15-2018, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by stevos555 View Post
What gauge are you going to run the sensors to?
Going to my MS. I am doubtful if I ever actually make a gauge in TS for it, more want it to review in logs.
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