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Old 02-18-2013, 01:55 PM   #1
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Default got my tubular subframe

Ordered a mountless tubular front subrame. Fit is spot on. No pushing, prying, etc. to line up any bolts.

Two points of criticisms however.....

1. The advertised weight savings with mounts is 10lbs. Mine with no mounts is 8lbs lighter than stock.

2. When they build it with mounts, they cut the ends of the front tube where it curves back and joins the rails that run parallel to the car. On the mountless, those ends extend back until their natural intersection which means they are in the way for attaching my own mounts. Not a huge deal but I just wasn't expecting it.

Making a jig off the stock subframe to fab solid aluminum motor mounts and their attachment to the new subframe and then onto building tubular adjustable upper control arms and tubular lower arms.

It's Febuary 18 already?!?!
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Old 02-18-2013, 02:11 PM   #2
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Pics pics pics
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Old 02-18-2013, 02:16 PM   #3
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Where did you buy it from?
Any pics of what you are having to do to make your mounts work?
I am considering making my own sub-frame for my LS1 swap so any pics will be appreciated.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:01 PM   #4
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Bought it from v8roadster. Pictures on their site. Haven't started fabbing the mounts yet. Hoping to work on the jig tonight. I'll post some pics once I make some progress.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:48 PM   #5
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Gotcha, wasn't sure if there was maybe another supplier out there that I didn't know about. Thanks anyways, and I'll look forward to your finished work.
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Old 02-24-2013, 11:52 PM   #6
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Jig made on the stock subframe and then bolted to the new subframe. Started on the mounts, but no pics yet.
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got my tubular subframe-imag0169.jpg   got my tubular subframe-imag0172.jpg   got my tubular subframe-imag0173.jpg   got my tubular subframe-imag0174.jpg   got my tubular subframe-imag0176.jpg  

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Old 02-25-2013, 01:46 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by guttedmiata View Post
Jig made on the stock subframe and then bolted to the new subframe. Started on the mounts, but no pics yet.
Looks like your putting stock mount locations on it. Why not just get their mounts installed? or do you have some super secret reason.

Personally I plan to move the engine back a few inches for my next build.
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Old 02-25-2013, 03:06 PM   #8
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Looks like your putting stock mount locations on it. Why not just get their mounts installed? or do you have some super secret reason.

Personally I plan to move the engine back a few inches for my next build.
The mounts they provide only match the mounting surface of the factory subframe and are meant to still utilize a factory style multi-piece rubber mount to the block. I don't want that! We are going with solid mounts and rather than fab a solid mount that goes between the optional mounting point and the block, it's easier to fab the whole thing from the subframe hoop up to the block. Not sure if that make sense as described, but when I post pictures it should make sense.
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Old 02-25-2013, 03:49 PM   #9
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I know his would be an off the wall question, but what is the measurement from behind the front loop at the steering rack to the fire wall. The reason for me asking is I'm doing a engine swap and I want to know how much room I have for the oil pan.
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Old 02-25-2013, 06:59 PM   #10
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I know his would be an off the wall question, but what is the measurement from behind the front loop at the steering rack to the fire wall. The reason for me asking is I'm doing a engine swap and I want to know how much room I have for the oil pan.
Well I won't be able to finish the other motor mount until next weekend and so I won't be able to remove the jig and bolt it up to the car until then. Shoot me a pm next week and remind me to measure for you.
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Old 02-26-2013, 02:47 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guttedmiata View Post
The mounts they provide only match the mounting surface of the factory subframe and are meant to still utilize a factory style multi-piece rubber mount to the block. I don't want that! We are going with solid mounts and rather than fab a solid mount that goes between the optional mounting point and the block, it's easier to fab the whole thing from the subframe hoop up to the block. Not sure if that make sense as described, but when I post pictures it should make sense.
I hope your using locktite on every single bolt on the car if your using solid mounts. I think the AWR mounts are as stiff as is ever needed.
These engines have serious vibration.

Bob
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Old 02-26-2013, 03:21 AM   #12
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I hope your using locktite on every single bolt on the car if your using solid mounts. I think the AWR mounts are as stiff as is ever needed.
But if you fab the mount a bit from the subframe the total may be lighter than using the AWR ones.

Using the AWR with the race PU feels like being at the dentist.
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Old 02-26-2013, 07:28 AM   #13
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Keep up the good work!
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Old 02-26-2013, 08:58 PM   #14
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Quote:
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I hope your using locktite on every single bolt on the car if your using solid mounts. I think the AWR mounts are as stiff as is ever needed.
These engines have serious vibration.

Bob
+1.

Plus, I don't think there is a lot of performance to be gained there.
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:13 PM   #15
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Saving 2.2lbs per mount from stock. This is no dual purpose application fellas. I could see your point if I was turning some miles in the car or spending some time behind the wheel. 60 seconds at a time. That's all I'm after.

Looking to loose another 30-40lbs off the front. New subframe and mounts=12.4lbs toward that goal.
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Old 02-27-2013, 01:44 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guttedmiata View Post
Saving 2.2lbs per mount from stock. This is no dual purpose application fellas. I could see your point if I was turning some miles in the car or spending some time behind the wheel. 60 seconds at a time. That's all I'm after.

Looking to loose another 30-40lbs off the front. New subframe and mounts=12.4lbs toward that goal.
Seems like in XP where you can run a completely different type and make of engine you should be able to shift it back. But now I’m confused section 17 Prepared rules 17M7 says the engine may not be relocated. If you replace a rotary or a 4 banger with a V8 what exact placement is it that does not constitute relocated? And the Prepared rules say that Vehicles prepared to Production GT classes are elegible. The XP rules say the engine orientation must not be changed (i.e., transverse stays transverse, longitudinal stays longitudinal). And it says vehicles prepared to production GT classes are not eligible. The GCR production GT rules allow the engine to be shifted back just so long as the front spark plug hole is within an inch of the centerline of the front tires.


Ouch my head hurts.


I wanted to move the engine back and keep something that would fit in the production GT rules

Seems like combinig XP solo and club GT rules it is saying put in a rotary engine to have the best setup within the rules.
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Old 02-27-2013, 09:56 AM   #17
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Quote:
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Seems like combinig XP solo and club GT rules it is saying put in a rotary engine to have the best setup within the rules.
But you cant combine the rules. You either have to comply completely with the GT rules (minus any exceptions the solo book specifies) or you must completely comply with the solo rules.
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:18 AM   #18
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I can help some one the XP rules front. You can move the engine as far back as the firewall will allow. The firewall is "sacred" in Prepared. You can notch it and "clearance" the firewall for certain things and not for other. And you can't just modify the firewall for 1 part and move the illegal part into the newly clearanced area.

The simplest rule for engine placement in XP is the head(s) can not go past the factory location of the front firewall.

You must go to a Mod class (D/E) if you want to move the motor back farther than that.
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Old 02-27-2013, 10:30 AM   #19
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Correct. The firewall is the key. The firewall cannot be moved back or clearanced for the engine. In XP the only other engine placement rule is the orientation. With a big(for a 1.8) twin screw charger, hanging off the side and the big TB we're running, there is no room to move things back.
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Old 02-27-2013, 05:30 PM   #20
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Correct. The firewall is the key. The firewall cannot be moved back or clearanced for the engine. In XP the only other engine placement rule is the orientation. With a big(for a 1.8) twin screw charger, hanging off the side and the big TB we're running, there is no room to move things back.
Removing the cam angle sensor and itís got about 3 inches it can go back plus the rules allow for notching the firewall for a "distributor" if I remember correctly. Head or block are the only parts that count. 3 inches is also within the Club GT rules. I want to be able to road race the thing I intend to build.

The part that sticks up that does not separate the driver from the engine compartment is not part of the firewall and can be removed. moving the engine back 3 inches will allow the radiator to be moved back and slanted in behind where my sway bar will end up witch will further help in moving necessary weight back and down.
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