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Old 05-22-2012, 12:01 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hustler View Post
No dude, you're a troll. You're also a hand-ball bottom crybaby, you're annoying, and if you're not a virgin I can't believe it. Please, STFU and go back to cruising the poz forums for unsuspecting victims to "control your load".
Yes, by advocating safer towing, Im obviously a troll. Yet not one single rebuttal to the facts Ive posted can be found. Wonder why?

You're a moderator with a superiority complex, probably due to your lack of manhood and the fact that someone made you their bitch when you were in middle school.

Go ---- yourself.
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:43 PM   #42
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Yes, by advocating safer towing, Im obviously a troll. Yet not one single rebuttal to the facts Ive posted can be found. Wonder why?

You're a moderator with a superiority complex, probably due to your lack of manhood and the fact that someone made you their bitch when you were in middle school.

Go ---- yourself.
You're a cumhog and nobody likes you.
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:54 PM   #43
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I drive a semi truck that has trailer breaks. I have also used a pickup to tow plenty of car trailers and equipment trailers, some with brakes and most without. All of the small trailer and pickup truck combos with out trailer brakes will stop shorter than my semi. I do not punt deer and grannies like crazy in the semi truck. Driving responsibly and defensively goes along
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:58 PM   #44
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Cameltoe, it would be wise of you to stop abusing the props system.
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Old 05-22-2012, 12:59 PM   #45
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You're a cumhog and nobody likes you.
You're a butt hurt closet *** who can't admit that mommy and daddy didn't love him enough, who lacks the intelligence and mental capacity to rebut the facts presented or understand the physics of towing and stopping a trailer, all while crying to your mother from your basement bedroom while you ask for some more milk, cookies and your favorite blankie BoBo.

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Originally Posted by fooger03 View Post
Cameltoe, it would be wise of you to stop abusing the props system.
Ill take that into consideration, right after I finish abusing your mother.

I can do this all day.

I still have yet to see a rebuttal to these three small facts:
Quote:
1. Trailers with brakes stop shorter.
2. Trailers with brakes give you a method to arrest sway
3. Trailers with brakes allow you to control your load better.
Instead, you continue to call me a troll. I guess the facts arent popular in your little fantasy land, where unsafe behaviors are tolerated and even encouraged. I look forward to what your insurance says when they find out you were towing a trailer above the weight limit, without brakes, and you were at fault for an accident.
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Old 05-22-2012, 01:08 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by cucamelsmd15 View Post
You're a butt hurt closet *** who can't admit that mommy and daddy didn't love him enough, who lacks the intelligence and mental capacity to rebut the facts presented or understand the physics of towing and stopping a trailer, all while crying to your mother from your basement bedroom while you ask for some more milk, cookies and your favorite blankie BoBo.

We get it, you are the "guy who is right". No one cares, stop posting about how right you are.
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Old 05-22-2012, 01:23 PM   #47
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i'm surprised the ban hammer isn't out yet. i ordered up some new 15x9 wheels and 888's in 225 for the car today. now if i can just get the beast home and to the track! trying to find someone local to me running the sparco sprint 5 to see if i fit. no one my size in the thread o' racing seats is using them.
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Old 05-22-2012, 01:43 PM   #48
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Ill take that into consideration, right after I finish abusing your mother.
let me know how that works out for you
Quote:

I can do this all day.

I still have yet to see a rebuttal to these three small facts:
You don't even understand what your own argument is. You're arguing that trailers without brakes are unsafe. You only support your claim by telling us why trailers with brakes are more safe than trailers without brakes. You have yet to provide us with an argument as to why trailers without brakes are unsafe, but still you keep claiming it.
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I look forward to what your insurance says when they find out you were towing a trailer above the weight limit, without brakes, and you were at fault for an accident.
Speaking very frankly, that won't happen. You're making an incorrect assumption that I tow trailers above gross weight limits. You're also making an assumption that I will be at fault, and although it would be rather ignorant of me to discount the possibility, I've stated earlier that I drive very cautiously with a trailer. I hope you've enjoyed your short-lived stay here on MT.net, I doubt you'll last here much longer with that attitude.
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Old 05-22-2012, 02:07 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by fooger03 View Post
You have yet to provide us with an argument as to why trailers without brakes are unsafe, but still you keep claiming it.
You are increasing your stopping distances by a significant amount without trailer brakes. When someone pulls out in front of you unexpectedly, you will or will not be able to stop - it's a pretty black and white thing.

Friction is based on coefficient of friction and force applied to the object. With a trailer that has no brakes, you are adding to the momentum force of your rig without an equivalent increase in the force being applied to the tires on your truck. You're therefore asking essentially the same deceleration force (truck weight + tongue weight) to cope with 50-100% more momentum (truck+trailer), and that's not safe. It's literally like unhooking the rear brakes on your car.

It gets worse from there - because the trailer isn't being stopped by any force other than what's being applied at the hitch, the entire thing will want to jackknife at even the slightest hint of steering input while at full-chat on the brakes. I hope you never have to take evasive maneuvers while braking.

The argument that you should just drive safer is the worst argument I've ever heard on this topic. You shouldn't bother wearing a seatbelt, either - just drive safer and be more cautious.
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Old 05-22-2012, 02:15 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by fooger03 View Post
You don't even understand what your own argument is. You're arguing that trailers without brakes are unsafe. You only support your claim by telling us why trailers with brakes are more safe than trailers without brakes. You have yet to provide us with an argument as to why trailers without brakes are unsafe, but still you keep claiming it.
I understand perfectly what my argument is. When your loaded trailer with no brakes starts to sway, what do you do? Remember, you have no brakes to arrest the sway, and you now have 3000+lb of a pendulum connected to your vehicle. Trailers without brakes are unsafe for a multitude of reasons including:
1. Lack of ability to arrest sway
2. Brake fade of tow vehicle

There is a reason practically every state DOT has a weight threshold on trailers for required brakes, and there is a reason that its so low.

Moreover, EVERY major manufacturer that includes "sway control" on their vehicle fires the trailer brakes when the truck senses sway. Gee, wonder why that is?

You keep asserting that towing without proper trailer brakes is safe. Its not. Especially so with the fondness of towing with midsize trucks, short wheelbase SUVs and the like that seem to be common to this forum. SUVs in particular are the worst case (although midsize trucks arent far off) because they dont have enough spring to support the tongue weight of the trailer, resulting in even less braking because the front end is unloaded. And thats coupled with the fact that they are generally woefully underbraked for more than a single panic stop, much less a panic stop while pulling the vehicles equivalent weight.
Quote:
Speaking very frankly, that won't happen. You're making an incorrect assumption that I tow trailers above gross weight limits. You're also making an assumption that I will be at fault, and although it would be rather ignorant of me to discount the possibility, I've stated earlier that I drive very cautiously with a trailer. I hope you've enjoyed your short-lived stay here on MT.net, I doubt you'll last here much longer with that attitude.
Bullshit. I have direct, first hand experience with an accident involving a truck and a trailer, and one of the first items NCSHP checked was for functioning trailer brakes. If the driver of the truck had not had brakes, he would have been cited as such, and deemed at fault.
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Old 05-22-2012, 02:33 PM   #51
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sure, you will be able to stop quicker with brakes on the trailer, but if it was a huge safety issue on lighter loads i don't think Texas would allow them to not have brakes.

547.401. BRAKES REQUIRED. (a) Except as provided by
Subsection (b), a motor vehicle, trailer, semitrailer, pole
trailer, or combination of those vehicles shall be equipped with
brakes that comply with this chapter.
(b) A trailer, semitrailer, or pole trailer is not required
to have brakes if:
(1) its gross weight is 4,500 pounds or less; or
(2) its gross weight is heavier than 4,500 pounds but
not heavier than 15,000 pounds, and it is drawn at a speed of not
more than 30 miles per hour.


still, if i pull the car and it seems to be an issue i can always add them.
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Old 05-22-2012, 02:38 PM   #52
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California requires any trailer over 1500lbs to have brakes.
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Old 05-22-2012, 02:45 PM   #53
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i think that is where a lot of the friction comes in on this topic, so many different rules depending on where you are. I can see this being a big issue crawling up and down California hills/mountains with an undersized truck towing 4000 pounds and not watching your spacing with the car in front of you. i also drove a rental car in Cali once, people drive crazy out there lol
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Old 05-22-2012, 03:13 PM   #54
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I pulled a small 15' travel trailer last year. NYS law dictates having a brake controller, but I decided to blow it off, on the basis that the trailer was barely over the legal limit (2000#), and I'd get one later on. No panic stops, and I only towed it about 250-300 miles round trip.

I was surprised to find it really did a number on the rear brakes of the Jeep. They were fine before towing (just passed inspection) and nearly shot afterwards. It didn't seem to affect the front brakes at all.

Needless to say, I've since bought a brake controller, and will be using it this year.
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Old 05-22-2012, 03:21 PM   #55
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what sort of jeep?
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:04 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savington View Post
California requires any trailer over 1500lbs to have brakes.
California has a bunch of stupid laws that reinforce a culture of socialism and protectionism.

The recommendation stands:
Trailer brakes are great and everyone should have them, but they are not required in the great Republic of Texas.
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:18 PM   #57
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Y'all are a bunch of Texweenie sissies. MO:

Trailer Brakes – Trailer brakes are required on trailers coupled by a fifth wheel and kingpin, and on trailers hauling hazardous materials with a gross weight exceeding 3,000 pounds.
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:26 PM   #58
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Y'all are a bunch of Texweenie sissies. MO:

Trailer Brakes Trailer brakes are required on trailers coupled by a fifth wheel and kingpin, and on trailers hauling hazardous materials with a gross weight exceeding 3,000 pounds.
Hmmmm... Not sure if for or against
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:46 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by fooger03 View Post
Speaking very frankly, that won't happen. You're making an incorrect assumption that I tow trailers above gross weight limits. You're also making an assumption that I will be at fault, and although it would be rather ignorant of me to discount the possibility, I've stated earlier that I drive very cautiously with a trailer. I hope you've enjoyed your short-lived stay here on MT.net, I doubt you'll last here much longer with that attitude.
What exactly are you towing with to be able to haul a trailer and Miata and stay under your GVWR? GVWR is the max weight that the manufacturer is on the hook for the brakes working at a reasonable level. Since we're all about proof and what not. http://www.ford.com/resources/ford/g..._F150nov18.pdf last page, left side bottom.

I'm just glad that the guy I'm most likely to be in front of on the road is also in favor of putting brakes on his trailer.

I don't get why people even consider running without brakes.

http://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Brak...ter/23-26.html
http://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Hubs...546UC3-EZ.html
http://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Brea...ins/20099.html

The way people argue against it you'd think it costs thousands of dollars to retrofit them on.
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Old 05-22-2012, 05:02 PM   #60
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I am right around my GVWR when towing the track rat. Truck stops ok with the trailer brakes off. With the trailer brakes active and properly adjusted, there is no difference in stopping between fully loaded with trailer and completely unloaded without trailer.

I can specifically recall an instance where I would have been involved in an accident if I did not have trailer brakes. It was raining and a guy coming from the other way turned left in front of me. As Andrew said, I went into the brakes to ABS engagement, ABS kicked in, the trailer brakes held it steady, and I decelerated to swerve and avoid the collision. Sure that accident wouldn't have been my fault, but it still would have destroyed my truck and possibly my trailer and race car. Plus all the other negative things that are involved with an accident.

I'm having a hard time reading posts from the same guys who need 3 layer fire suits (for the extremely unlikely event of car fire) say that trailer brakes are not important (for the very real likelihood of having a motor vehicle accident). You do realize that the most dangerous aspect of a typical motorsport event is driving to and from the track, right?
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