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Pyrometers

 
Old 05-01-2013, 02:56 PM
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Question Pyrometers

I have searched through Trubo.net and have read Emilio's Pyrometer Primer. However, I wasn't able to find any recommendations or posts with experiences on specific brand and model of preferred probe pyrometers.

For example, is this
$150 Longacre Accutech Deluxe Digital Pyrometer $150 Longacre Accutech Deluxe Digital Pyrometer
worth the bump in price over the
$100 Longacre Accutech Economy Pyrometer $100 Longacre Accutech Economy Pyrometer
or the
$100 Joes Racing 54005 Pyrometer $100 Joes Racing 54005 Pyrometer
?

I kind of like the right angle probe on the Joes Racing unit and the price is right, but I've never heard of the company. I am not ready to pony up for the $300 - $500 memory pyrometers at this point.

Last edited by Scrappy Jack; 05-01-2013 at 02:57 PM. Reason: Fixed URL tags
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Old 05-01-2013, 03:00 PM
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I have a friend write it down as we check the inside, middle, and outer area of each tire. it is quick and saves me from buying the baller memory pyrometer. but that's just me
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Old 05-01-2013, 03:09 PM
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We've been writing down numbers for too long, I want a good memory unit. It'll allow for quicker data collection, and better accuracy (less time for the tires to cool down).

I'm eager to hear what people like.
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Old 05-01-2013, 03:29 PM
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when you measure temps, do you check the first tire again to see if there's a variance between your first reading? if I'm writing it myself I can see how it's much slower than a memory unit, but with a friend it seems pretty quick to me.
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Old 05-01-2013, 03:59 PM
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I was lucky enough to pickup a used longacre memory unit for about the same cost as a new non-memory, it doesn't appear much has changed with these units besides the graphics on the front.
The memory is nice since I just do HPDEs because you can usually just pull right off the track, check it and go back out so you get more accurate temps vs after cool down lap or after returning to where you are parked.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:03 PM
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how long does it take you to measure all four? I usually skip a cooldown lap as well, then just putt around to cool down.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:15 PM
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When will thermocameras be simple enough to be incorporated into smartphones?

Then the full pattern could be seen easily.
NEC Thermo Shot F30 is a "bit" expensive for this purpose, but who knows what they are able to cram into the next few generations of phones.
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Old 05-01-2013, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by monkeywinky View Post
how long does it take you to measure all four? I usually skip a cooldown lap as well, then just putt around to cool down.
I would say it took me around 2 mins with getting out of the car and checking everything, the guys working the track are nice enough to let me stash my pyrometer on one side of the short fence/wall so I can pull into the pits, check the temps and then review later.
Now that I have my HANS device I have given up on checking it myself and have enlisted the help of a friend.
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:27 PM
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I have that Joes Racing unit and it works great. Memory would be nice, but it isn't worth the money to me. If I'm by myself I'll use my phone's voice recorder function with the phone in my pocket so I can just say the temps out loud, then transcribe them later.
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by NiklasFalk View Post
When will thermocameras be simple enough to be incorporated into smartphones?
Thermal cameras show you the surface temperature, probes show you a deeper core temperature.

--Ian
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Handy Man View Post
I have that Joes Racing unit and it works great. Memory would be nice, but it isn't worth the money to me. If I'm by myself I'll use my phone's voice recorder function with the phone in my pocket so I can just say the temps out loud, then transcribe them later.
Thanks; that's a helpful reply and a clever idea about the voice recording for the tire temps. I will have to grab some mechanic's shirts or short-sleeve button-ups with front pockets to wear over my long-sleeve t-shirts.
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Old 05-01-2013, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by codrus View Post
Thermal cameras show you the surface temperature, probes show you a deeper core temperature.

--Ian
Measuring 3 points deeper in the rubber gives more stable results than IR on the surface, sure, but would a grid of 19k points of IR measurements give the same or even more information in a handy format (photo with time etc)?
Absolute temp on the surface is close to useless (the "ouchometer" in you hand is almost as good).
Thermal Cameras for Auto Racing Performance | FLIR Systems

Old article http://www.palmerwahl.com/pdfs/Racec...l%20Camera.pdf

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Old 05-01-2013, 07:31 PM
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Niklas - As interesting as the thermal cameras are, they are in no way helpful in answering the questions in my original post.

Maybe a cool topic for another thread.
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Old 05-01-2013, 11:12 PM
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I have the Longacre non-memory unit. It works fine for my layman uses, DE4 and TT this summer.
Never thought of the rechecking tire one thing, makes sense to see the potential drop.
Only takes a minute or two to have a buddy write them down or voice record them to Siri.
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Old 05-02-2013, 03:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Scrappy Jack View Post
Niklas - As interesting as the thermal cameras are, they are in no way helpful in answering the questions in my original post.
As always: Buy the instruments you will like to use (the ones left in the trailer is of little use). Size, angle, button size/placements and probe durability is worth much more than whatever extra dodads they motivate a hiked price with.

A simple and fast readout (with maybe lower precision) is more important than a multi-click menu to get to the right tire to store the values, which takes 2-3 seconds to even out the second decimal.

The speed of measurement was my reason for bringing up cameras. Taking a shot of each tire would take very little time. Analysis is another matter (but i imagine that the full pattern would tell more than three points, then what to do with all the information...).
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Old 05-02-2013, 04:13 AM
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What I think when pyrometer:

Attached Thumbnails Pyrometers-pyrometer.jpg  
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Old 05-02-2013, 04:45 PM
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the thermal camera idea is cool, if you have someone watching you as you drive? if you intend to pull into the pits to use it, wouldn't it be effectively the same as taking a infrared temp gun and read the entire width of the tire ( start inside and sweep outward). that would give you the lateral spread of surface temp, which is what the thermo would give you.

anyways, back on topic, thanks handyman for useful tip!
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Old 05-03-2013, 02:25 AM
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Professionals that tune race cars for a living use probe type pyrometers, I have no interest in surface temp readings (surface temps are more skewed by what you last did, or cool off as Emilio has noted. Core temps give better averages/data).

Checking the first tire after the last is good data.

I like the cell phone recorder idea except for the noisy environment.

Ideal set-up for me would be able to dump data to a PC for later analysis and history.

Edit: pretty sad that the cheapest memory unit at Summit Racing is $329.
This $407 Intercomp Unit will download data.
The $397 Longacre Delux Memory unit does not appear to have download capability

Last edited by Ski_Lover; 05-03-2013 at 01:59 PM.
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Old 05-06-2013, 04:10 PM
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Somebody at DIYAutotune needs to start working on something...
15ft coil cord from the glovebox, hardwired into ms3x onboard memory...
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Old 05-06-2013, 04:19 PM
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To do what? Log the tyre temps when the car is pulled over? That's not ECU territory. If you were to say triple tyre temps per tyre...now that would be interesting.
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