Work in progress- Brake ducts in GV lip for SADFAB
 

Hi All,
I am working with @hi_im_sean on some brake cooling ducts for GV lips and possibly R package lips (haven't scanned the r package lip yet, need to see if there is enough cross section for 2.5" outlet).

So far I have scanned the GV lip:
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...c9b3544071.png

And begun basic measurements for the duct:
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...17afa58515.png


I'm looking for feedback on ways to mount it. I think we are going to do 4 countersunk fasteners from the lip to the duct. We might need some support from the top as well. A well zip tied hose near the outlet would provide good additional support.

The outlet is currently 2.5" but there is enough area to support up to a 3" duct if anyone has a use for that.

Also, is there anything specific people need for the outlet location? IC piping clearance? Prefer it come out at an angle towards the wheel slightly?

First pass at a rough design. In some areas with will be a dual wall part. One wall that hugs the inside of the lip for solid fit, another inner wall that does the airflow. I roughed in an inner wall and measure the cross sections. The green line is my target and since most of my issues are after the duct clears the lip, I should have no issues hitting it. There will be some amount of a balancing act balance between blending shapes smoothly to keep laminar flow, and making the size transitions follow a nice curve.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...683b211d3a.png



https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...d7df0a1958.png

Very cool! How would these be affixed?

Looks cool. Like a very well engineered vacuum cleaner attachment. Sorry, I'm really tired and it just seemed funny. Please continue.......https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...37299d6c64.jpg

I bought the 3d printed ones from another enthusiast but found them lacking in the mounting department. Hard to get a screwdriver in the mouth of the inlet and even harder to get a drill in there.

Would it be possible to have the bottom lip go beneath the gv lip and allow the holes to be drilled through the GV lip from below and screws or pop rivets used from above or below?

My intent is to use allen head countersunk machine screws and nuts, probably nylocks. So you can hold the screw with an allen key in the mouth of the opening and tighten the nut above and below the inlet and bumper skin/lip respectively. There is no reason you couldn't use rivets with the same inlet mounting design. Other than being able to mark the holes for drilling, I'm not sure how tucking the lower edge of the duct under the lip will help anything? We can probably make drill templates if that's the case, or maybe tucking it under is better; I'd need to look at the lip again when I get home to see how that'd work. Maybe even sandwich the lip between 2 lower edges of the inlet, although that may complicate printing.

Another pass at it. I moved the opening away from the center line of the car to better clear IC piping. I also angled the duct out 5 degrees. I'm going to rescan the lip after mounting it because I'm unsure of the exact curvature and available space with the bumper. Also if you look at the graph, the cross sections are much better now. Ideally I will take some of the shoulder out of that curvature and make it softer. Also this is going to feed into corrugated ducting so getting that last bit of flow optimization is probably a waste of time.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...7541a04181.png

Sexier than I ever could have imagined.

I had thought about the two lip bottom. Frankly, a template solves most of my issues because it solves the "where to drill" problem.

Steve, did you install yours with the lip on the car? Or did you remove to drill and sandwich the inlet?

I unscrewed it from the bumper cover and angled it downward but it was a little awkward to mark the spots where I needed to drill with a sharpie through the little holes. I didn't drill or screw the top holes for this reason.

New idea: If the duct flared out in front of the hole and was screwed or riveted from the front it would be ideal.

I'm a little concerned people won't be willing to drill holes in the front of their bumpers where it will be visible if they ever remove the ducts.

It's really low on the bumper. The same black pop rivets can be painted to match the body color with a tiny bit of touch up paint if someone really cared. Brake ducts are for track cars anyway. The number of track cars going back to stock is miniscule.

I could be misunderstanding and/or this maybe not be a viable solution since the majority of client's would likely be track focused with speeds at 100+mph, but would a generous use of double sided tape work? That could go in addition to the new idea posted by Six and conceivably work in my head.

I think body mounting tape would work if the fit was very good. Based on the design I'm working on now, the part can't actually be installed or removed unless the lip is pried apart or partially removed. It should be snug and not require that much to be well attached.

I wouldn't want tape. The lip gets snagged occasionally both on and off track and flexes quite a bit.

Any update on these. A 3" would be perfect for me right about now

I will be getting back to these next week when my printer is up and running again. I'm doing another scan of the lip with it mounted on the bumper since the last design didn't fit well and I think it was a result of the lip being flexible.

LookING forward to the final product. It definitely fits a good hole in the market seems how so many of us have front lips that can utilize this

Very cool stuff. Can't wait to see something mounted up.

In for R-package lip version.

+1

+1

+1

How did the last prototype turn out?

As mentioned previously, the lip needs to be mounted and scanned as its urethane and its natural shape isn't the same as its mounted shape, but it was pretty close.

New lip scan, this time attached to bumper. I'm going to print up a fit test that matches the inner surface of the lip and bumper to verify. Then adapt the design to the new scan.
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...50de3cb6f2.png

I printed a quick test piece to verify fit between the scan and my bumper. hi_im_sean is also printing one to get some idea of how much variation there is between lip installs.

The fit is perfect. I can feel it pop into place and it wants to stay put. The red lines I drew on the part show the edges where I am looking at gaps/fit. There is actually more space to work with on this scan than before, which means more/better flow.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...68028e7bda.jpg

Looking good cant wait!:bigtu:

Can't wait for these cool 3D air ducts. Do you think the tube outlet will be 2" or larger ?

Looks rad. Definitely in for an R package version if you do one.

They are aiming for 2.5" or 3". See the cross sectional area graph above.

Also interested in an R package version!

This one is going to be 2.5". 3" is probably possible as well.

Eventually I will scan the R package lip mounted to the bumper to see what is possible. The R package has a smaller opening and more stuff in the way- it might not be possible and it might require cutting some lip plastic (stuff you can't see from outside of the car).

Yes, I was thinking about that, there is that weird half clamshell piece on the inside that might need to go. If the GV lip inlets flow enuogh for a 3" hose I'm sure the R-pkg lip should flow enough to justify a 2.5" hose, I think they're fairly close in size. I'd be willing to let you use my car for R-lip scanning purposes some weekend, Durham's not far...

They look like they fit nicely but I'm skeptical about how well they will sell with no holes in them.

Its top secret technology, stay tuned.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...6dcd9fce03.png

Im going to try to test fit mine today, or tomorrow.

anticipation for final product is killing me

Racing Beat Type II next! Racing Beat Type II next! Racing Beat Type II next!

So the template part fits my lip perfectly and Seans lip imperfectly. We both played with lip mounting position but it seems like there is some variation between the lips (multiple molds?). Add in how much variation there will be in user install and I don't think the lip can be designed to fit everyone with a cosmetically perfect fit. I think the best solution is a small bead of black silicone that seals any gaps on the leading edge. This is going to to be cosmetic, even without the silicone the part is secure. I am printing a PLA test duct right now that is close to a final design.

appearance package 2 front lip? :D

I'm still tweaking the height/depth but this shows how the m5 bolts are countersunk. The transition is blended for flow.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...32cd20eeba.jpg

First up, a quick fit test I printed. The duct can easily be installed in the back of the lip without needing to remove it. There are 5 holes countersunk for m5 bolts and it wants to stay registered to the lip on its own. If the tube is zip tied and supporting it's own weight these 5 holes should be all that is needed.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...32c55eba21.jpg

After printing the fit test I made a few small tweaks. I think this is the final design:
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...b2ccbeb5c7.jpg

Me tew

These prototypes look great. Will there be separate files for the inlet and outlet? Very interested to get my hands on a set. Starting to shop for Singular brake ducts and hose

Ill be printing the beta today and hopefully fitting to my NA sometime this week. If everything goes well there, then ill start experimenting with how to best print it for strength, and order some hardware and put some kits together. Default color will be black(I might take requests), I might experiment with vapor bathing.

Black works fine - can't wait for a kit.

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...8d&oe=5B04CDEC

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...ac&oe=5B4D9EAE

test piece in PLA

Looking good! Now give us an R-package lip version!

That may or may not happen. I'll scan one and investigate but eyeballing it, it doesn't look super promising.

Looking good. When can we buy some

Aaaaaand appearance package 2 lip :D

I have an ebay lip. How do I know if it's G or R?
I guess they are cheap enough to buy the right lip to use these ducts for track.

Does anybody in the forum have an authentic GV lip?

These were modeled on the china lip that I assume will be the most common and Id like to check genuine GV fitment.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mia...409f11b605.jpgGV vs. R lip.
The GV lip has a much larger intake than the R lip.
Let's just figure out which GV works - china / ebay/amazon and announce a Group buy.

/\Our new, self appointed marketing department, everybody.....

Have been chasing a cat. Do I get one ...just one..:dunno: :dunno:

I've got one I bought around '01-'02. It's painted, but I assume you've built in enough tolerance that a few thou of paint won't cause binding.

Could this be the second asmasm-designed 3D-printed part I install on my car? Maybe... Will the 3D files be made public like the intake?