pman9003

Is anyone running sphericals from Keisler Automation? I'm interested in going to sphericals and they are one of the few options that make kits and install them. The prices they list for the sphericals are pretty cheap ($120 for 22 bearings), hence the reason I ask. A single bearing from Aurora is around $30-40+. The quality of the bearing is only one part of the setup, but with stuff like bearings you usually get what you pay for. My other other option is Kingpin Machine, which is local, but I don't if they have any experience with Miatas. Mostly seem to do Honda stuff.

Also a general question about sphericals. Is removing all the compliance in the suspension a potential problem for the car itself? The stock rubber absorbs some load and vibration that with sphericals is sent to the sub frame and unibody. Only asking because I have seen the point raised on some sites, but no actual evidence. Potentially increased fatigue due to every little bump and vibration being transmitted through the entire car? Seems unlikely, but figured I would ask.

And yes I know the downsides to sphericals, yes I have seen the bushing MegaThread, and no its not a street car/daily. I'm fully aware of what going sphericals involves and the downsides, but I'm okay with that because racecar...

themonkeyman

The bearing replacements are $120/22 but I highly doubt that is including all the spacers and sleeves to mount them to the control arms and to the car. I believe that $120 is just to replace the wear-parts of the system.

Lurch

Keisler uses bearings from Midwest Control Products. Chinese made, but still Teflon lined and he never seems to have any problems out of them. He used to offer an upgrade to Auroras but the price increase was so drastic that no one ever went with that option. Not a single person. Seems to sell a lot of the kits with the MCP stuff with no complaints though.


I've seen the Kingpin stuff on Hondas, His stuff is art but geez, is it pricey. I remember he had a post on the sandbox breaking down how little of a profit he made from that stuff. I'm all for supporting companies made in America but is it really worth buying high dollar heims when you could replace the cheap Chinese one multiple times and still come out ahead?

pman9003

Thanks for the reply, that's exactly the kind of information I was looking for. Do you happen to know if the bearings are interchangeable between the MCPs and Auroras? I'm guessing there must be slight dimensional differences that would require different sleeves and spacers.

apexanimal

there have been two miata's i know of to have tried these - both ended up selling them for fitment and support reasons.

pman9003

Care to elaborate any on the issues they had?

apexanimal

holes wouldn't align and were well outside the margin of adjustments.
control arms were verified to be straight.

i wasn't privileged to the communication between them and the company, but they had to sell the set off at a financial loss.

fmcokc

We are using Andrew's sphericals on one of our race cars. I have just received 2 additional sets of lower control arms and have 2 more on the way. I believe his spherical setup is the best out there for Miata's. The set that we are running on our GP3 WRL car has held up wonderfully. In fact, that car is the current overall points leader in the country for all classes.

The bearing is a com-10 bearing so it is replaceable with an Aurora or whatever brand or spec you want in there.

No doubt that a spherical equipped car is light years ahead of a non-equipped car in terms of steering precision and alignment.

Shakydog racing

Mud_Duck

Do you know if these customers installed themselves or had Keisler install them? It looks like they only offer in-house installation now and I wonder if this to avoid issues like the ones you describe.

apexanimal

precisely. sounds like now that all the installs are done in-house, problems have gone away.

Lancefitzgiben

Andrew installed my bearings in-house and everything's been cherry save for some sleeves loosening up.

My car sees regular track use but is on the street more than anything, though a 4th car; definitely not a DD. I also run drop spindles and long xidas. Soft setup and it's totally bearable on the road. A little creaky on humid mornings but the precision and solidity are worth it. The car never does anything unexpected - it's extremely planted and precise/predictable.

fmcokc

It is a good idea to place a drop of blue locite on each of the outer sleeves to prevent them from becoming loose

Lancefitzgiben

Yes sir. Andrew assembled mine as stated - I guess he hadn't seen them loosen up. All of mine are loc-tited now.