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Old 02-21-2014, 10:47 PM   #1
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Default koni coil over sleeves?

looking at getting set up with a 2.5" spring set for my koni yellows.
400 pound qa1 7" fronts and eibach 275 pound rears 8".

looking at summit website there are 3 koni sleeve kits listed but all say 2.25" spring perch?

whats a good bang for buck sleeve setup and what top hat bumpstop should i use?
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:33 PM   #2
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$42 and free shipping from eBay.

Edit: looks like they're $45 now:
http://m.ebay.com/itm/390761467990

51722-SE0-003 for the rear bumpstops
51722-SR0-003 with the bottom ring cut off for the front

Last edited by Failure; 02-26-2014 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 07-06-2014, 11:36 PM   #3
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any experience with above? how do they mount to the smaller koni body?
im not in the states so the shipping is a killer. might have to with summit ones or genuine koni??

i was thinking of upgrading the current set up to:

ebay threaded perches (with some sort of adaptor ring for the narrower koni body)

QA1 400# front 7" spring
QA1 300# rear 7" spring
Stock front bar and delete rear bar.
shorter generic bump stops in the range of 36/46 F/R

not going to be stupid low, just looking for something around the 12.5"f 13" rear or so


any suggestions or critique?
anyone run stock front bar with no rear bar?
will i run into coil bind or spring unloading (uncaptured springs when raised are an instant unroadworhiness fine)
i simply dont have the cash for the fatwallet setup

Last edited by 4sfed5; 07-08-2014 at 02:28 AM.
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Old 07-07-2014, 10:38 PM   #4
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any takers?
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Old 07-08-2014, 03:08 AM   #5
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The ones I linked above aren't the cheapest anymore; there's no reason to buy that kit in particular. The one I ended up getting was $31 shipped off Amazon, but I guess they lost money on that sale since it's now $31 + $30 shipping.

Anyway, they're all going to be pretty much the same. They'll come with a selection of rubber O-rings to snug them up against various size shock bodies. None of them came even close to fitting between my Bilsteins and the sleeves, so if the Koni shock body really is enough smaller diameter that it could cause problems, you should be covered.

As for the spring and sway choices, you might want to play around with the FCM spreadsheet a bit. It looks like those spring rates will make for a very tail happy car at low speed, and according to Emilio disconnecting the rear bar will turn any Miata into an understeering pig at high speed. Also, if this is an NA, those spring rates will give you the same bounce frequency front and rear, which is apparently a big no-no.

Currently, my plan is 8" 500# springs front, 7" 350# springs with 5" 75# tenders (possibly cut to 3") rear. Stock rear bar with a Racing Beat tubular FSB. Bumpstop lengths aren't decided yet, but they'll be OEM Honda parts at $6-12/corner depending on length.

So far I've spent $175 (MSM Bilsteins) + $31 (coilover sleeves), and soon I'll be buying front springs and rear tenders both at $60 shipped per pair. Bumpstops will be $35, give or take, and mounts should be doable for under $50 for the set. That brings the grand total for shocks to about $400, with revalving options between $100 (poverty DIY) and $400 (at a circle track shop). Is that skinnywallet enough for you?

Last edited by Failure; 07-08-2014 at 03:34 AM.
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Old 07-08-2014, 04:49 AM   #6
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yes plugging in the numbers it seems i may be better to with a 450/250 setup and keep the rear bar to give me 1810 roll stiffness and 59.5% FRC?
any one have experience with 450's on Koni's?
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Old 07-08-2014, 05:54 AM   #7
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That sounds like you're still trying to run with no rear sway bar. I'm pretty sure you don't want to do that.
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Old 07-08-2014, 06:50 AM   #8
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No ill keep the stock rear bar with that setupin the future ill add a bigger front bar and go for a higher rear rate i think. but for now i think im sold on the 450/250 with stock sways
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Old 07-08-2014, 10:53 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Failure View Post
and according to Emilio disconnecting the rear bar will turn any Miata into an understeering pig at high speed.
Not exactly what I have stated. Disconnecting the rear bar creates a pitching moment which changes the roll center axis. This rake change causes it's own problems. Ditching the rear bar is an autocross band-aid mostly used by drivers that are limited elsewhere in the rules from doing what is needed to get the car set up right. No reason to do it on a track car unless there is some other set up or equipment problem that requires it.

So while it will generally make a Miata understeer, I have had customers that disconnected the rear bar and still had oversteer because something else was really wrong on the car.
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Old 07-08-2014, 11:34 PM   #10
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Just a word of advice on those ebay Coilover kits...
I've got one sitting here in my living room.

And it'll stay there.

The sleeves have shallow threads on them, nothing at all like the AWR or Ground Control sleeves.

Now that I've seen them in person, I understand how they can come apart on people.

Your experiences might be different, but I was able to pick up a set of AWRs for about $100. Well worth the extra $80 for a solidly built piece.
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Old 07-24-2014, 04:35 PM   #11
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Old 07-24-2014, 06:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SchmoozerJoe View Post
Now that I've seen them in person, I understand how they can come apart on people.
Has this actually happened to anyone? I don't think I've read a single report of a sleeve failing, with any kit, on any car.
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Old 07-24-2014, 06:39 PM   #13
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My buddy had eGay coilovers on his Talon. Went over a good size speed bump one morning and CLUNK draaaaaaaaggggg. Sheared all of the threads off the aluminum collar.

He also abused the **** out of that poor car.
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Old 07-24-2014, 06:50 PM   #14
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Well then, I guess it can happen. Coil bind?
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Old 07-29-2014, 01:37 AM   #15
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I'm about ready to sell my GC sleeves, collars, eibach springs. 500, 375, 250 all pairs.
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Old 07-29-2014, 09:43 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4sfed5 View Post
looking at getting set up with a 2.5" spring set for my koni yellows.
400 pound qa1 7" fronts and eibach 275 pound rears 8".

looking at summit website there are 3 koni sleeve kits listed but all say 2.25" spring perch?

whats a good bang for buck sleeve setup and what top hat bumpstop should i use?
Allstar #ALL64146 is the 5" sleeve for 2.5" springs and #ALL64180 is the adjusting nut that goes with them. You'll need 4 of each and you can get them at Summit (and other places).

Not sure of the groove locations of Koni vs. Bilstein but you can read my writeup of them installed on MSM Bilsteins in this thread, post #217 ; https://www.miataturbo.net/suspensio...-78451/page11/

While there have been a few complaints of the ebay sleeves most seem to have no issues. Do you feel lucky?
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