The right Clutch
 

So I'm looking for a cheap Ebay clutch, stage 3 puck, but here is the issue. Which one is going to hold up? I'm looking for life experiances on which one is good, and which one to stay away from.

With the price of the Flyin' Miata Stage 1 clutch, it's hard to suggest anything else.

Consider the labor that's involved in replacing the clutch.
Now, consider doing it again because you got a shitty clutch.

Are the savings worth it?

And, how can you know that you got a good clutch from Ebay? Is there a phone number? Customer rep?
(And, as my own horror story goes, I got a clutch once from clowns called GripForce. They cheated me out of cash for two clutches, as the throughout bearing kept breaking (shitty pressure plate), and they kept blaming the installation).

Buyer, beware!

My Gripforce 6 puck is holding up very well to daily abuse. It seems hit or miss, but I suggest inspecting everything carefully before installation. My pressure plate was a painted exedy so no question about quality, but the TOB seemed a little cheesy and I will no doubt be forced to replace it in the future, but other than that, no complaints.

I will have to go with FM. Not only do I feel that is one of my favorite purchases I have made for my car (the turboz is #1 of course) but it was one of the least expensive. After driving a Suby with a stock clutch around for a week I thought there was something wrong with mine, the pedal is so light with the FM L1, I love it.

No experience with ebay stuff, but I know there are guys using them.

Yeah.
My PP from Gripclowns was also Exedy. After the second clutch, I replaced it with used stock, and was happy.

My FM setup has no markings, and, up until I had to yank the engine off, I have had zero (0), none, nada, problems with it (pilot bearing got stuck).

And, it's kinda comforting to know that if there's ever an issue, Bill or Keith would expedite a replacement pronto.

I bought a cheap ass ebay clutch for maybe a hundred bucks. (Not the puck variety, see note below)
Then I got worried about it and ordered a spec stage 2.5.

By the time spec arrived, the cheapo was in already. (labor rate where I live is negligible)
I thought I should give the cheapo a chance and left it in.
It is still there, doing its job without slipping, despite all the abuse, track days, hard launches and numerous dyno sessions for the past year.
I think it was a gripforce.
Pedal is soft, btw.

*I was told so stay away from puck setups. Apparently they have no progressive engagement, they are on or off. Would be an interesting experience in stop and go traffic.

My sprung 6 puck has excellent street manners. I daily it in super shitty Seattle traffic without issue.

Edit: I think a lot of the negative press on puck clutches comes from unsprung 4 & 6 puck clutches with heavier pressure plates than we tend to use in miatas (ACT 2600/3200 # PPs come to mind).

Having said that, I have driven an AWD DSM with an unsprung 6 puck disk and a 2600#pp in traffic before and I really didn't find it that bad. It isn't buttery smooth like a stock clutch, but at no point did I feel like I was going to go rocketing off into the ass end of someones car.

I've been in Seattle maybe 10 times, and believe me, the traffic is nothing compared to Istanbul.
There are times when you just inch the car every few minutes.
And the city is pretty much like San Fransisco. Really hilly.

I have the f1 6puck from ebay. Not sure if this is the same seller, LINK.

It has been holding up fine for a couple years now. Pretty sure levnubhin is still running the same clutch in his beast. Others have used it as well.

eBay f1 here for the last 2 years and holding 270 ft lbs torque.
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My friend had that ebay F1 clutch. It didn't last one year I think those are hit and miss to.

So what you all are saying is that it is possible to run a cheap F1 ebay clutch and chance having a prob. LOL well good enough for me. My Miata basically only comes out of the shop on really nice days, and to touch the track. NOT A DAILY. I have another matching daily. LOL Stock non turbo.

I know right?! A clutch that's only $350, feels & engages like stock, but can hold over 320TQ!

Pick a witty response:

1. And here I paid $300 for my ACT with a 10% coupon, engages low and awkward, and it can only hold 200TQ. (1.8L equivalent = $390 & 233TQ)

2. And here I paid $325 for my Clutchnet 2x 6-puck with a Group Buy special, failed to disengage after installation and only worked after then buying another ACT HD PP, it engages fast and annoying, and it can only hold 260TQ. (1.8L equivalent = $355 & 298TQ)

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Okay, stock organ's won't hold for shit. Even a stage 1. I ran one of those years ago when I first started tuning. Pile of junk. I went to a stage two Kevlar and it did great to around 200 RWHP. But for safetys sake, and so you don't have to pull your tranny all the time, go with Brains idea and do either a Flyin miata kit, or a puck. And as far as flywheels go the stock one is great to keep force up when it comes to shifting, but I went with a 8 LBS and a stage 3 puck. I love it other then in parking lots, speed bumps, or 20 MPH zones. You have to learn to drive your car again!!!

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Its good to hear that the F1 clutch holds up. Because that's me pretty soon. I have to be cheap now, since I have two DIYPNP's. :crx:

i had my friend blow his f1 clutch in 6 months,, after that he got what i told him to get and what i have, ACT.. because after 3 years of daily driving and , hard nasty driving it still was good as new.. oh that with 220whp and 198wtq. you get what you pay for, or some times you get a lucky good one that works and is cheap,, maybe the new FM option is good and cheaper.

Its true, some work for days,weeks and months. Others will work for years. Two of my friends run Gripforce F1 Stage 3 pucks, and swear by them. Day to day they work, and I'm talking stupid crazy drivers that ride their clutches. So my two cents say they're good, but others might not agree. I just popped mine in, and so far so good, but I don't drive like them. I have a stage2 in my daily that works great. But its not a turbo, and now my turbo (track car) has the stage 3 6 puck with a 8 LBS or so Flywheels. I mean its cheap so if it goes out whatever. I have a feeling it will hold up like most others, and my friends.

But what do I know??? I'm just a redneck!!!

Buy a stock 1.8 for cheap and put it in. I think used ones go for around $40. Then buy an FM1 clutch and enjoy yourself.

Agreed

real men have two clutch discs.

Yeah but most of us are on a beer budget!! So we have to shop on ebay. But luckly we have tried this stuff and can tell people what works

Having done a clutch job 4 times after the Gripforce fiasco (just search on m.net, I'm too lazy to post up a link), I will NEVER buy something that takes that much time and effort to install on Ebay.

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I had a Gripforce stage 3 puck clutch on my 90 (no turbo), I was chattery, but effective.

I'm hoping to make 300+ HP with this build in my 97...flying miata happy meal going in (better safe then sorry)

Quality is as much about consistency as about having some good ones. If it's a roll of the dice whether any given example is going to be good or crap, then the whole part stream is rejectable. You can set up some kind of 100 percent inspection, if you can identify the characteristics that matter. That's expensive, and you have to know what to look for, and you have to be able to sort multiple parts. And you end up with a pile of rejects that you spent the money to build and then inspect. Most of the industrialized world that is actually aiming at quality has figured out that it's much cheaper to control processes and ensure consistent production output.

Across multiple vehicles, it's better to buy from a consistent source. On one vehicle, you may choose to roll the dice, but be prepared to lose your bet.

very wise and effective

alright i am in need of a new clutch too on a budget for now, probably going with the F1 stage 1 rated to like 270 HP. Im confused do i need to replace the flywheel too, if Im going cheap should i just get the clutch and flywheel combo on ebay. or would it be cheaper to get the stock flywheel resurfaced. My clutch now is pretty shot.

flywheel will be fine unless it has some inordinate damage on it.

F1 stage 3 here going on 4 weeks and I LOVE it. Can't beat it for $160 Its in my NA DD 2000

Make sure to turn your flywheel.

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i think he means to resurface, as in turning on a lathe or machine? ya i found a local shop that can do that, ordered the F1 stage 2 clutch today and i'll report back once it gets installed

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I dont understand the need for puck clutches on these cars. A standard disk usually has less chatter, weighs about the same, enages very linearly, and will handle the torque that the vast majority of us put down. I guess a puck might do better under really high heat loads, but AFAIK the time to worry about that is on repeated drag launchs. On a road course or AutoX, your launching maybe once, then it is shifting, usually as quickly as possible which means little in the way of heat load on the clutch due to very little slipage.

So why get a puck?

I"ll sell my balanced and lightened factory 1.8 flywheel for $90 + shipping.
No need to resurface.
2.5# ridge on the back has been removed.
Includes factory flywheel bolts.

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What are stock 1.8 clutches reported to hold? I've had mine in my car for nearly 2 years and it holds 12psi just fine, although I pretty much just run wastegate at this point (9psi) and its never slipped or given me any trouble. For 100 bucks its tough to beat if you're not going to be pushing 225hp+. I'm just curious at what point its suppose to start slipping.

Well I started slippin my stock clutch at 6 psi. The Stage one held to about 10-12psi. But I'm stupid to be running 14+ PSI. FYI my track car only see's the track. Its luck to get out of 3rd gear off the trailer. My daily that isn't turbo I have a stage 2, but thats just a high comp weekend car.

I run a track only 1.8 94 miata with bell engineering series 3 turbo kit on a stock clutch which is now slipping. I beleive it is putting down 175-200rwhp. From what I am gathering, Flyin Miata stage 2 is the way to go, but I am curious what kind of life expectancy you guys think a stocker would do. Its an HPDE only car, so it never sees stop and go, and except for odd transportation run or a quick hooligan ride, it only sees road courses.

Do you think the FM is necessary or can I get away with a stocker for the next 5k miles of road course driving?

Thanks for any reply's

Well I got my Stage 3 F1 clutch in last night. This morning I took it to the Autocross track. It seemed to be working fine the whole way there. I didn't boost up to high. When I hit the track I turned my boost up to 14 PSI like always. Right out of the gate it was slipping. I had to stay off the throttle the whole time. I turned the boost down to 10 PSI and it did alright. On the way home I could boost in 4 or 5th without it slipping. In a nut shell I think that the Clutches are as we all see hit and miss. But rest assured I'm GOING to get my money back.

Wait, so you didn't break it in at all, just strait to autocross? And it started slipping? Slick.

Yeah no break in. I didn't have the time. It can in yesterday at 4 pm, then in the car, then party all night till 430 am. Then up to race at 9:30. I mean break in shouldn't take long. The whole 500 mile thing is bull. I'm just trying to find out what my RWPH is? No dinos near by. FYI this is on my beater car. T-28 315 supra injects, Bipes and Begi, and Walbro 190 10psi street, 14 track. AEM wideband says its good and rich, sparks look good.

I think they call that an improper break in. You overheated the shit.

Myspeed123. You think brake pad glazing is bull too? Bed in your brakes, break in your clutch.

You better wait a few weeks before you call to get a refund.

And, based on that, you're not gonna see a single fucking penny.
More than that, even if you can prove to them that the clutch was broken in properly, they'll blame it on improper installation.

With FM, I never had to baby the thing, and it came with warranty. Plus, I know that if anything ever went wrong, FM will back their product up.

Good luck with yours! :squint:

I was considering using F-1's chromolly flywheel with their stage 1 clutch (I've seen these before on eBay and was tempted by their pricing, but was apprehensive - then I heard 949 retailed them and I thought that a forum friendly retailer's endorsement meant a degree of legitimacy).

I won't be boosting (I just join all miata forums for the R&D), but on other networks, they said you guys here used them alot. Perhaps the F-1 flywheel with the Exedy value clutch may be a more reliable selection.

Additionally, on 949's website, they suggested switching 1.8 clutch and flywheel components to the 200mm, lighter 1.6 parts to retain even less weight. I'm considering doing that too since I won't venture distantly from stock power.

Well after a heated battle with gripforce we found that the pressure plate was bad. They shipped me a whole new kit, and even sent me a solid stage3 rather then the sprung stage 3. we'll see what happens

Another vote for the FM Stage 1, got a couple thousand miles on mine and it's very comfortable.

Good thing they replaced it. Take it easy with the next one dude. Let us know how you like it, I'm still interested in the F1.

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I'd like to think so

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I searched for "F1 Miata Clutch" on Ebay and found a few results. Same stuff wherever you buy it. Up to you whether you want to support a particular vendor.

I have 1,000 miles on the F1 12lb CroMo flywheel and the FM1 clutch. So far so good.

If you want cheap, look into an Exedy heavy duty clutch. I suspect it will be a bit stiffer underfoot than the FM1.

16 miles on a new engine, and a F1 light flywheel with a Stage 3 puck. So far so good.

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It's not the torque that stresses it, it's the RPM. Forces trying to break it and energy stored (which is released if it does break) grow as the square of RPM.

Think of quality this way: We don't care nearly as much about the tens of thousands of plane flights that are completely uneventful as we do about the one flight that has a problem.

If you're the one whose flywheel explodes, you (and your passenger) are the one(s) in a position to lose your feet. People outside the car will probably be luckier, as it's likely to lose a lot of energy as it tears your car apart on the way out. How much do new feet cost? More than :2cents:.