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Old 08-26-2009, 02:54 AM   #1
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Default Signs of a dying torsen?

My friends 94 torsen has something like 249k miles of really terrible abuse on it. Saturday night we were out tuning and cruising around not even really driving the car very hard. Sunday morning he started to notice a slight hum coming from the rear end which has progressed into some really horrid whirring and a little rattling noise. It starts at a pretty slow roll but only progresses worse the faster you go.

Sunk to the lowest level and swapped out the torsen for a 1.6 open differential, axles and driveshaft.. When you turn the Torsen's axle output it seems to "slip" and doesn't always turn the other side. I haven't had a chance to really look close at it or tear it apart but I think its done. Is this a typical sign of the differential going out?
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Old 08-26-2009, 04:11 AM   #2
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Sounds like the gears are worn out, to be honest. Why not pull it apart?
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Old 08-26-2009, 10:57 AM   #3
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I abused one for nearly 300k and never had a problem with it. Sure it's not a dying tranny?

(oh the jokes)


Anyway. Remember that a torsen has to have some resisteance for it to work, so if you're spinning it in the air, the results will not be accurate.
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Old 08-26-2009, 11:30 AM   #4
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its probably making noise when he's going straight (ring-gear or trans) rather than when the tires are spinning at different speeds.

My old diff said "clunk-clunk-clunk" on the racetrack in low-speed, high-lateral load corners... then I laid it to rest.
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Old 08-26-2009, 08:47 PM   #5
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Well I've never been inside one of these but it looks okay for the most part... The ring gear has a lot of visible wear on it..






Dunno what to do from here.. We swapped in a 1.6 differential and the noise went away...

I'm almost thinking the bearings might be going out, but I didn't want to take it that far apart to find out tonight. Its really nasty outside and I don't have my workbench cleaned off in the basement. This is what we found though.
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Old 08-30-2009, 03:10 PM   #6
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Yeah it sounds like it's just bearings to me. If the torsen was dying I would expect metalic colored fluid or big chunks of metal.
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Old 08-30-2009, 05:56 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elesjuan View Post
Well I've never been inside one of these
(...)
I'm almost thinking the bearings might be going out, but I didn't want to take it that far apart to find out tonight
You don't want to take it that far apart at all, then. Getting these things set back up properly involves tea leaves and chicken blood. If you've never done one, don't learn on this one.

OTOH, the internals look fine. I don't see anything abnormal on the R&P or the center gears.
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Old 10-17-2009, 06:27 AM   #8
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Long story short had a "pro" look at it and take it apart input shaft bearings were toast gears are in great shape.

Well Had a highly recommended mechanic install new bearings seals and some other stuff in the diff, been on the car for a week and a half...guess what it exploded tonight leaving me stranded. Will have pics soon. Launched it at 3k rpm pretty horrid noise it made as diff fluid went everywhere luckily my buddy was able to push me enough to get on the shoulder of the road. Completely blew a hole through my carrier


Oh when I get up in the morning the phone call I make is not going to be a good one to the guy that installed all my new stuff.
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Old 10-17-2009, 07:57 AM   #9
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That is so shitty man so sorry for ya but they do last ages so its obvious its the new parts or his installation.
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Old 10-17-2009, 11:09 AM   #10
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That really sucks! I have an extra torsen but I have no time to remove it to post it for sale.
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Old 10-17-2009, 12:19 PM   #11
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lol he needs more than that he needs everything new agian there is a hole in his ****. tough breack man he probly set it up to tight.
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Old 10-17-2009, 12:34 PM   #12
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I call the guy today his response "well I never touched your gear set all I did was press the new bearings on, so if the new parts failed then its not really on me you could always go after mazda."

Can someone clarify for me what all is involved when someone installs new bearings, races and seals in a Torsen?

I knew it, I knew from day one I should have dropped that thing off at a real shop that specializes and knows miatas. AAH im kicking myself.
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Old 10-17-2009, 01:26 PM   #13
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If the Mazda parts routinely failed within a few thousand miles, your mechanic would have an argument. As it is, he is a dick without one.
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Old 10-17-2009, 01:30 PM   #14
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How about...his work failed, and lodged into the gearset...

Guy's got to be kidding...and work to any diff with all the pieces still in there will get you down the road much longer than a week and a half...that's ridiculous.

Let me see....you paid him...he touched it...it blew up.

+1 on "he's a dick without an argument".
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Old 10-17-2009, 11:51 PM   #15
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Waiting for my friend to email me the pictures he took today....so I pulled the diff back out again, pulled it apart maybe its just coincidence that it broke apart shortly after getting the new bearings.

Bearings he installed are in perfect shape the smaller gears on the other hand are not, two of them broke in half and in turn fucked up two more of the smaller ones but the rest of the gears look to be in good shape. So I am not real sure what to think.

Diff has 251k HARD miles on it...this last week and a half was the first time this diff has been run with the turbo...running an FM kit with Megasquirt at around 10lbs not sure what kind of power im putting down, I'm guessing somewhere in the 200-220 range. How much power can Torsens handle?

SINCE I DO NOT HAVE PICS AT THE MOMENT I WILL USE ONE FROM ABOVE TO SHOW WHAT BROKE.


Andy
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Old 10-21-2009, 12:21 AM   #16
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Old 10-21-2009, 12:56 AM   #17
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Well, that was fun while it lasted.
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Old 10-21-2009, 05:24 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gospeed81 View Post

Let me see....you paid him...he touched it...it blew up.

+1 on "he's a dick without an argument".

Sounds like he's got a pretty good argument to me:

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Originally Posted by crnrhrd View Post
Launched it at 3k rpm
Your mechanic put bearings in your diff, you launched it and blew up the LSD. I fail to see how it's even remotely his fault.
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Old 10-21-2009, 08:24 AM   #19
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Hmm....don't have a Torsen...so don't know....but thought they should hold up to that.

He did mention in the last post that it had 251K HARD miles. Combine that with abuse...and yeah, the mechanic has a point now.
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Old 10-21-2009, 10:58 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fahrvergnugen View Post
If the Mazda parts routinely failed within a few thousand miles, your mechanic would have an argument. As it is, he is a dick without one.
If this were a stock car, then he might not have a leg to stand upon. However, when you're pushing stock drivetrain parts well beyond stock levels, there's no promise or expectations of longevity.
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