Traction Bars - Miata Turbo Forum - Boost cars, acquire cats.

Welcome to Miataturbo.net   Members
 


Suspension, Brakes, Drivetrain discuss the wondrous effects of boost and your miata...

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-05-2009, 06:40 PM   #1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (7)
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Southern Indiana
Posts: 1,371
Total Cats: -1
Default Traction Bars

So, looking forward to a built motor project, I see wheel hop as a major issue. It was an issue n/a, it was a big issue when I ran a [email protected] and it will most likely be a major issue once I am finding the limits of my disco potato. I saw a while back where TravisR was talking about fabrication traction bars but I couldnt find much else on the subject. I have never been able to break my 60ft times out of the 2 second range due to wheel hop and it is killing my ET's.

My question is, how hard are they (traction bars) to fabricate and can these really be universal?
wes65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2009, 06:47 PM   #2
Hittin' Boost & Cones
iTrader: (2)
 
240_to_miata's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Cromwell, Connecticut
Posts: 2,572
Total Cats: 11
Default

"Fits cars and mini-trucks with leaf springs under the axle "

im not sure how you do traction bars on an independent multilink suspension... but that's not it
240_to_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2009, 06:48 PM   #3
y8s
2 Props,3 Dildos,& 1 Cat
iTrader: (8)
 
y8s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Fake Virginia
Posts: 19,038
Total Cats: 407
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcwhitey
Fits cars and mini-trucks with leaf springs under the axle
might require a minor conversion to your rear axle.

seriously though, I think the traction/slapper bar is a solution for a problem a miata will never have. since the diff is rigidly attached to the PPF and tranny, the diff cant "wind up" like a muscle car.
y8s is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2009, 06:50 PM   #4
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
patsmx5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 8,797
Total Cats: 248
Default

Those in your link are for cars with leaf springs. Won't work on a wishbone setup.

FWIW, I had terrible wheel hop. Always have. When I pulled the engine to turbo, I found my drivers side motor mount was broken in half. Switched it to the passengers side as that one was only slightly torn. So now I have a torn drivers side and broken passengers side. Made a big difference in wheel hop. I will 100% be buying some stiff *** motor mounts soon, and diff mounts too.

As for traction bars, I think Travis is working on some. If you want to build your own, get on m.net and search through the V8 section. There's a few guys there that have built some and reported good results with V8 power.
patsmx5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2009, 06:59 PM   #5
Senior Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (7)
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Southern Indiana
Posts: 1,371
Total Cats: -1
Default

Awesome. Thanks guys. I have a couple of connections with some good fabricators so I may do some research with the v8 guys and see if we can come up with a working solution.
wes65 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2009, 09:34 PM   #6
Guest
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Vaughan, On, Canada
Posts: 1,092
Total Cats: 0
Default

I'm hoping to get my car out of storage and into the shop to build some traction bar jigs. It is one of the main business lines for ETD (Welcome to ETDRacing.com 2.0) and therefore we would love to make some for the Miata also.
M-Tuned is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2009, 12:02 AM   #7
Elite Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,583
Total Cats: 8
Default

Well, as I've found out more about this, I read a couple of SAE research articles on it, read a book about it (carols), and I really don't think traction bars are the answer for an IRS. What you have to do is put a comprehensive kit together that works on alot of little things in the rear to kill the big problem. Traction bars will always degrade turning performance on an IRS suspension, and they have to be very carefully placed if you do use them on any car or you'll completely bind your suspension. So while you can bolt up a set of universal bars, they really arn't what you need, and you have to crunch alot of numbers to get any positive effect at all.
TravisR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2009, 12:11 AM   #8
I'm Miserable!
iTrader: (5)
 
bryantaylor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: jacksonville, fl
Posts: 1,720
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by patsmx5 View Post
FWIW, I had terrible wheel hop. Always have. When I pulled the engine to turbo, I found my drivers side motor mount was broken in half. Switched it to the passengers side as that one was only slightly torn. So now I have a torn drivers side and broken passengers side. Made a big difference in wheel hop. I will 100% be buying some stiff *** motor mounts soon, and diff mounts too.
i have never thought about it, but i have the MMR motor mounts only and i have NEVER had ANY wheelhop. so that makes sense
bryantaylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2009, 12:29 AM   #9
Elite Member
iTrader: (12)
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Hermosa Beach, CA
Posts: 2,575
Total Cats: 11
Default

we just need something to hold the diff in place, it is winding up because its not hard mounted to anything. When I went from rubber to poly diff mounts it REALLY helped, I get very little wheel hop now where as I used to get it ALL THE TIME.

that and making sure your shocks are not blown lol.
cardriverx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 08:40 PM   #10
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
AbeFM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 3,048
Total Cats: 8
Default

I am just about to put in some solidish diff mounts in - the MS engine mounts help I'm sure.

I thought the question was more a diff brace - something to grab the front and keep it from moving. that seems like it might be useful?
AbeFM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 08:59 PM   #11
Elite Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,583
Total Cats: 8
Default

Thats one of the things I"ve got in my kit. Thats a big key. Can't do a whole lot with the pumpkin floating up and down back there.
TravisR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 09:12 PM   #12
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
patsmx5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 8,797
Total Cats: 248
Default

On my 99' the tire will move forward over an inch on a hard launch. That's not just the diff winding up.....
patsmx5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 09:17 PM   #13
Elite Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,583
Total Cats: 8
Default

Thats a part not the whole thing
TravisR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 01:20 AM   #14
Elite Member
iTrader: (3)
 
AbeFM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 3,048
Total Cats: 8
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by patsmx5 View Post
On my 99' the tire will move forward over an inch on a hard launch. That's not just the diff winding up.....
Good lord!

On my tires, the car stays still, and so do the wheels. :-)

Where's this Kit, Travis? :-) Linkage!
AbeFM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 04:07 AM   #15
Senior Member
iTrader: (10)
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: South Eastern Wisconsin
Posts: 1,282
Total Cats: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by patsmx5 View Post
On my 99' the tire will move forward over an inch on a hard launch. That's not just the diff winding up.....
How the hell did you find that out?
ApexOnYou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 04:36 AM   #16
Elite Member
iTrader: (1)
 
NA6C-Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Birmingham Alabama
Posts: 8,038
Total Cats: 43
Default

Havent I seen a bar out there that bolts to the lower 2 bolts on the housing, and run to the rear subframe or something? I cant recall exactly how it looked ,but do recall seeing it. Dont remember the maker either. I also have a good bit of hop, but havent really gotten to try it out since new engine mounts. My old ones were fully ripped in half, so Im guessing it should be MUCH better now. Plus all new suspension bushings, so maybe that contributes to less suspension flex in the rear. Diff mounts will come when I get the 3.6 gear set.

Also, anybody ever used those PPF braces Ive seen out there for sale? I cant see how this would improve things much, but Trackdog claims a decent improvement.
NA6C-Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 06:40 AM   #17
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Grayslake IL
Posts: 410
Total Cats: 2
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by patsmx5 View Post
On my 99' the tire will move forward over an inch on a hard launch. That's not just the diff winding up.....
I watched my car do this while it was strapped down to a dyno. I was thinking either new rear control arms with heim joints or stiffer bushings would help out the most.
Aricjm15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 08:33 AM   #18
Junior Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Lansdale, PA
Posts: 462
Total Cats: 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NA6C-Guy View Post
Havent I seen a bar out there that bolts to the lower 2 bolts on the housing, and run to the rear subframe or something? I cant recall exactly how it looked ,but do recall seeing it. Dont remember the maker either. I also have a good bit of hop, but havent really gotten to try it out since new engine mounts. My old ones were fully ripped in half, so Im guessing it should be MUCH better now. Plus all new suspension bushings, so maybe that contributes to less suspension flex in the rear. Diff mounts will come when I get the 3.6 gear set.

Also, anybody ever used those PPF braces Ive seen out there for sale? I cant see how this would improve things much, but Trackdog claims a decent improvement.
This brace?

Miata BeatRush P.P.F. Performance Bar 1990-1997

BradC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 10:22 AM   #19
Elite Member
iTrader: (15)
 
patsmx5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 8,797
Total Cats: 248
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexOnYou View Post
How the hell did you find that out?
When I launched hard in 1st gear on the nitrous at the 1/8 mile, I could hear my drivers side tire "rubbing" the car's fender. After the run I have cuts in said tire and a damaged inner fender metal. I beat it in with a hammer but it still rubs on a very hard launch with 225's.
patsmx5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 11:32 AM   #20
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Head Wound City, CT
Posts: 215
Total Cats: 0
Default

The Beatrush PPF brace is a nice piece. Haven't been to the track since I installed it, so I don't know if it helps with wheel hop any...
MattEGTR is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Garrett Turbo, 1.8 Oil Pan, & Misc. Stuff nbdooey Miata parts for sale/trade 9 08-30-2017 10:50 PM
My solution for Oiltemp and Oilpressure input into Megasuirt (MS3) Zaphod MEGAsquirt 41 01-24-2016 01:25 PM
WTB HPDE miata - Texas Voltwings Cars for sale/trade 0 09-27-2015 07:40 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:19 AM.