Any recent 6ul rumors?
 

Rumors? Rumors? Potential release date? Anything ...

I hope to have my car on the road by June, and right now, the only set of 4x100 wheels I have are the OEM 14's with snows off of my '96 :giggle:

Given the suspension set up, the car really deserves some sticky 225's.

I'd really prefer 6ULs for many reasons (e.g., vendor, weight, quality control, aesthetics); however, the C3Ms are currently the only game in town.

So, again, any development rumors?

-Zach

I've been wondering the same thing. Doubt we'll get much in the way of concrete answers before end of May at the earliest.

225's will work on an 8" wheel, and I've been eyeing the Konigs on good-win. I'm having a tough time deciding between these:
Konig "WIDEOPEN" 25mm, 4x100 FULL ANODIZED SILVER for Miata, 15x8

and these:
Konig WIDEOPEN 20mm, 4x100, 13.6 pounds- MACHINED LIP for Miata, 15x8

Why not either of the two new wheels good-win has been advertising? The Advanti one is super light and has a high load rating. I also like the way it looks.

I don't -- I think they're way too ricey.

This ... sort of. As an object, I think the wheels are nicely designed. This said, I feel the miata looks better with a simpler design.

-Zach

+1 on wideopens if you are exploring other options. I love mine, pretty light (not quite 6ul status though), good looking, and I love how they fit my car with the 15x8 +25 selection.

https://www.miataturbo.net/attachmen...ine=1396486378

At this point, I'm pretty much set on Konig Wide Opens or Flatouts in 15x8. Lot's of tire options for these wheels.

With this offset, are NA's "stuck" running a 205/50?

Seems I can get black Flatouts + 205 direzza's for <$900 ... seems like a tastey proposition.

-Zach

I ponied up for the new Jongbloeds in 15x9. Hopefully will see them by the end of the month. +1 on checking out Goodwin. He's got a ton of wheels in 15x8 and 15x9 on his site.

Last time I talked to Emilio about it, he said no commitments but end of Summer . . . maybe. I think with the added competition in the 15x9 size, the new 6UL will have a flow-formed rim -- and it might be taking some time to get that engineered to Emilio's satisfaction (pure conjecture on my part BTW). OTOH, he may just be too busy kicking a$$ on track. ;)

Very stoked to see em. What's the offset? The only picture i saw of x9's was on a red NB and it looked like they had a bit too much poke to be able to fit any super wide rubber on them. And the NA chassis is harder to fit rubber under as well.

It all depends on the offset though, either way.. in for results.

Offset is either +35 or +36. The same or nearly the same as 6ul's. I'm still going to get on the waiting list for 6ul's once Emilio allows it. I'm planning to consume my consumables . . . :D

The red car already has "rolled" fenders (as only the PO could do it, LOL).

Gen 4 6UL's wil have rotary forged rims and probably cost less than gen 3's, be significantly lighter and have a load rating 10% over industry standard. We'll call that standard spec949. Catchy? We are hoping to have 15x8's and 9's towards the end of this year. Far too early to take orders, estimate ship dates or provide any specific technical details. Yes, it will look the same save for a few detail difference from the diet the wheel is being put on.

On one hand, I'm flattered that an entire cottage industry has popped up around the unique fitments I pioneered 6 years ago. OTOH, it sucks that I have to battle for market share with other companies using my innovations. What's cool now is that rotary forging has become so affordable that I can add that neat tech and not need to raise the price on the wheel.

Many more sizes on the horizon. Not one of which I will announce before we have tooling ready and certification complete. Learned my lesson after having every single fitment I have done copied by at least two other wheel companies, some before I even got mine into production. doh

The only weapon I have to combat this relentless copying of unprotectable information is to continue to innovate faster than it can be copied. So that's what I'll do.

The only reason I was even considering the other wheels is because the 6UL was out of stock. Your place in the market seems pretty secure to me.

I echo the above. Emilio, if you have 'em, we'll buy 'em.

You could do a 36.5 offset :)

Funny you should say that. We actually toyed with the idea of mislabeling a particular and carefully engineered new fitment. When all the copies ate holes in the tires and destroyed fenders, there might be a bit of hesitation for anyone to jump on the bandwagon next time.

Big picture though, it's just how things are. I often explain it this way. say I popularized shoes in 3/4 sizes because they fit peoples feet better. I can't patent a size. It gets copied and I have to move on to the next idea. Using the shoe analogy, Skechers has made a billion dollar business (one of the worlds largest) in barely 20 years by openly stealing current industry leading designs and recreating it in cheap knockoffs. Americans buy them up never even having seen the originals. Skechers is an 800lb gorilla that Nike and Adidas worry about. Not a single damn original idea there.

So what does that say about stealing IP an making a business of copying other peoples work? It says that it's a pretty good business model, shameless and of questionable ethics though it may be.

The 6UL is dead. Long live the 6UL!

Love. :party:

I couldn't wait for availability for my most recent wheel purchase, but I will need a 3rd set of wheels, so I'll plan on the Gen4.

Cash in hand waiting for those gen4's. :)

always makes me laugh to see people saying "cash in hand" like that actually means something these days

he'll take a card, or paypal, or any other sort of payment just as well lol

You know a thread is gonna be good when ethics are brought up.

In for 15x10.5's and 15x11's.........I'm begging :)

Eric, you are totally hardcore!! Props.

I'll play devil's advocate here. People like Sketchers keeps the Nikes of the world innovating and keeps the prices down. Win/win for the consumers as long it doesn't drive the Nikes of the world out of business.

TBH the biggest problem you have isn't people knocking you off, it's not having parts in stock. I wanted a set of 15x8 6ULs a couple years ago but couldn't wait 3 months so I ended up with a set of TRs. I want to make the jump to 15x9s soon and I'm trying to wait for the Gen 4s so I don't settle again but when this set of tires is done I'm buying something. I can't buy what isn't available. :2cents:

Bogart...

I'm in the shoe biz - how do you know about Sketchers? You are right, they make cheap copies and they are good at it.

Suggestion - applying for a patent is cheap and no one has access to your filing for at least a year (and longer if you only want to file in the US). You then have patent pending status until the patent issues (or does not). In the meantime, your competition has to make a decision - if they copy you, and for some reason, your patent issues then you can pound them. Best case (if you can't get a patent or design patent on wheels) you may be able to buy yourself a year or more of time ahead of your competition. Worst case, your competition is always looking over their shoulder, worrying about what happens tom them, if your patent ever issues. Provisional patent filings are dirt cheap and get you pat. pend. status.

Could you patent something as simple as a particular wheel size and offset?

Emilio, your 6ul definitely is a game changer. Light, innovative and looks superb. Not sure if anyone can compare. As long as companies stays true to their valued clients, doesn't matter if someone else copies them, clients will remain loyal.

Pllleeeaaasssseeee let us know on the first batch. The community is literally on our knees awaiting the new gen lol. And everyone who has the previous won't let them go either!

No. But, my point was that once you file, your claims are confidential. Emilio knows what innovations (such as manufacturing processes, material, structure, or even a design...) may possibly be novel and what to claim. His competitors have no idea what he may claim in a patent application. He just marks the boxes with "Patent Pending". Are they going to take a risk knocking him off, not knowing what he is claiming in his pending patent? This, at a minimum, could buy you some time to sell his product without being copied.

I have 2 sets of 15x10s I will let go of after the new wheels are built.

Wait... if apples was able to sue samsung over the phones being shaped the same as a patent you might very well be able to do so with a specific wheel size. Might just need a league of lawyers lol seems legit

Lol I'll just hop on the gen4 train hahaha

I always thought it was more a of a china problem. He has a design patent no one is copying the 6UL directly.

No, 949 identified a need in the market for a wider wheel. Built it. Then other companies did the same thing. There's nothing proprietary about a offset or size. No one directly copied the design. At first there was just TR now there is 5 different 15x9 wheels.

949 is a fantastic company and very innovative but the things you create you must keep in stock or customers will go elsewhere. wheels, coilovers (now a higher rate ohlins availble for $2700) and whatever else people want and can't get.

Not to sidetrack the topic too much but at this point we seem to be more at a loss for wider rubber. While the stretch is fine on 15x9, wouldn't we be better off with 235-255 width rubber?

It's not a China problem. Companies all over the world have their goods manufactured in China - to compete on price. If China were not the world's manufacturer, popular items would be knocked off somewhere else.

No one may be knocking off the 6UL directly. But, the IP strategy I mentioned above may give Emilio some breathing room. A patent pending will work better than no IP at all.

As a product designer, I can assure you a design patent would do little good in this situation, whether it's pending or not. Design patents are designed to cover primarily aesthetic implementations (though, if you're clever you can utilize a design patent to provide some IP for utility). His competition isn't "knocking off" the 6UL aesthetically, therefor his design patent is doing it's job (assuming he has one). The competition is simply using a size/offset which the 6UL popularized on miata platform. If he could get a utility patent for the size/offset then he'd seal the market up, but it's simply not viable.

I just don't see a way to seal up IP around offset/size.

-Zach

I wasn't referring to the new 949s unless by some chance he makes a 15x11 and they are ever available. By then it won't matter.

Copies aren't the real problem. The constant lack of wheel stock is.

I think the lack of wheel stock is a huge problem. There have been a few times in the past that I have had cash ready to buy a set of 6UL's and they were not available. So I took that cash and spent it on other things. I understand that keeping inventory costs a large amount to store them, but I don't only want to buy rims during 2 seasons of the year.

FTFY


I have wanted to buy them for every car I have owned with 4x100 bolt pattern but every time they are out of stock.

This.


They're out of stock 80% or more of the year. That's a lot of time to just go ahead and make the decision to "settle" for something else.

Future 6UL availability
 

Trust me guys, no one feels that pain of no inventory more acutely than me. I have simply not found the right manufacturing partner until now. I held out starting up with two other factories that made offers Q2 2013, to get to a particular partner that can provide what we need, when we need it for Q3/14. Once we get the new machine up to speed, we should finally be able to release the new fitments and maintain continuous production. That has always been my intention. From starting in my garage selling used OEM wheels in 2005 to now, much has changed! No promises but, I feel we can finally meet continuous and spot demand once we're in production with a given tool.

It has been a profound experience to have so many enthusiasts, over so many marques, driving styles, demographics, continents connect with our brand and what we represent that they are willing to wait for the shiny car toys we offer.

Waiting for the 949spec turbo energy recovery system crate engine :D

In for 949 SuperMiata KERs

I've bought 6 sets of 6 UL's between 8's, 9's, and 10's and always it was a timing issue between fitting it in my budget and actually waiting for them to be in stock.

Money leaves my wallet a lot faster however if I can buy stuff as soon as I have money burning a hole in my pocket and not have to wait for it to be in stock to feel th gratification of spending it.

Did I mention......In for 15x10.5's and 15x11's? Just wanted to make sure that was out there. I want 2 sets....yesterday....cash in hand :)

With the huge new flares on my track car, I would like some of these as well. I do remember in an old thread from a couple of years ago, Emilio mentioned having a discussion with a Hoosier tire engineer about 15x11s for the 275 A6/R6 and being told by Hoosier it would not make any performance difference over a 15x10. He was considering release of a 15x11 IIRC.

Then again the clubroadster madtyteyo crew might like them for stretching the crap out of a 225. But then again, they will want stupid offsets.

It would be interesting to get some cheap Arrow or Barnett steelies and perform a stopwatch comparison between a 15x11 and a 15x10.

(bring this back a bit)
a while ago there was discussion and mention of new wheels in similar fitment, different look to the 6UL (ie the REV8). Are those thoughts dead now with all the cheaper competition??

No. Just a very low priority now.